AIDD - AI Dynamic Driving (hidden)

[holacrosty]

In GTR2 AI is always driven by a Talent *.RCD file, and you can use 2 drivers, by adding them in your *.CAR file.
I have them like this:

Driver1="default" // default.RCD driver file
Driver2="whatever" // name of *.RCD driver file

Now.. there are 2 WAYS of AI driving your ugly car

Forced and Dynamic.

Forced, by using this *.RCD settings:
// CorneringAdd=3.70
// CorneringMult=0.95

And Dynamic by simply NOT using them.

Meaning that if you DO NOT use these settings (delete them) the AI will always push the car to its limits.
Being those limits:

- *.AIW *.RCD files
- *.PLR AI values
- all the physics, and how ugly is your car. (yes.. in case you din´t notice)

(you can delete all those lines, in all the *.RCD files, with TextCrawler)

I know GTR2 has "AI learning" activated by default, but with AIDD it seems to be pushing at its best all the time (following the AIW lines).
Its like its using "Real Feel", instead of just trying some plain presetted values.

Now at this point I got almost all sorted out except the AIW files.
Otherwise, it drives way better.

So if someone can help or point me a track with a really good AIW file, it will be appreciated.

a link for first topic :

https://www.racedepartment.com/threads/gtr2-allows-2-ai-drivers.258066/

 

[jgf]

The main issue with AIW files is that the farther the performance of the series you are running is from the series used to create the AIW file the worse the overall performance will be.

For example, the track creator uses a set of GT3 cars for adjusting the AIW file, you go to that track with F1 cars ...and you have the performance of an F1 car running the line of a GT3 car.

 

[holacrosty]

I have seen the posts on AIW. And I understand how bad AIW files can be and are.
So Im talking about those obvious big differences. Like between proper and wrong.

The differences you mention are negligent. As I will always try to put the most possible vertical load on the tyres, to found the maximum grip. Using cambered track turns and height changes, no matter what downforce I have.
So the best line will basically always be the same.

I think the main problem with creating a proper AIW, could be never having acces to a full proper car, and all the proper AI settings. But I can provide that.

I don´t even need that new "physics mod". I think Im way ahead. No disrespect and been humble about it.
Have not tryed it.

BTW the AIDD is always looking for aplying the max vertical load on tyres. But I does it all in combination with some other settings. IE: some of the ones that @AndreasFSC discovered hidden in the *.RCD:

NeckLatMult=30 // will to manage "higher" lateral forces.

 

[Shovas]

I've been experimenting with using ChatGPT to look up params like this NeckLatMult

Something labelled neck-anything would hint to me it's about some kind of animation in the neck and not about AI driving behaviour but ChatGPT seems to agree with you

I don't know if this is made up stuff or not but if we find ChatGPT reliable for this kind of stuff it could be very handy

 

[holacrosty]

I know my description of the setting was accurate.
Well.. wish my post to be more usefull to promote some AIW editing. To me, the last step on AI.
Although seems you are more to promote that thing.

but if you could give some feedback on the values that would be great to move forward, as I don´t know if there is any interest.

 

[GP STONER]

I know my description of the setting was accurate.
Well.. wish my post to be more usefull to promote some AIW editing. To me, the last step on AI.
Although seems you are more to promote that thing.

but if you could give some feedback on the values that would be great to move forward, as I don´t know if there is any interest.

Gtr2 and Ai. You can wake me up any time for it.

But there are some things that never change some key things are hard coded sadly and also the lack of propper 64 bit support/directx 11 or higher... look at the pc's we all got (probably)every body got at least 12cores or more 32 gb of ram etc graphics cards you only could dream of back in 2006.

To your quest about aiw..
Yess without propper aiw ai will never be good. Aiw is the first basic thing that needs to be right otherwise everything else is a pain in the you know what.

Sadly so many great looking tracks (for gtr2) but horrible aiw and to me aiw and cam tool is also a nightmare to work with.

Little side note.

In ac there is a tool that allows you to record fast line etc.

I notice when i made a fastline while driving a slow or medium speed car and i use that ai fastline file for racing against f1 or other openwheel cars they would drive like they are a normale road car.. braking from million miles away for a corner etc.

But when i recorded a fast line while driving my self a f1 car and doing a quali lap that improved the racing drasticly.

Only when i use gt or even slower road cars while using the ai fastline made with f1 car the road cars are trying to be a f1 car braking as late as a f1 or lets say it better trying to brake as late 99% of the ai cars crash.

I ended up using the same methode as how different layouts of a single track are made and made for openwheel style racing a "layout" and for road cars a layout and recorded for both new layout there matching ai file.

But offline racing the last time i played ac without propper rules was boring in the first place.

I never found for my self a real replacement for gtr2.

Untill i bought a 3d printer.
And have printed a fully working race cars. Building my second f1 ferrari 2004 lookalike, first one crashed at 178 mph but also made a lmp1 audi and peugot 908
A ferrari 550 audi r8 lms bmw m3 e30 ( 1/10scale up to 1/5 scale)

Its like gtr2 but touchable and yess first person moveble view.
I even can use a pc driving wheel and pedals also it have a little on board computer in it it can drive autonome if i would like but i use it in the same fasion as motec

Setups really matters
Camber shocks gearing. Even aero.

My f1 car had 2 motors on 1 driving axle. Oil filled shocks with olive oil hahah

So good luck to you all and keep gtr2 alive if somebody can it would be you guys

 

[GP STONER]

Btw there is a special aiw tool
I found it on pilsbierbunde
If the site is still active maybe you could take a look at it

Edit: sorry its not pilabierbunde but gtr4u.de

This is the tool : http://gtr4u.de/filebase/index.php/Entry/2274-AIW-Generierung/?l=2

 

[holacrosty]

Yess without propper aiw ai will never be good

I think Im about to prove that wrong.
But yes, I have tracks like F12010Valencia were AI is super-slowdown in tight turns just to "avoid crashing" (is it called a turn or a corner?). While crashes are "scripted" (not in practice though).

I have seen that good car physics and great AI driver avoid crashes.
I have great car/tires. And I think am close to achieve great talent file.
Just finishing other stuff. I will look to post a video on it.

I read comments saying no sim has good AI. wow.

 

[GP STONER]

I think Im about to prove that wrong.
But yes, I have tracks like F12010Valencia were AI is super-slowdown in tight turns just to "avoid crashing" (is it called a turn or a corner?). While crashes are "scripted" (not in practice though).

I have seen that good car physics and great AI driver avoid crashes.
I have great car/tires. And I think am close to achieve great talent file.
Just finishing other stuff. I will look to post a video on it.

I read comments saying no sim has good AI. wow.

Gtr2 ai wont drive good without a propper aiw file even if you give them the best setup if the aiw is meshed up ai allways follows the meshed up driving line. for the sake of argument it tries allways to follow the line with a deflection of lets say +10 and minus 10 %.

In ac you can even see that when you use the line helper or the other ai driving line record app it shows how much the ai driven car is deflecting from the "recorded" fast line.

This is how racing games have been for ages now.. only some new titles are slowly ditching this methode.
Gtr2 gaming engine isnt made for new style of Ai management its too old for that. In simulair games its called ai racing line or aiw like in gtr2
But its basicly the same method and its used in 99% of racing games.

The only game i can think of it would probably work with different style of telling ai car how to go around a track would be that so called super Ai within gran tourismo.
Because they say its self learning.

Even the option within rf1 that you can teach the ai in i believe with out having rf1 in front of me in free pratice mode it can teach it self to find the optimum driving line around a track, in the chat box you will see every lap its have driven how close to the "optimal" racing line its got. It uses the aiw file to find the racing line in the first place.

So no matter what your saying.
Gtr2 ai cant drive with out a aiw file and when the aiw is meshed up for human player it really don't effect much maybe some weird cut corner penalties or bad behaviour safety car. A human driver can get around a track in gtr2 even when the aiw is meshed up , Ai dont.

So for good ai in gtr2 you need a good aiw file if the aiw is meshed up well even the best setup file (.svm) and the best talent files would no fix it. Thats why i say the a propper aiw is the key to start with.

 

[GP STONER]

Not hard feelings but i can prove this. Some thing you can re produce your self.

Go take a track choice some ai cars that have good talent file and a propper setup (.svm)

Then go to the aiw and mesh up some values with big changes ( values that have relation to the racing line) and go watch if the ai cars still gets around a corner at the location you " meshed up" the racing line.

If you done the meshing up part good enough ai cars cant make it around that corner anymore.

Basicly saying if the aiw is meshed up dont spend your time on talent files or setup files but on the aiw.

Because if they cant make it around a corner or in some cases even get out of there pitboxes
Making a setup file or trying to fix it with talent files is a waist of time.

 

[holacrosty]

oh.. i see the problem

 

[Deleted member 13397]

dont take me wrong HOLACROSTY
i read your posts several times and still was not sure what you want to say
i assume that english is not your mother language, as for me

maybe you should post what you are talking about
1. the track with this BAD AIW
2. the ugly car
3. the RCD files
4. and a video where GTR2 using this show us "GTR2 has AI learning"

p.s. : dont take me wrong, i believe you, but i want to recreate what you are talking about

 

[holacrosty]

well.. how should i do all that? I don have an ugly car.
yes, it is language barrier like you said

 

[Lolelief]

Meaning that if you DO NOT use these settings (delete them) the AI will always push the car to its limits.
Being those limits:

- *.AIW *.RCD files

Sorry to break it to you, but I'm afraid that is simply not true. The game auto-generates RaceAbility and CorneringAdd values for AI drivers whose .RCD is missing. The trace file shows exactly what values were used (and, sadly, the game tends to auto-generate mediocre to slow values).

 

[holacrosty]

oh. didnt know that. So what those "auto-generated" values are exactly for those settings? please.

 

[GP STONER]

Gtr2 has reached its limit.
It never will get any updates.

Even a propper 64 bit support and directx 11 or higher would be allready a major game changer.

But sadly it is wishfull thinking.
I bought gtr2 the same day it got released so its nearly 17 years now
I believe i cant remember exaclty when but i think its allmost 12 years or more now that gtr3 would be released.
Still nothing as for the day of this writting.

A few years ago there was a little hope
That there would be still a gtr3 comming but again its allready again a few years.

Its time to move forward to something new. Other games that still have support can only get better

Gtr2 well its a museum worthy art .
Only every era comes to a end just like the schumi era or the vettel, hamilton and even max verstappen era will someday come to a end.

Gtr2 have reached the end of line now.

Microsoft is slowy phasing out 32 bit.
Just like they did with 8 and 16 bit.
Now days most pc's or other electronic items are 64 bit or 64 bit compatible its expansive to still have a part of a company working on 32 bit while 32 bit has reached the end of line.

Yes this will not mean that gtr2 will not run anymore in the future now days you can run allmost everything with a emulator like dos games in a dosbox method.

I left gtr2 because of this reason.

When my second pc that one is still close to specs of a high end pc back in 2006 runs gtr2 better and even with more cars without ctd then my fully water cooled pc with 12 core cpu and 32 gb of ram at a much higher clockspeed then those dinosaurus 512mb or 1gb ram sticks

Then its time to move on

 

[PiotrGT]

Gtr2 has reached its limit.
It never will get any updates.

Even a propper 64 bit support and directx 11 or higher would be allready a major game changer.

But sadly it is wishfull thinking.
I bought gtr2 the same day it got released so its nearly 17 years now
I believe i cant remember exaclty when but i think its allmost 12 years or more now that gtr3 would be released.
Still nothing as for the day of this writting.

A few years ago there was a little hope
That there would be still a gtr3 comming but again its allready again a few years.

Its time to move forward to something new. Other games that still have support can only get better

Gtr2 well its a museum worthy art .
Only every era comes to a end just like the schumi era or the vettel, hamilton and even max verstappen era will someday come to a end.

Gtr2 have reached the end of line now.

Microsoft is slowy phasing out 32 bit.
Just like they did with 8 and 16 bit.
Now days most pc's or other electronic items are 64 bit or 64 bit compatible its expansive to still have a part of a company working on 32 bit while 32 bit has reached the end of line.

Yes this will not mean that gtr2 will not run anymore in the future now days you can run allmost everything with a emulator like dos games in a dosbox method.

I left gtr2 because of this reason.

When my second pc that one is still close to specs of a high end pc back in 2006 runs gtr2 better and even with more cars without ctd then my fully water cooled pc with 12 core cpu and 32 gb of ram at a much higher clockspeed then those dinosaurus 512mb or 1gb ram sticks

Then its time to move on

Did you try setting CPU affinity? Maybe that's why your current PC is struggling with GTR2. It normally runs on just 1 core and performance is terrible on modern PCs, but you can make it run on all cores by for example setting it through Task Manager.