Tactile feedback beginner

[FusionJohn]

I’m just starting out with tactile feedback and have ordered Behringer NX3000 (for future proofing) and a couple of Reckhorn BS-200i as an initial test thing. Can this combo work? Or would I require a DSP (the 3000 was a lot cheaper than 3000D). I realise the amp is overkill for the Reckhorns but I don’t want to keep replacing amps if I upgrade the transducers.

 

[Rostovic]

Hi ,

Started with 2 reckhorns and a NX1000D.
The reckhorns work wel for some effects like rpms , wheel slip , wheel lock , ... , you don't need dsp for those , you can do a lot with simhub .
Other effects like gearshift , road vibration and road impacts i could never get a good feeling with them .
For future proofing i would go for the DSP version like suggested in other threads .

 

[FusionJohn]

@Rostovic thanks, that’s good to know. I don’t want to spend more on the DSP but it does make sense in the long run. I’ll end up going to BK LFE one day so may as well get the right amp.

 

[Mr Latte]

Hi guys just some info thats been shared before but is buried in various posts over the main tactile thread and hard to find.:

DSP is not for certain or specific effects as transducers do not operate on a "per effect" method.
All the effects you place on a channel for a unit to generate. The frequencies you assign in effects will get combined for the unit to produce.

Furthermore, the values of frequencies you set for effects, are not the only frequencies that are reproduced. They are referred to as "center values" as in the way audio works other frequencies, commonly +/- surrounding frequencies of the "center values" and "harmonics" from the "center values" are naturally also generated.

This is starting to sound complicated, isn't it?
You can only see this if you use spectral analysis type software or hardware and while its not essiential for making effects it is a good tool for learning more deeply what we are dealing with.


To make this simple to understand...
DSP can be used to control how the transducer unit outputs the incoming frequencies, it allows us to determine what frequencies we want it to generate and also what strength (dB) these get applied. This allows us to tune the output to suit certain performance characteristics some units have. By increasing or decreasing specific frequencies and removing certain frequency bands that are not needed to reduce the operation load placed on that unit.

It also can be useful to reduce/prevent some frequencies causing annoyance with reverb on a seat/cockpit build materials. Note that different materials reverberate at different frequencies. So if the gain/output for these specific frequencies is high then that material might annoyingly reverberate. Normally this means reducing the gain level but that means you lose the energy from all the effects. So with DSP controls, we can determine what the actual "culprit frequencies" are and reduce only "their amplitude" to maintain the nice volume output with no reverb issues.

You will find in various forums, some people saying that you dont need DSP with tactile. This is true we don't necessarily need it but it certainly is beneficial to the tuning and achieving the best control of them.

 

[Ormy]

DSPs are really useful for reasons given above but there are free DSP software programs you can download that will work just as well, if not better. No need to pay extra for an amp with built in DSP.

 

[Mr Latte]

DSPs are really useful for reasons given above but there are free DSP software programs you can download that will work just as well, if not better. No need to pay extra for an amp with built in DSP.

Okay, you keep stating this....
Appears that anytime I mention DSP

So, I have given you some scenarios and points to discuss it further.
Its time to explain more and to back up your claims sir.

Please respond in your own thread.....
For those interested

 

[Moonmachine]

My mistake.

 

[Mr Latte]

Id jump at that if it looks in good condition.

Edit
NOTE THIS IS NOT THE DSP MODEL

 

[Moonmachine]

My mistake.

 

[FusionJohn]

I’m not seeing that one (just checked again). I ordered from Amazon yesterday at £233 brand new so not too bad. Also ordered a used LFE.
A question if I may guys? I should have the NX3000D + 2 Reckhorn BS-200i + 1 LFE by the end of next week. Can you suggest a good way to make best use of these parts with SimHub? Or Simvibe (I’ve no experience of either but I understand there’s a cost for Simvibe). I have a Sim Lab P1 and plan to raise the seat rails and pedal deck up on rubber Isolators, then mount the shakers to seat and pedals. So it’s really a question of how to place the Reckhorns and / or LFE at this time (I’ll get more LFE later). Also, can the 1 amp power all 3? Thanks for your help.

 

[Moonmachine]

Removed link to avoid confusion. My mistake.

 

[FusionJohn]

I bought this exact model for £165 brand new. Trouble is, no DSP. So I bought a 3000D (DSP) and will now return the 3000.

 

[Moonmachine]

I have limited experience with tactile, so don’t want to tell you the wrong thing. The amp is two channel so you would run the LFE from one channel and the two reckhorns in mono from the other, you will need to limit the output of the amp to the reckhorns and also use a different curve.
I have the same amp and two LFE’s, one on the pedals and one under the seat amongst a few others. I know it’s a stretch but I would use a separate amp for the reckhorns and get something else for the NX 3000, but it’s not my money!
I also use SimHub, it’s great.

 

[Moonmachine]

I bought this exact model for £165 brand new. Trouble is, no DSP. So I bought a 3000D (DSP) and will now return the 3000.

My apologies, I must need new glasses! I could of sworn it was the dsp version. You made the right choice.

Take a look at the link Mr Latte provided, I based my tactile from this. It’s very well thought out. https://www.racedepartment.com/threads/tactile-journey-experiment.183795/

 

[Mr Latte]

Behringer Nx3000 NX Class D PA Power Amplifier Zb931 for sale online | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Behringer Nx3000 NX Class D PA Power Amplifier Zb931 at the best online prices at eBay! Free delivery for many products!

www.ebay.co.uk

This link while stating a Class D power amplifer does not refer to it being the NXD version
So its the non DSP version.

It has to be listed as NX3000D model to get DSP version.
Easy to get mixed up on this.

 

[deandsfsdfewsad]

Behringer Nx3000 NX Class D PA Power Amplifier Zb931 for sale online | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Behringer Nx3000 NX Class D PA Power Amplifier Zb931 at the best online prices at eBay! Free delivery for many products!

www.ebay.co.uk

Since this only has two outputs, if I wanted a four-channel system I would need two of these right?

 

[Mr Latte]

Correct, Behringer do not make a 4 channel model with DSP

Keep track of conversation guys.
The way the eBay seller has that listed will confuse people to think it is the DSP variant.

These are CLASS D amplifers but that is NOT referring it to being the DSP version
All NX amps that are including the DSP will be indicated by a D at the end of the model number

Examples:
NX1000D
NX3000D
NX6000D

 

[FusionJohn]

I have limited experience with tactile, so don’t want to tell you the wrong thing. The amp is two channel so you would run the LFE from one channel and the two reckhorns in mono from the other, you will need to limit the output of the amp to the reckhorns and also use a different curve.
I have the same amp and two LFE’s, one on the pedals and one under the seat amongst a few others. I know it’s a stretch but I would use a separate amp for the reckhorns and get something else for the NX 3000, but it’s not my money!
I also use SimHub, it’s great.

Thanks for this, I wasn’t sure if I could run that configuration for the 2 channels. Agreed a separate amp (and eventually more LFEs) will be best but if I can get started by splitting the shakers on one amp as you suggested, then I can get a better understanding in the meantime.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

Both Simhub and SimCommander provide much finer control over generated frequencies for 1% of users who actually feel that they need that tuning.
DSP in amp is totally not a must have feature, just get a good brand amp.
Behringer is Chinese made budget grade, not known for the best quality and reliability, with always on noisy active cooling. There are better things around.

 

[Moonmachine]

They are pretty noisy, quite an easy fix though If you are that way inclined. With headphones on I don’t hear them but I did swap the fans.