This sim has the worst ffb I have used

smasha

250RPM
Original poster
Mar 1, 2010
458
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Mushy and my G27 rattles and oscillates like crazy even with FX setting down to 5.

Automobilista does not do this,it has the best ffb of all the sims I own,Iracing is next then Assetto Corsa.

But PC 2's ffb is horrible and Yes I have tried a number of custom files like Jack Spade's and others with great reviews in here but the G27 rattles away and feels mushy,there is no tyre feeling with this sim,really vague and mushy,reminds me of the first Nascar Heat game back around 20 years ago.

PC 2 reminds me of the Shift games as well,very similar feel,mushy.

Is there a setting in the FFB txt file that can get rid of the rattling and horrible feel?

The Nascar around Daytona feels horrible and the ai,oh my ,they are hopeless.
 
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David Wright

1000RPM
Sep 27, 2009
1,257
875
My G25 and G29 feel great with Jack Spades file and AMS feels, shall we say, bland.

Proof that people will never agree about FFB :)

I'd get a steam refund quickly before your 2 hours are up.
 

tlsmikey

500RPM
Feb 24, 2016
752
531
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I think in general, the FFB is what held this title back for the sim enthusiast. It certainly has a great list of cars/tracks (although some of the non scanned ones are a bit off). The FFB despite all the tinkering for me was never good compared to any of its peers. It's a shame.....it had so much potential.
 

Marc Collins

1000RPM
Aug 25, 2011
1,441
624
Mushy and my G27 rattles and oscillates like crazy even with FX setting down to 5.

Automobilista does not do this,it has the best ffb of all the sims I own,Iracing is next then Assetto Corsa.

But PC 2's ffb is horrible and Yes I have tried a number of custom files like Jack Spade's and others with great reviews in here but the G27 rattles away and feels mushy,there is no tyre feeling with this sim,really vague and mushy,reminds me of the first Nascar Heat game back around 20 years ago.

PC 2 reminds me of the Shift games as well,very similar feel,mushy.

Is there a setting in the FFB txt file that can get rid of the rattling and horrible feel?

The Nascar around Daytona feels horrible and the ai,oh my ,they are hopeless.
My experience exactly, except with Fanatec CSW. This thread is not for Logi, but might still be worth a try:

https://www.racedepartment.com/threads/which-ffb-mods-are-you-guys-using-for-fanatec-csw-2-5.167532/

You''ll see my comment in there.
 

Marc Collins

1000RPM
Aug 25, 2011
1,441
624
My G25 and G29 feel great with Jack Spades file and AMS feels, shall we say, bland.

Proof that people will never agree about FFB :)

I'd get a steam refund quickly before your 2 hours are up.
You must be one of the rare people who cannot get AMS set-up in an optimal manner. Bland couldn't be further from what most of us experience--the most fluid, natural and plausible feedback that communicates exactly what the physics engine is doing. I desperately wish there was some less-than-10-hours-of-fiddling way to get PCars (1 or 2) FFB optimized. Haven't found it yet. Even with a "favourite" FFB custom file, the results vary wildly from car to car (unlike AMS where every vehicle feels appropriately relative to each other as if they all came from the same physics universe).
 
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Kurupt CDN

DirtT Tuned Motorsports
Premium
Jul 18, 2012
2,941
2,370
@smasha

As David Wright mentioned, ffb is subjective to each user.

May I ask, is this thread just to rant or are you actually asking for help?

If your looking for help,
supplying us with some information other than game X,Y&Z is better than A, Game Y feels amazing, while A is mush and I've tried everything doesn't tell me much other than pcars doesn't feel like ams ;)

Information that can help:
Logitech profile settings
Ingame wheel settings
What ffb file are you using?
What assists are you running? Off, authentic, some ?
What's the temperature of the track at Daytona?
What tire compound are you running?
What are the tire temps at?

I agree with some of your points like ai, tho after lots of research i've found pcars models several things very well which has a significant effect on the overall feel and handling.

I've found understanding track temps and knowing which compound to run and what it's optimal psi range is to be the single most factor in the game and how the cars handle!

In RL when a driver complains about grip or the car is handling poorly does he ask for a new custom ffb profile?
No, they usually start by adjusting tire pressure than other easily adjustable parts like arb, track bar etc.
Finding and staying in the optimal tire range is key in this game.
Cold tires=lack of grip
Hot tires=lack of grip and mush

Unlike AMS and Assetto which use more or less a time baked dynamic track with track presets like green, low, med and high which rubbers in the optimal racing line.
Pcars starts off green and uses similar track tech to iracing and rf2 where the rubbering in is determined by where people actually drive and temps change based on where the sun and shadows hit the track.

Also factor in the loose surface physics like iracing has atm, brings debris onto the track effecting grip.

Below is a link for each class and it's optimal tire temps.

http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?57541-Project-CARS-2-Tyre-Pressures

Another tip....under 25c track temp use softs, over 25c track temps use hards.
Also the brake heating model also effects tire temps as it heats up the rim, so keeping your brakes in the optimal temp range effects the tire temps.
Adjust the brake vents air flow setting.
Cold and wet conditions=close less flow
Hot conditions =open more flow

Having owned a g27 as my first wheel, I quickly upgraded once I tested a belt driven wheel. They are much stronger, smoother, faster and don't click and rattle like a g27 which drove me nuts.

Cheers
David
 
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Miguel Batista

500RPM
Premium
Jun 2, 2011
799
587
I can say that I love the ffb of pcars2. It lets me feel things that other sins so far don't really give me. Like tyre loading for instance, I really feel the weight being shifted from side to side and the effect it has on grip. But of course, my 2cts... and I am totally fanboying over PCARS2 atm.
 
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smasha

250RPM
Original poster
Mar 1, 2010
458
143
@smasha

As David Wright mentioned, ffb is subjective to each user.

May I ask, is this thread just to rant or are you actually asking for help?

If your looking for help,
supplying us with some information other than game X,Y&Z is better than A, Game Y feels amazing, while A is mush and I've tried everything doesn't tell me much other than pcars doesn't feel like ams ;)

Information that can help:
Logitech profile settings
Ingame wheel settings
What ffb file are you using?
What assists are you running? Off, authentic, some ?
What's the temperature of the track at Daytona?
What tire compound are you running?
What are the tire temps at?

I agree with some of your points like ai, tho after lots of research i've found pcars models several things very well which has a significant effect on the overall feel and handling.

I've found understanding track temps and knowing which compound to run and what it's optimal psi range is to be the single most factor in the game and how the cars handle!

In RL when a driver complains about grip or the car is handling poorly does he ask for a new custom ffb profile?
No, they usually start by adjusting tire pressure than other easily adjustable parts like arb, track bar etc.
Finding and staying in the optimal tire range is key in this game.
Cold tires=lack of grip
Hot tires=lack of grip and mush

Unlike AMS and Assetto which use more or less a time baked dynamic track with track presets like green, low, med and high which rubbers in the optimal racing line.
Pcars starts off green and uses similar track tech to iracing and rf2 where the rubbering in is determined by where people actually drive and temps change based on where the sun and shadows hit the track.

Also factor in the loose surface physics like iracing has atm, brings debris onto the track effecting grip.

Below is a link for each class and it's optimal tire temps.

http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?57541-Project-CARS-2-Tyre-Pressures

Another tip....under 25c track temp use softs, over 25c track temps use hards.
Also the brake heating model also effects tire temps as it heats up the rim, so keeping your brakes in the optimal temp range effects the tire temps.
Adjust the brake vents air flow setting.
Cold and wet conditions=close less flow
Hot conditions =open more flow

Having owned a g27 as my first wheel, I quickly upgraded once I tested a belt driven wheel. They are much stronger, smoother, faster and don't click and rattle like a g27 which drove me nuts.

Cheers
David
PC 2 uses similar track tech to Iracing and Rfactor 2 ???
BS!

Feels like the original Nascar Heat or Shift games,no feel at all,mushy but half of it comes down to the physics of PC2,not doing it for me.
 

smasha

250RPM
Original poster
Mar 1, 2010
458
143
I can say that I love the ffb of pcars2. It lets me feel things that other sins so far don't really give me. Like tyre loading for instance, I really feel the weight being shifted from side to side and the effect it has on grip. But of course, my 2cts... and I am totally fanboying over PCARS2 atm.
With a few tweaks ,it is great in the graphics department and a nice selection of cars and tracks but the driving experience is horrible.
It also suffers from alot of glitches ,I loaded the top time trial ghost and used it's setup for my car but when I took it out on the track my car couldn't rev higher than half way,it was like I had a park brake half running.

Falls far short of AMS,Iracing,Rfactor 2 and Assetto Corsa in the physics department.

It competes more with Nascar Heat and the Shift games.
 
Last edited:

Kurupt CDN

DirtT Tuned Motorsports
Premium
Jul 18, 2012
2,941
2,370
PC 2 uses similar track tech to Iracing and Rfactor 2 ???
BS!

Feels like the original Nascar Heat or Shift games,no feel at all,mushy but half of it comes down to the physics of PC2,not doing it for me.
Ok, I'll take that response as your not looking for help just ranting ...good luck sorting your issues!

I'll just leave this BS info regarding pc2 track tech here so you can educate your self on how it works ;)

https://www.projectcarsgame.com/the_insiders_guide/episode-27-livetrack-3-0-weather-evolution/

https://www.greenmangaming.com/blog/project-cars-2s-livetrack-3-0-system/

 
Last edited:

smasha

250RPM
Original poster
Mar 1, 2010
458
143
Isn’t livetrack broken?

Anyway ,doesn’t change the way the cars drive.

Maybe I am driving the wrong cars?
 

Miguel Batista

500RPM
Premium
Jun 2, 2011
799
587
If you really like other sims much more, please play them and not PCARS2. Honestly sounds like you came all the way to this subforum to tell us how wrong we are for enjoyig this sim.
 

Robertinotje

100RPM
May 20, 2017
142
58
59
This sim is for me still the number 1. Thrustmaster wheel ,and de ffb handling is just superb.
There are so many sim racing games who are way to pretentious. Forget the name of the game and it s "reputation", and give some time to set properly the ffb settings. You will be amazed.
 

Marc Collins

1000RPM
Aug 25, 2011
1,441
624
This sim is for me still the number 1. Thrustmaster wheel ,and de ffb handling is just superb.
There are so many sim racing games who are way to pretentious. Forget the name of the game and it s "reputation", and give some time to set properly the ffb settings. You will be amazed.
Lots of us are willing to give it some time, but there are no clear instructions or logic that a normal person could understand--even a race sim fanatic can barely follow it. And it is interesting that some other titles work out-of-the-box with a quick 10 seconds of basic tweaking to FFB that never has to be touched or thought about again. If PCars FFB was superior, it might be worth the effort. At best, it is (apparently) equivalent to the best others available--so why all the complication and fiddling!?!?!

Let me put it very simply--there should be a default configuration for every popular wheel on the market that represents the dev's perspective on the most accurate, realistic FFB possible to reveal all the goodness of their product. Of course, feel free to tweak or adjust if you want something different, but having no official baseline is just stupid and ill-advised marketing.
 
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hotak

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Sep 17, 2008
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Just go for raw FFB, calibrate gain and you're done IMHO.
All the other FFB profiles just add effects on top of it, raw is pure steering wheel FFB and feels very similar to rFactor2, i honestly do not understand why simracers are so obsessed with realism and then only few like to have "seat of pants", understeer and other fake effects taken out of the steering feedback.
In this sense both "informative" and "raw" pcars2 presets are much more realistic than any FFB mod for pCars or than R3E or AC default FFB.
informative is just raw+compression+auto gain calibration (gain is an useless setting for both informative and immersive) to compensate for the lack of force of the non-DD steering wheels, but i still prefer raw on my T300
 
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Marc Collins

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Aug 25, 2011
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Just go for raw FFB, calibrate gain and you're done IMHO.
All the other FFB profiles just add effects on top of it, raw is pure steering wheel FFB and feels very similar to rFactor2, i honestly do not understand why simracers are so obsessed with realism and then only few like to have "seat of pants", understeer and other fake effects taken out of the steering feedback.
In this sense both "informative" and "raw" pcars2 presets are much more realistic than any FFB mod for pCars or than R3E or AC default FFB.
informative is just raw+compression+auto gain calibration (gain is an useless setting for both informative and immersive) to compensate for the lack of force of the non-DD steering wheels, but i still prefer raw on my T300
Thanks for this useful info--have not read this simple explanation mixed into the zillion discussions about the need for custom files. Raw is what I would presumably prefer to use. I did try it and it was awful, but will go back and try again and lower the gain. I may have been experiencing clipping and over-blown feedback all at the same time. I use "Pure" FFB in AMS (sounds like their version of "raw") and of course all rF2 has is "raw" :)
 

smasha

250RPM
Original poster
Mar 1, 2010
458
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Dam the carts,rattle,rattle.

P.S. Will try the raw setting at a low gain.
 

hotak

100RPM
Sep 17, 2008
158
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Raw is what I would presumably prefer to use. I did try it and it was awful, but will go back and try again and lower the gain.
Since raw FFB (as rF2 i think) is derived straight from the forces acting on the steering joints due to suspension geometry, on some cars it may be "correctly" awful. For example the drift MX5 has bad FFB "by design" (devs explained it, but now i don't remember the why) and most of the pre '70 cars often have strange FFB due to very simple and "bad" geometries (they're mostly very fun tho, i love the aston DBR1).

Also on a G27 informative FFB may be useful to not loose too many details due to saturation and clipping, just let it auto-adjust gain for a pair of laps and then you can tune tone and FX to your likings, IIRC the first adjusts between vertical and horizontal forces, the second is mostly for bumps and kerbs feeling
 
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