Why are DD wheels so powerful?

[Boby Kim]

Why are DD wheels so powerful? They can breaks your hands and come with an emergency stop button. Hence they are so expensive. I run a TS-PC fairly light (75% in TM software) en around 50% in game settings, as i learned that it is all about the fidelity of the forces, not the strength of the force.
So i would like to have a DD wheel with the max strength of a consumer wheel like to TS-PC for the same money. Why arent those DD wheels made?

 

[blekenbleu]

Which wheel bases are these

DD1?

not only, as test you could let your hands drag on the wheel as it is doing its rotation, not too much pressure.
In my experience it will affect how your wheel perform, hence a calibration is happening, determining strength of electrical current, but not only, feeling is also different, not just strength.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

DD1?

Interesting, is that the wheel Cote Dazur was referencing to in his post?

 

[Emery]

We agree speed and details, but do we need 20 nm electric motors to achieve it, or is a less than 10 nm electric motor more than sufficient?

If you want to match Indycar steering effort 1:1 or any other high downforce car without power assist, then 27 nm is required. Also, you need headroom on the torque figure to avoid clipping distortion when striking curbs, etc.

[yes, I'm still using a 7 nm wheel]

 

[Cote Dazur]

Interesting, is that the wheel Cote Dazur was referencing to in his post?

I was referring to my CSR Elite with modified Buhler motors.

 

[Cote Dazur]

If you want to match Indycar steering effort 1:1

To replicate the steering forces, Franchitti says it involves a bit more than one might expect.

"It's not really holding the weight out, but lifting that and rotating weight with forces pushing back on your lead hand," he remarked. "In Turn 1, you have to pull down with the left and push up with the right to overcome 35 pounds of force.

You Think Driving An Indy Car Is Easy?

Dario Franchitti gets wired to find out the exact forces he withstands and exerts while in the cockpit of a race car and proves once and for all that IndyCar drivers are truly athletes.

www.roadandtrack.com

35 Inch-Pounds Force (in lbf)

=

3.95449 Newton Meters (Nm)

35 Inch-Pound Force to Newton Meters Conversion Calculator - 35 in lbf to Nm

Convert 35 Inch-Pound Force to Newton Meters with our online conversion.

www.flightpedia.org

 

[Enzo Fazzi]

To replicate the steering forces, Franchitti says it involves a bit more than one might expect.

"It's not really holding the weight out, but lifting that and rotating weight with forces pushing back on your lead hand," he remarked. "In Turn 1, you have to pull down with the left and push up with the right to overcome 35 pounds of force.

You Think Driving An Indy Car Is Easy?

Dario Franchitti gets wired to find out the exact forces he withstands and exerts while in the cockpit of a race car and proves once and for all that IndyCar drivers are truly athletes.

www.roadandtrack.com

35 Inch-Pounds Force (in lbf)

=

3.95449 Newton Meters (Nm)

35 Inch-Pound Force to Newton Meters Conversion Calculator - 35 in lbf to Nm

Convert 35 Inch-Pound Force to Newton Meters with our online conversion.

www.flightpedia.org

Why are you assuming it's Inch-Pounds? That doesn't really align with "so every movement of the wheel requires a lot of energy."

 

[Emery]

To replicate the steering forces, Franchitti says it involves a bit more than one might expect.

"It's not really holding the weight out, but lifting that and rotating weight with forces pushing back on your lead hand," he remarked. "In Turn 1, you have to pull down with the left and push up with the right to overcome 35 pounds of force.

You Think Driving An Indy Car Is Easy?

Dario Franchitti gets wired to find out the exact forces he withstands and exerts while in the cockpit of a race car and proves once and for all that IndyCar drivers are truly athletes.

www.roadandtrack.com

35 Inch-Pounds Force (in lbf)

=

3.95449 Newton Meters (Nm)

35 Inch-Pound Force to Newton Meters Conversion Calculator - 35 in lbf to Nm

Convert 35 Inch-Pound Force to Newton Meters with our online conversion.

www.flightpedia.org

You have the wrong units! If the steering wheel is 12" in diameter, that's 35 ft lbf, not in lbf, so multiply 3.9 by 12 = 46.8 Nm. Or it might be half that much if I've errantly used diameter instead of radius.

 

[blekenbleu]

used diameter

With Dario quoted as pulling down and pushing up on a 12" diameter rim,
that is 35 lb over a ft, so 35 lb ft of torque

 

[Ruttman98]

To replicate the steering forces, Franchitti says it involves a bit more than one might expect.

"It's not really holding the weight out, but lifting that and rotating weight with forces pushing back on your lead hand," he remarked. "In Turn 1, you have to pull down with the left and push up with the right to overcome 35 pounds of force.

You Think Driving An Indy Car Is Easy?

Dario Franchitti gets wired to find out the exact forces he withstands and exerts while in the cockpit of a race car and proves once and for all that IndyCar drivers are truly athletes.

www.roadandtrack.com

35 Inch-Pounds Force (in lbf)

=

3.95449 Newton Meters (Nm)

35 Inch-Pound Force to Newton Meters Conversion Calculator - 35 in lbf to Nm

Convert 35 Inch-Pound Force to Newton Meters with our online conversion.

www.flightpedia.org

Thank you for posting that article--helps us better appreciate the strength and conditioning required to drive those beasts. I cannot understand why IndyCar has not introduced power steering.

 

[Tom_Hampton]

You little not understood me , i dont mean to compare cars to bikes and i may not be Einstein on physicks so what i said may be not correct 100% those gyroscopic forces i mention. your right i may not have good understanding what i say. but most important thing to me is that what i sayd what happen in real life VS in sim when you let off wheel:
worst thing in current ffb is
in real life if you not only let off wheel but you can also turn it slightly and wheel goes back to center and car is still stable
in sims at speeds lets say 200+ or 300+ if yuou let off wheel at bumpy road it want to transfer those bumps into wheel so it make it shake, but thing is in current ffb technology (outdated windows direct driver or something) that forces shake wheel so much that it starts oscillating more and more and thus make car go out of its path and crash.
i tell again, its not a big deal and no problem if you just hold wheel always, but it just a small inconveniece how ffb works in sims, that its not always 100% connected, like wheel is slightly unconnected and actual oscillations on wheel side can shake whole car in sims and make it crash when driving straight.

I stumbled across this video from Neils H.

This is a really good explanation of the basics of steering forces.