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Assetto Corsa Racing Club (LIVE)

Is this technique even useful?

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Mohamedou Ari, Mar 13, 2012.

  1. Mohamedou Ari

    Mohamedou Ari
    F1 Sim Racer & #1 St. Bernard Lover on RD Premium

    Look, even if you have an ailing clutch, and you had to use this technique to preserve it, wouldn't you also be destroying your gearbox?

    I find it surprising that the car did not stall since it went into quite a low RPM. I always thought it was impossible to shift gears without a clutch.

    I'm not going to be foolish enough to attempt this. If any of you are going to try, all I can say is "do everything to maintain your vehicle."

  2. Hiroshi Awazu

    Hiroshi Awazu
    Off Topic Moderator

    I can shift without using a clutch in big rig trucks but not cars. I still have to use the clutch to get truck going but after when it is moving, no clutch.

    Lot of truck drivers double clutch but I can shift without doing so. Its all about the timing.
  3. There's no benefit at all for that driving technique, I agree with you Mohammed.
  4. Obviously there is a benefit because you don't use the clutch.

    However, a clutch is designed to last the cars life so if you use it properly this feature is unnecessary.
  5. It's possible, and it doesn't hurt the car if you do it properly... But then it's useless so...
  6. Its useful when the clutch is not working (ripped clutch-wire etc) and you need to get home:)
    • Like Like x 1
  7. Yeah well, otherwise it's not :p
  8. And also if you're on a long journey and you're bored:D
    • Like Like x 2
  9. Xosé Estrada

    Xosé Estrada

    Or if you only have one leg and no money to buy an automatic car.
    • Like Like x 2
  10. Not sure what you guys are so hyped up about.

    Ross Bentley (writer of the Speed Secrets series, and long time driving coach) even says everyone should know how to drive/shift without the clutch. Lots of professional race car drivers don't use the clutch. I know there are (dare I say, and not my cup of tea but..) NASCAR drivers who won't use the clutch on shifts.

    I have no problem not using the clutch, it's just about matching the revs properly and taking your time.
    * I drive a 2001 Mazda Protege 1.6 liter manual transmission, it has 346000km on it so far and I'm on my original clutch/transmission/everything really (and I drive like an asshole)*

    Just my two cents (if there even worth anything). :)
  11. That's mostly because most race cars (to my knowledge, even NASCAR) have a computer-controlled ignition cut out on the upshifts, which means that the clutch never really has to be used anyway. The reason we see most drivers using the clutch and heel-toeing on the downshifts is to ease the strain on the transmission when shifting down (one can also blip the throttle if you're a left-foot braker like Greg Murphy in V8 Supercars, but heel-toeing is more common).
  12. Rui F. Martins

    Rui F. Martins

    In NASCAR the cars are able to downshift and upshift without clutch, but some time ago i was seing a NASCAR race and the comentators were discusing that subject and they said that on track were the drivers needed to downshift some of them used the clutch to do so and by doing that they didn't have so many transmission problems like the ones that didn't used it.
  13. Bram

    Ezekiel 25:17 Staff Premium

    It's a great technique to ruin your gear box!
  14. Most race cars have dogbox tranny... With them you don't have to use the clutch much as the whole range for the rev-match is a lot bigger, the gears go in fairly easily... With a standard synchro, the range is very small and you can only take your time, not the best thing when you are racing :rolleyes:
  15. I'm lost. First it seemed like everyone was saying shifting without the clutch is the stupidest thing they'd ever seen. Now it seems like people are making excuses for people to do it.
    I understand there's no racing use for it (based on the trying to go fast thing), but honestly how many cars are either sequential or paddle shifters now anyways. You guys wait, the next couple years and the word "clutch" will be used to describe the history of racing.
    The original video is of a Mini anyways. Racing or not, you should know how to shift with and without a clutch no matter what your daily driver is IMO. That and it's what separates us and the "average" road driver (understanding that there's more to driving than gas, brake, not signalling, passing on the right, going through yellow/red lights, the dynamics of keeping up momentum through corners and using the whole road, you get my drift...)
  16. Nah sure, but I think one should concentrate on knowing heel and toeing more than shifting without the clutch :p
  17. Hiroshi Awazu

    Hiroshi Awazu
    Off Topic Moderator

    I tried shifting without clutch in Bimmer, "GRRRRIIIIINNNNNDDDDD!!!" :roflmao::roflmao::roflmao:

    I agree with William there:thumbsup:
  18. I rarely use a clutch on my bike (motorcycle) either changing up OR down because it's smoothest to match your rev's anyway (there's no synromesh rings in a bike gearbox) & by the time Ive got the clutch half in it's in another gear.
    I also find the same with changing up in a car too.
    When driving sedately in a car I nearly always use the clutch (it's rare that I don't) to keep things smooth yet when Im pushing hard, again, I find it's the same as changing up & I'd be lucky to have the clutch halfway to the floor by the time Im in the next gear.
    All my Holden's have had the syncro' rings removed to try & improve the strength of a weak gearbox & I find it improves the longevity too to minimize the clutch use with them.
    Ive found with the Holden M-series gearboxes that excessive clutch use ends up wearing the input shafts bearing with disastrous results after about 4to6 months of HARD driving.
    I haven't had much experience with other makes of manual gearboxes in performance installations so I can't really comment on them.
    As for large diesel powered heavy plant machinery mainly driven at low speed Ive found it's always best to use the clutch, especially under load, but to try to minimize the time the clutch is dis-engaged & more so to keep the change as breif & smooth as possible no matter the speed due to the huge amount of Torque involved.
    It doesn't take much to tear the center out of a clutch if it's used incorrectly in those applications.
    Personally, I think clutch/no clutch as well as heel-toe v's left-foot braking is all a matter of personal preference in accordance to the situation a person finds themselves in.
    BUT, you SHOULD always try to match your engine rev's to your driveline speed no matter which method you use to keep the forces on the cars suspension, brakes & tires 'smooth'.
    After all, you don't just rip or jerk the steering into a corner nor smash your brakes strait to the floor-you 'lean' or 'sqeeeeeze' on them for much the same reason as mentioned above....
    Thats my 2cents worth & a brief description what the advanced driver & rider training taught me as well as driving plant equipment for a living....
    • Like Like x 2
  19. When Ive been in a race car, I didnt use the clutch. But I always use it in my road car. Why? Because with the race car there are spare parts, and damaged parts are expected, but with my road car it has to last as long as possible. While it is possible to do it safely, its harder to be consistant, and its those times where you slightly mess up that cause the damage. I dont mind damaging a race car, its meant for speed and I find using the clutch slows my shifts down, but not on the road, Im not in that kind of rush :p
    • Like Like x 1
  20. Sorry to say gentlemen but the no clutch thing is the future:

    • Like Like x 1