DiRT Rally 2.0 The Expectations Behind Dirt Rally 2.0

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What do you believe Codemasters has in store for us?


After the pretty sad epilogue that saw Dirt 4 go down pretty much unnoticed by the virtual racing community, it was an exciting turn of events seeing a new Dirt title announced recently, this time rooting back into the ‘Rally’ origins and branded as 2.0. Following after the persistent requests from those who loved the original Dirt Rally to have some sort of a sequel to the unforgettable sim that caught everyone by surprise back when it was released in Early Access, it looks like now our wishes have been granted. Codemasters seems to have learned from its mistakes, and with this new iteration in the franchise is no longer trying to bridge a gap at all costs between simracers and arcaders, but it is now focusing entirely on the former. There is much to be excited about, but something to be worried of too.

Looking at the trailers and bits of gameplay released so far, I could not help but notice some pretty evident compromises still made in the physics department in order to make the game at least lenient towards the casual driver, but taking away realism from the hard-core player. It is not a sin, of course, as the first Dirt Rally had some noticeable inconsistencies too in the driving experience and the title, as a whole, tried to also meet the expectations of the arcade racer. This did not really happen however, since many console players and non-simracer PC users still complained that the game was “too hard” and rejected it. My question then is, why try this approach again? Why trying to make a sim with some arcadish features blending in, like the first one, if it won’t be enough for casual players to enjoy the game anyway? Why not going all-in for the absolute simracing experience and please just one audience, but at least pleasing it to the fullest?

Another thing I am not entirely convinced with is the amount of marketing and promotional videos we are being bombarded with as of late. A continuous stream of content, even if just one minute long at times, sponsoring the new game. This is a matter of concern to me. The first Dirt Rally came out unexpectedly. One day, it was there, without anyone really knowing it was going to, and leaving everyone speechless. It was not perfect, but it was an amazing and well-received surprise. During Early Access, the title was developed, improved, and with its quality did its own marketing. The game spoke volumes for itself and let players and their useful feedback be the cornering stone of its success. I honestly would have preferred in this case the same pragmatic approach that distinguished the original one.

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I loved the first Dirt Rally, and I am a long time player of the Dirt franchise. I played almost all of them, and liked them. Therefore, my wish is that Dirt Rally 2.0 will nail it on the head, and will give to all of us rally lovers (even though I consider myself merely a novice in the field) what we have been waiting for so long. A realistic, complete rally driving experience. The first one came already incredibly close, and its sequel has now the chance to hit the bull’s eye with its brand new features like track degradation or tyre selection and management (the one I am most excited for). This gives me the reason to stay confident, despite any doubt I may have so far.

If you want to discuss the game with our passionate community, and read about the latest news, check out the RaceDepartment DiRT Rally 2.0 Sub Forum. Give it a go, just keep it DiRTy!

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What do you think we can expect from Dirt Rally 2.0? Do you believe it will be up to the expectations of the simracing community? Which features are you most excited about or which one would you like to see included in the final game?

Let us know in the comments below!

 
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That said RX is a dying sport if ever there was one,Just look at the crowd at the lastest Launch Control video,maybe 1/4 full stands looking mostly bored.

Sweden, Norway, France, Latvia, Germany had full stands. According to the broadcast around 50.000 attendees. Lots of events would sign for more than 10.000 attendees. I do admit that the new locations under deliver like the US. But i dont think it is dying. Hell,with the eWRX the sport could grow.
 
Then again, Argentina is in and uses pieces of a famous road currently in the WRC, so I wouldn't be to sure

But it's not the actual road. IIRC, it will be made so it looks familiar, but it's not a replica.

The WRC surely can't own the rights to public (or any) roads, it's not like circuit racing where the majority are owned by private companies. Maybe they have the rights to stage names.

Also, if this was the case, what has changed from 2015 until now? How come they could have WRC stages and cars then but not now? The stages in all Dirt games (and CMR) have never used real stage names, and that is probably because the names are the actual rights. Hence why Vargåsen is named Lysvik and Ouninpohja is named Kotajärvi or whatever.

They don't, but they were "adviced" by the FIA and/or the promoter to not use stages like that. I am quite sure there is some give and take there in regards to licenses as well. And keeping on the good side of FIA.

The then, newest gen WRC cars were individually licensed, which is why you didn't have race-liveries on those cars. I am quite sure they could still be able to do so, but like the stages, I am quite sure there are FIA-benefits from not doing so.

Then again, there is nothing stopping them from traveling and replicating more national-rallies like RBR did.
 
Yeah, I think he also wasn't using full rotation of the wheel.

One thing that I'd really like to see is Hot Seat multiplayer because with Dirt rally we mostly play it with friends on the weekends and it would be nice to be able to compete in whole season together

The question is if the old cars are era-correct, or "modern". I would guess the tyres would be modern tyres, and there are quite a few of those Escorts that have less rotation.

Sweden, Norway, France, Latvia, Germany had full stands. According to the broadcast around 50.000 attendees. Lots of events would sign for more than 10.000 attendees. I do admit that the new locations under deliver like the US. But i dont think it is dying. Hell,with the eWRX the sport could grow.

I actually think WRX is in dire troubles. Teams falling off, budgets skyrocketing, leaving more and more proper RX tracks, to go to empty grandstand "festivals".
No Estering for 2019, Montalegre had a deal, and suddenly saw on the 2019 calendar that they didn't have a race and so on.

I would not be surprised if they need to "reboot" the idea behind WRX, and go back to basics.
 
I still cant fathom how Dirt Rally has VR support and years later Dirt Rally 2 does not....if the engine is the same and it was possible to have VR in 2015 there is no excuse to not support VR in 2018. The market for buyers with VR has to be at least 100X what it was in 2015....which makes it appear to be a very poor business decision.

Like you, if it does not have VR support, then, I have zero interest, but unlike you, I do not believe we are enough player out there to make it a poor business decision if VR is not offered.
The more arcade the game to more true I believe it is. when really into simulation, i.e. IRacing, RF2, Ac, ACC, and a few other then yes not having VR is probably unwise, but addressing the arcade gamers, wheel support is already more or less important and VR is not important. period.:)

Wow, didn't expect that your ranks are growing that fast! You really think there are 500 VR users out there? ;)

I think you sense of humor is much better than your math, but I agree with you, as in depending who you are targeting for a driving game, the % of VR user varies from very small to almost inexistent. We, VR user, have to consider our self fortunate that almost all the SIM worth driving also offer VR support.:)
 
Yeah, I think he also wasn't using full rotation of the wheel.

One thing that I'd really like to see is Hot Seat multiplayer because with Dirt rally we mostly play it with friends on the weekends and it would be nice to be able to compete in whole season together

Jon prefers 540 degrees for most cars I believe. With soft lock it uses 900 if available.
 
Sweden, Norway, France, Latvia, Germany had full stands. According to the broadcast around 50.000 attendees. Lots of events would sign for more than 10.000 attendees. I do admit that the new locations under deliver like the US. But i dont think it is dying. Hell,with the eWRX the sport could grow.

Those events will soon be gone and replaced with more F1 tracks. In any case how many are in the grand stands is not important, but the global viewing is. And that is low, and will be even lower when they turn to electric. Rallycross was more fun without factory teams and still on real tracks.
 
But it's not the actual road. IIRC, it will be made so it looks familiar, but it's not a replica.

They don't, but they were "adviced" by the FIA and/or the promoter to not use stages like that. I am quite sure there is some give and take there in regards to licenses as well. And keeping on the good side of FIA.

The then, newest gen WRC cars were individually licensed, which is why you didn't have race-liveries on those cars. I am quite sure they could still be able to do so, but like the stages, I am quite sure there are FIA-benefits from not doing so.

Then again, there is nothing stopping them from traveling and replicating more national-rallies like RBR did.

Given that "advice", going and creating El Condor and changing the name and one corner seems pretty much like not giving a **** about the FIA. I can understand not wanting to upset the FIA when they insist on including RX and want to keep the license, but for the benefit of rally enthusiasts it would be nice if they could ditch that license and just make whatever rally cars and stages they like. They could also get ahead of the FIA and include Japan which "might" be on the calendar in two years. I'm glad they added Poland, that semi-replaces both Finland and Wales for me.
 
I don't think that Codie's care that much about the users !

We would have a full blown rally SIM by now with tons of DLCs if they did, instead of an endless row of various rally titles !

What Codie's really like is $$$ ! ;) !
 
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So do I, I can never understand people wanting 900 degrees with every single car. Even the Escort evolved with shorter steering racks, as did 99% of rally cars. But if people want to drive a truck then be my guest.

Well I prefer 540, but it is interesting to drive historic cars with authentic handling.
 
I also stick to 540° on most racing games (except ETS2 and Spintires, where I use 900°), but that's more because of hardware limitations. The FFB motor on my DFGT just can't keep up with 900° when racing
 
I don't think that Codie's care that much about the users !

We would have a full blown rally SIM by now with tons of DLCs if they did, instead of an endless row of various rally titles !

What Codie's really like is $$$ ! ;) !

:thumbsdown:
Pretty much the majority of developers in the gaming industry is in it for the money this is there job that supports their families and life styles!

As for a full blown sim, until a dev with deep pockets come along and isin't worried about a negative return the main priority will always focus on consoles and casual gamers as it's a billion $$$ buisness.

The self proclaimed hard core sim racers often forget they are a small percentage of the overall audience.
To put it in perspective if you look at steam charts avg. users for the top racing sims on pc...ac, acc, rf2, ams, pc2, iracing and raceroom they combine for a few thousand not factoring in a single user might play several titles on a daily/weekly basis.

Forza horizon 4, Forza 7 and GT Sport had millions playing in the opening week.
2.5 million users played FH4 in the first week!

Do I want see a full blown rally sim....absolutely :) but I highly doubt we will see one any time soon from a developer who's majority user base is on a console.....due to the lack of console tech/power and a niche market.
 
Rally is not a niche motorsport, it's one of the biggest motorsports in the world with a huge following and a lot of registered drivers around the world. Last year, the total cumulative TV-viewing audience was 849 million for WRC as compared to 603 million for F1. RX doesn't even deserve a mention, they're sub 50 mill worldwide. The amount of attention RX gets in games and media is extremely overrated in terms of eye balls.

I've been crunching your numbers in my head for a while now and they just don't make any sense at all. There is no way that WRC has more viewers than F1. You can come to that conclusion just checking TV coverage, media coverage, your friends.... who has heard of what, and who hasn't.

From the F1 website: "During 2017, 352.3 million unique viewers tuned their TV set into F1 programming at least once" https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/...audiences-in-2017.6Cted4V292gQ420AeoSO2e.html

From the WRC website: "...a cumulative audience of 848.86 million viewers" https://www.wrc.com/en/wrc/news/march-2018/tv-audience/page/5266--12-12-.html

So, F1 with 603 million cumulative viewers (not sure where you got that number from) vs WRC with 849 million cumulative viewers.

With that in mind, I think the key here is how many watch every F1 race, and how many watch every rally. And within rally, given that it's a three-day event with varying levels of coverage, we don't know what metric is used to identify a "view". Like, if I tune in to an F1 race it's a view. The race lasts 90 minutes. But in WRC, what if I tune into the three live stage broadcasts that are done over three days? Is that three views?

Even more telling for me is the social media activity. Start with Motorsport.com. This is the rally report and article about Ogier winning the title: https://www.motorsport.com/wrc/news/latvala-wins-ogier-claims-title/3216030/. It has 49 shares and 5 comments.

Now here is an F1 article published the same day: https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/wolff-verstappen-champion-raw-edges/3216165/. It has 294 shares and 352 comments. Granted, it's a Max article, and was also the only F1 article of the day, but even "uninteresting" articles get loads more shares and comments than a typical WRC article.

Now social media subscribers:

F1
YouTube 1,762,654
Twitter 3,730,000

WRC
YouTube 399,188
Twitter 293,000

Games-wise on YouTube:
DiRT 20,246
Gran Turismo 112,562
F1 game 41,557
Assetto Corsa 29,180
Project Cars 42,665
Forza 79,624
Milestone 4,884
Kylotonn (Maker of WRC games) 89
Bigben Games (Publisher of WRC games) 4,322

The trend I see is that track sports/games, and especially F1, is way more popular than rally. Game sales also back up that trend.

Schumacher and Hamilton are household words, Loeb and Ogier are not.

I'm not getting on your case or blasting you or anything, and despite WRC's growth the past couple years, I don't think there's any way it is anywhere near the popularity of F1. Just the raw numbers you and I have thrown around regarding TV viewing is not much help unless we know how it's all measured. I agree about RX, it is insignificant and given the series' problems might turn to irrelevant soon...

If I could choose I'd kick out RX from Dirt 2.0 and make it a standalone game for those few that want it.

Amen.
 
From the F1 website: "During 2017, 352.3 million unique viewers tuned their TV set into F1 programming at least once" https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/...audiences-in-2017.6Cted4V292gQ420AeoSO2e.html

From the WRC website: "...a cumulative audience of 848.86 million viewers" https://www.wrc.com/en/wrc/news/march-2018/tv-audience/page/5266--12-12-.html

So, F1 with 603 million cumulative viewers (not sure where you got that number from) vs WRC with 849 million cumulative viewers.

With that in mind, I think the key here is how many watch every F1 race, and how many watch every rally. And within rally, given that it's a three-day event with varying levels of coverage, we don't know what metric is used to identify a "view". Like, if I tune in to an F1 race it's a view. The race lasts 90 minutes. But in WRC, what if I tune into the three live stage broadcasts that are done over three days? Is that three views?
Amen.

First off, the source of 603 million cumulative viewers for F1 is from the very same page you linked. ;)

In TV, cumulative views (or audience accumulation as it's called) are the total number of individuals (i.e. not the same person watching multiple times) exposed to a broadcast over a specified time. Granted, an F1 race is 2 hours and a rally is 3 days, but with cumulative views you don't count multiple broadcasts, you count specific broadcasts. And this is usually the race for F1 and a highlights programme for WRC. This is not specified for either discipline so it could of course be something different but I doubt it.

On the other hand, if you started to count viewers for a whole rally (every live stage or every day end highlights) you would have to compare those to the viewing numbers of an entire F1-weekend from FP1 to race.

As you specified, F1 has more followers on social media than WRC. However, WRC is just the world championship of the sport of rally, whereas F1 is a standalone sport (even if you could argue all single seaters are the "same" sport, they really aren't). Rallying in general, I would think has a lot more fans than what you see on WRC's social media.

With that said, WRC is still broadcast on free to air here in Sweden, whereas F1 is not and this is probably the case in more countries and that will impact the viewing numbers too. Even if F1 would be on free to air here though, rallying is A LOT more popular than racing in general and F1 in particular that it's hardly comparable but maybe we are an exception.
 
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  • tunaphis

"All i know is that Bugmasters will never make a full simulator. They don't have the ability and competence to do that. Since they can't even make an arcade game free of bugs. This company is ridiculous."
Lets explore that statement.
Then again let's not.Shouldn't expose people's short comings if I remember my Father correctly.
 

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