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[Advice Needed] How do I go through the corners faster?

Discussion in 'Assetto Corsa' started by acrox999, Jul 19, 2017.

  1. acrox999

    acrox999

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    Hello RaceDepartment.

    I recently this week started playing Assetto Corsa for real and I must say I'm having a lot of fun with it. I've always loved racing games but I'm a very slow driver and simracing is like a whole different league for me.

    Upon many laps with the Nissan GTR GT3 on Imola I figured that I could actually go through the corners with much less braking and simply controlling the throttle. But still, I'm not used to it as I've always been playing it very safely and applied a lot of brake, making sure that I can go through the corners as safely as possible.

    Now here's the goal that I have in mind, on some corners, I could go much faster and setting a whole new record. One thing that I noticed is that I might also be kind of slow in giving response towards the corners, especially during entering them. I seem to enter them at a much later time than I should, forcing me to apply more brakes to stay on track and effectively slowing me down.

    I have a full clip of my replay of my fastest valid time, which was 1:51.91. I'd very much appreciate it if any of you could point out how I missed the crucial lines and how I should control my braking and throttle better. Not everywhere, just the most crucial that I'd benefit the most to improve my technique would be enough.


    That's my biggest achievement throughout my whole simracing experience. Making a lap with a GT3 car smoothly. Somewhat. And of course, with the help of the game's racing line.

    My goal is to improve my technique which will of course leads to better times and results. I did my best to improve my technique but as I go faster than I did in this video, I simply crashes the car all of the time.

    Anyway, I appreciate any inputs and criticisms. Thank you very much! I will do my best to improve myself.

    EDIT: Oh yeah, what about my shifting? It's really terrible right now IMHO.
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2017
  2. Brandon Wright

    Brandon Wright
    I may not be fast, but I'm wide! Premium

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    Your lap actually looks pretty good IMO. Now you just need practice, practice, practice. Turn the driving line off as soon as you're comfortable so you start attacking the track by instinct (the driving line isn't always that accurate). Just keep pushing a little more and a little more, lap after lap, and you'll start to notice improvements. It's not something that will happen over night though, find a car/track combo you're comfortable with and just keep doing it as often as you can, push a little more each time, until it becomes instinct. Don't worry about spinning occasionally, if you don't spin from time to time it means you're not pushing hard enough.

    Your shifting looks pretty good, especially your downshifting. You could probably upshift a little sooner, you're using Sidekick and when it flashes yellow that is the optimal shift point for that car. If it goes red you've waited a little too long to shift.

    This video is really old but everything in it is still relevant and can be applied to sim racing. Might help you out a bit.

     
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  3. BhZ

    BhZ
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    I'm gonna do a list of what you'd need to improve, don't take it too bad since everyone started from here and you will improve as anyone else.
    - As you can see at the start of the video, for the first turn you brake very early, then leave the brake, then realise you are still too fast and so you apply the brake again. That's something that should never happen. You brake at around 200 meters, you noticed it's too early, so try to brake at 150 and see if you go long or if it's still to early (i can already tell you that it's way too early.
    - If you have a left turn, stay on the right side of the track. It will be easier to hit the apex and you will be able to carry more speed.
    - You often apply 60-70% of your throttle on the straight...push it to the limit, don't be scared of going too fast...you won't have to pay for the damage on your car in case you crash.
    - The upshift is quite good, possibly a little earlier. On the other hand, the downshift is quite poor. The earlier you downshift, the more you brake (easy way to explain it), so you want to downshift as soon as you can.

    I might have time during the week to get in my server with you and help you for a while and see if you can improve a little.
     
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  4. Trezoitao38

    Trezoitao38

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    This line made by Kunos seems very wrong to me.

    Disable it, and try to learn from someone else on youtube with a good laptime.

    A good example:

     
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  5. Michael Hornbuckle

    Michael Hornbuckle

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    My advice for beginners:
    Start simple.
    Take the Alfa Romeo 4c to Magione in practice mode. Turn off all apps, especially the driving line.
    Don't try to go fast, only try to learn the track. (it is short and very easy to memorize)
    This might only take an hour or it might take a couple days, but keep making slow laps. The only objective is to learn the track layout and not spin out or go off. Once you can comfortably make three or four consecutive laps without spinning out or pushing off track you will be ready to 'race' your ghost in Hotlap mode. Once you are fully comfortable with the track layout along with driving the car under full control at slow speeds you can start experimenting with different braking points and lines through the turns and such by seeing where you gain/lose time against your own ghost.

    Good luck, have fun, be patient.
     
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  6. BhZ

    BhZ
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    Not exactly the easiest of the cars to go on track...i'd avoid road cars at first. The most grip, the better...possibly with abs and tcs just to learn lines.
     
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  7. Kasti

    Kasti

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    Or start with a classic touring car like Alfa GTA or Ford Escort. No aero, no electronic gimmicks, simply a car to drive.
     
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  8. BhZ

    BhZ
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    They lack of precision. He needs to learn the driving style first and a car "on rails" is the best thing for that. On the cars you mentioned he'd have to care for heel and toe, brake temp, oversteer...way too much stuff to focus on. I teached some friends to drive and i used the tatuus. I believe that's one of the best car to do so.
     
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  9. Kasti

    Kasti

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    That´s the fast and easy way. Good, if he wants to be fast only on modern electronics cars.

    But he will have a real bad surprise, if he ever tries one of the classic icons like Lotus 49, Cobra, Gt 40, 917 or the monster 917/30. He will get frustrated very soon - missing a lots of fun, especially on classic tracks(Did I mention to pull off all ingame helpers? manual shifting.). It will be really hard at the start, much more work to do, but it means learning the roots and permanently improvement and it´s so cool to keep those beasts on the track.

    Everybody who is able to control a 917, will have no trouble be very soon faster on more modern cars. But I agree, it is the hard,very time expansive way. It means a lot of frustration in first - but the time will come, and you get it. For example I myself improved my laptime with a Huaracan GT3 on Nurburgring GP, after my learn time with the classics, 5,5 seconds in the 3rd lap after coming out the pits... i couldn`t believe it.(but GT3´s seem to be a little easy to drive- now I`m more used to cars like those mentioned before or Mazda 787B or 962, 911GT1 or Maserati MC 12... can`t wait for 330P4 and the 312/67.)

    You can do it both ways, everybody should choose himself, keeping in mind his long term goals.;)
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2017
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  10. BhZ

    BhZ
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    The point is not to be a perfect driver. The point is learning and making it the easy as possible so that he and whoever is helping him doesn't lose his patience. If he can't even brake properly, you can't give him some of the hardest car in AC. If you have to explain to him the racing line, braking, accelerating, turning, heel and toe, manual shifting, general driving tips, maybe even setup his head will simply explode and if he has to care for all that stuff at the same time, he won't learn one of those things. I don't see kids starting from engineering and then learning the basics of math. This is the same concept.
     
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  11. Kasti

    Kasti

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    Heads don`t explode so easy... have a little trust in people;)

    The problem about learning with all the little helpers is: you don`t learn the basics, it`s an shortcut and you have to pay the price for it later. "don't see kids starting from engineering and then learning the basics of math" the easy way does exactly this, it never shows the basics, it only shows them how tu use the machine doing things for them.

    It´s like starting to teach him math with using a computer... doing all the work for him and then cut off the power and tell him: now calculate with your brain. Ooooops, what to do now?

    I never mentioned to start with a 917(this will end in a crash festival), we are talking above relativly low powered cars like GTA and Escort, they are quite easy to handle, after a little, little training. And they are very precise, if you treat them right.;)

    It´s sad but it´s true: Before even thinking about laptimes... you have to go and learn to control the car. Learn to control acceleration, braking, steering, shifting. Next go to an easy track and learn when to have to break, when and how hard to accelerate, to use the whole width of the track and the lines. After all this go to set up and such things, learn why the car under- or oversteers. When electronics is doing it, you never really learn it. Of course this takes lots of time, learning theoretics and "blood, sweat and tears". That´s why in RL karting is so essential. But the refund will be worth it.

    We are advocates of two opposite philosophies - he has to choose for himself, which one he chooses. And we are good advocates with strong arguments... poor guy.:D
     
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  12. acrox999

    acrox999

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    Thank you for your responses everyone.

    I usually don't use the racing line as I find AC's lines a little bit annoying as it's not dynamic and misleading me about the braking points. The markers-- What do you call those things like a countdown of meters before the corners? I'm learning to make use of that. I'm not good at it yet but I'm learning. I need to learn which point should I start braking depending on the curve of the corners, is that right? I usually brake at around 50-100m but having to downshift and controlling the car at the same time, they sometimes confuse me.


    I tried to go flat out with the car a lot of times but almost all the time I do after corners, I'd spin and crash. I actually crashed tons of times before making this lap. You can see that my previous time before this one was more than 3 seconds. :p I thought I'm losing patience but then I watched my replays again and that motivated me even more to try harder. :D

    This lap was actually made before I had Sidekick installed. I read that Sidekick is good to get an accurate timing and also to find the optimal shifting range. So I did that to see how my shifting was during this lap. My wheel have the LEDs but I still do not know when to shift according to the LED. Another thing to learn it seems, I tend to just go by the sound of the engine lol. :p Downshifting at the right time with the right timing is also something that I need to improve a lot.

    Now, about the car this was actually more like a one time thing. A fast race car isn't something that I always drive in the game, in fact, rarely. Almost all of the time were me cruising and trying to memorise and understand a track with slow or road cars. My favourite cars right now are the Mazda RX-7 Spirit R and Honda Civic Type R EK 9. I always set my limit to cars below 300HP and almost always manual using the H-shifter. I still have a lot to learn with it especially doing the heel-toe thing. I can do the blipping thing but not with the heel-toe technique. Manual cars are much for fun to drive and learn IMHO. I like the 90's Japanese cars and I drive them most of the time in the game. A lot of the modded Japanese cars are drift cars though, which is kinda disappointing because I just want close to real road cars.

    Again, thank you for the responses. I also appreciate the interesting discussion about the cars and what I should do for starters. I don't mind at all learning all those stuff. I don't get to play the game a lot but I'd say for almost all of the accumulated 30 hours spent in the game since it was bought more than a year ago was totally worth it even though I was simply driving slowly and correcting my mistakes. I don't plan on racing yet, I simply want to keep improving for now. I prefer to go alone in game and forget everything about real life stuff for a while.

    Also, thank you @Trezoitao38 and @Brandon Wright for the videos. I will surely watch them when I get the time later today.
     
  13. Michael Hornbuckle

    Michael Hornbuckle

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    Trying to learn to heel/toe while also trying to learn about optimal shift points while not knowing where/how to properly brake and hit the apex is like trying to learn Calculus before knowing how to add and subtract. Same thing with trying to use a GT3 car to learn the basics.

    I recommended the Alfa 4c because it is quick enough to be fun, yet 'simple' enough to be noob friendly. I am one of the biggest 'save the manual' guys around, but for learning the basics you want to keep things as simple as possible and a flappy paddle shift car will allow you to concentrate on shift points rather than having to focus on learning to heel/toe.

    What wheel/pedals/shifter are you using?
     
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  14. acrox999

    acrox999

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    I'm using the Fanatec CSW V2 + CSP V3 and the Thrustmaster TH8A shifter. I got it as gift from my uncle who just don't have the time to play the games at all. It's what got me into simracing anyway.

    I understand that learning to heel toe first before knowing how to brake is a waste of time. So I didn't, instead I do it normally and focus more on the braking points. The only thing that makes it hard is that the shifter is clamped to the table making it quite far away from me.

    Sometimes I feel like trying to learn the heel toe technique but I figured I still have a long way to go. Thanks for suggesting the Alfa 4c, I'll be sure to try it out today.
     
  15. Michael Hornbuckle

    Michael Hornbuckle

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    Take my advice and make laps at Magione with a lower powered, RWD paddle shift car. Once you know the track switch to hotlap mode and start racing your ghost. Once you are comfortable with making laps and have a decent idea of where to brake and turn, then it will be time to pick an H-pattern car and start practicing with it.

    Becoming a competent sim-driver/simracer doesn't happen overnight, it takes lots and lots of practice.
     
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  16. acrox999

    acrox999

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    I'll be sure to do that. Thanks. I also noticed racing my own ghost made it much easier for me to see the mistakes that I made and I can see where I can improve right away.

    I'm going to take it slow and real good this time. A semi-pro simracer that I know personally told me for beginners, the point is not to go as fast as you can but to master the track and complete it without making any mistakes.

    I'll practice a lot more without forgetting to have fun as well. Or else my head might really explode like Bhz said. :D
     
  17. Kasti

    Kasti

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  18. acrox999

    acrox999

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    That's awesome. Totally. Thanks a lot, I'll be sure to go through them.
     
  19. Kasti

    Kasti

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    Have fun!
    Between all discussions about how to drive the right way- this is why we do sim racing - to have fun.;)

    And with a little practice, you will see, cars above 300 HP could give you lot of fun and that the RX7´s big brother 787B is a real cool screamer and driving it could be racers heaven.:D
     
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  20. Feco

    Feco
    You can sleep in a car, but you can't race a house Premium

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    As soon as you feel confortable with the game, turn yourself a premium member and join the club races. I've been racing for 2 or 3 weeks and it is beeing the best way to improve my racing skills.
    And you will have tons of fun, for sure.
     
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