speaking of video cards

[jwa]

currrently have a radeon 7770. doesn't do too bad but have to turn down a few things here and there. would a r9 270 allow to max thing out? have an older quad core processor and using a 27" hd monitor. suggestions please.

 

[Connor Caple]

That is how the R9 280 card comes - as stock. The GTX660 costs the same, as stock. I think it's a valid comparison, unless you have some reason to make special allowances for NVidia cards?

 

[Heppsan]

I'm planning to "invest" in a new laptop in the end of the year, or in the beginning of next year.
It leaning towards an Asus.
But does anyone have any suggestions regarding the video card, which one is the best to go for?
GTX 870M, 880, 970 or 980?

 

[Blkout]

That is how the R9 280 card comes - as stock. The GTX660 costs the same, as stock. I think it's a valid comparison, unless you have some reason to make special allowances for NVidia cards?

TDP 140W vs 200W

Pretty big difference in power draw therefore, the R9 280 will generate more heat from that power draw. While the video card itself may run cooler with a decent cooler, that heat still has to be dissipated somewhere, and that goes into your room. Many Nvidia cards perform every bit as well and draw less power and generate less heat. That's a big factor for me but also why I stated in my original suggestion that's part of my decision and why I left AMD cards with that caveat. Its a personal preference for me, I understand some people don't mind their PC's being space heaters though. That being said, the R9 280 is a better performer than a 660. 660ti is a closer comparison.

 

[Connor Caple]

So, basically, we've agreed that NVidia cards at a similar price point are outperformed by it and that NVidia fit cheap, crappy cooling fans.

Glad we sorted that out.

 

[Andi Goodwin]

but at least they support there cards when they are older and have driver updates


Andi

 

[Connor Caple]

I think NVidia and AMD both manage that. I have, for example, an old system running with a HD2600XT that still works with the current AMD drivers which are updated regularly.

Look up how old that card is...

Some of these manufacturer comparisons just get silly and are obviously caused by people wearing rose-tinted glasses stamped with an AMD or NVidia logo.

I use whatever card is the cheapest that does the job I need it to do, everyone else should do the same.

 

[Sean Kenney]

Both companies put out great cards. I have had troubles and great times with both....and I own shares in nvidia....but have a 7790 card

 

[Sean Kenney]

I have been looking at new video cards as well...will be interesting to see how low AMD will drop their prices to compete.

290 if they get even cheaper or probably the 970 for me at this point.

 

[Connor Caple]

Well, I have about 10 days until I choose/buy my next card and currently it's looking like it might be a GTX760 as they seem to be coming down in price and slightly outperform the standard R9 280.

Depends what deal I can get on the day as all I want is the most game-frames per pound and if they are 20% more expensive for only 5% extra fps, I'll probably take the cheaper option and upgrade again next year.

Just hoping AMD haven't done anything nasty in the APU to stop the NVidia card performing as well as it should

 

[Sean Kenney]

I think the only thing they have is price cuts and I think it won't be much more than just happened for the time being.

When is their new chip to be out? March 2015?

 

[Connor Caple]

The Pascal (Stacked GPU Chip Architecture) isn't coming until 2016, from what I've read, but does do away with the need for SLI.

 

[Sean Kenney]

I meant AMDs

 

[Blkout]

So, basically, we've agreed that NVidia cards at a similar price point are outperformed by it and that NVidia fit cheap, crappy cooling fans.

Glad we sorted that out.

In the lower to midrange, AMD has the price/performance ratio advantage as long as you can live with more power draw, heat produced, and occasional driver performance issues, so to that I agree. Once you step up to enthusiast level cards above midrange, AMD has nothing at all that can compete with Nvidia in performance, power draw, or heat dissipation. And no, I don't agree with your statement that Nvidia uses "cheap, crappy cooling fans", that's so far from the truth its not even funny. Ask how many AMD owners have had issues with loud fans or burnt out fans. The Titan reference coolers on most of Nvidia's cards are actually outstanding for blower style coolers, they just prioritize lower noise over temps and are therefore quite comfortable at 80c which is where they are designed to run. However, you can easily adjust just the fan speed or curve to cut those temps down considerably with almost no increase in noise. Or, you can buy any one of the many non-reference cooler options available from many Nvidia manufacturers.

I'm not trying to insult you Connor, but you should spend more time on the PC hardware forums and learn a bit more about this stuff. I've been a member of many hardware forums for the last 8 years so I'm always engaged in conversations about the latest GPU's. I feel like I've been quite honest and fair in pointing out what I recommend and why. When you come back with statements like Nvidia uses cheap crappy cooling fans, I have to question your knowledge of GPU's. AMD is hurting right now and thus reflected in their recent price drops on all of their cards. They simply don't have anything to match Nvidia at their previous price points so now they hope you'll buy their cards with a bit of a performance edge over Nvidia in the lower to midrange but don't really care that they draw more power and generate more heat and as I stated before, I can live with that if anyone feels that's a non-issue for them however the current trend is less power draw and less heat for most users. The days of PC users have loud fans and PC's that get so hot that they could double as a space heater are starting to be a distant memory.


For the record, I'm not partial to AMD or Nvidia to be honest although you may think I'm partial to Nvidia based on this thread, but that's only a recent switch. I used Nvidia exclusively from the Riva TNT2 days all the way through until the GTX 285, at which point AMD had a better product with the HD 4870, so I started using AMD exclusively at that point for quite a few years, 4870, 4870x2, 5850 crossfire, 6870 crossfire, HD 7950, then I switched back to Nvidia again when with the 670 in SLI, 780 in SLI, and now 980 in SLI.

 

[Blkout]

Well, I have about 10 days until I choose/buy my next card and currently it's looking like it might be a GTX760 as they seem to be coming down in price and slightly outperform the standard R9 280.

Depends what deal I can get on the day as all I want is the most game-frames per pound and if they are 20% more expensive for only 5% extra fps, I'll probably take the cheaper option and upgrade again next year.

Just hoping AMD haven't done anything nasty in the APU to stop the NVidia card performing as well as it should

The GTX 760 is on par with the GTX 670 from the previous generation. I owned an AMD 7950 which is essentially the same as a R9 280 and I owned a GTX 670 after I sold my 7950. The 670 not only outperformed it but it was significantly quieter and cooler and I would expected the 760 to be the same in comparison to the R9 280. I know the recent price cuts on AMD's cars are tempting, but if power draw and heat dissipation is any concern to you, AMD is just not the best solution. The 760 is a solid midrange card.

 

[Sean Kenney]

If anyone is going to talk about fans, coil whine, cooling etc... you have to also talk about who made your card and the specific model. MSI, EVGA, Powercolor, Sapphire etc...

 

[Connor Caple]

Hehe - I do a lot of research. It was humour, @Blkout
I read Comp Sci at Uni 20 years ago, I'm an AI programmer, I've built all my own systems for 20 years now. As I said in a later post, I use whatever works and gives the most 'bang for the buck'.

Power consumption is rarely an issue, since I always fit Corsair 600W+ PSUs after having some cheaper ones fail on me over the first 10 years of builds.

I normally use Unigine benchmarks as they drive the cards best to show you which work well. It's hard to optimise your drivers for something that uses actual game video to test - unlike the '3D Mark' test which can be fooled.

Sample test of 2013 gaming cards with Unigine on normal DX11 settings

It will all depend on the prices at time of purchase as I can cope with the power consumption and, with Winter coming on, extra heat means I can turn the boiler off during the day while I'm working/playing on the PCs. (We have 7 of them for various purposes, the lower end ones built from hand-me-downs off the newer systems)

 

[Blkout]

Hehe - I do a lot of research. It was humour, @Blkout
I read Comp Sci at Uni 20 years ago, I'm an AI programmer, I've built all my own systems for 20 years now. As I said in a later post, I use whatever works and gives the most 'bang for the buck'.

Power consumption is rarely an issue, since I always fit Corsair 600W+ PSUs after having some cheaper ones fail on me over the first 10 years of builds.

I normally use Unigine benchmarks as they drive the cards best to show you which work well. It's hard to optimise your drivers for something that uses actual game video to test - unlike the '3D Mark' test which can be fooled.

Sample test of 2013 gaming cards with Unigine on normal DX11 settings

It will all depend on the prices at time of purchase as I can cope with the power consumption and, with Winter coming on, extra heat means I can turn the boiler off during the day while I'm working/playing on the PCs. (We have 7 of them for various purposes, the lower end ones built from hand-me-downs off the newer systems)

Roger that sir, that's why I said I wasn't trying to insult you. I figured you had a background in programming since I read somewhere here that you used to program AI for games. No offense intended.

If anyone is going to talk about fans, coil whine, cooling etc... you have to also talk about who made your card and the specific model. MSI, EVGA, Powercolor, Sapphire etc...

Coil/choke whine is grossly exaggerated as it relates to GPU's. Most people think its the GPU that's whining when its more often than not the chokes in the power supply or on the motherboard. I've read some people on the hardware forums returning as many 4 different brands of video cards complaining that they all whine when most likely it was their power supply or motherboard causing the problem. That being said, the fans that are used on the Titan blower style cooler on most Nvidia reference coolers seem to be made by the same manufacturer and are very high quality. You never read about the fans dying or making loud noises but there's tons of AMD cards on eBay with non-working fans or loud squealing fans and its most likely because they're using the same manufacturer for their fans too but not the same as Nvidia's since its a different style fans. The Nvidia reference cooler uses a squirrel cage type fan and the AMD's use a standard type fan.

 

[Sean Kenney]

Coil/choke whine is grossly exaggerated as it relates to GPU's. Most people think its the GPU that's whining when its more often than not the chokes in the power supply or on the motherboard. I've read some people on the hardware forums returning as many 4 different brands of video cards complaining that they all whine when most likely it was their power supply or motherboard causing the problem. That being said, the fans that are used on the Titan blower style cooler on most Nvidia reference coolers seem to be made by the same manufacturer and are very high quality. You never read about the fans dying or making loud noises but there's tons of AMD cards on eBay with non-working fans or loud squealing fans and its most likely because they're using the same manufacturer for their fans too but not the same as Nvidia's since its a different style fans. The Nvidia reference cooler uses a squirrel cage type fan and the AMD's use a standard type fan.

I don't know what you are getting at with this.

I am just saying if anyone is going to say anything good or bad about AMD or Nvidia they need to be specific as to the card and model they are referring(MSI, EVGA, Powercolor, Sapphire etc...)

Both AMD and Nvidia cards are great.

 

[Blkout]

I don't know what you are getting at with this.

I am just saying if anyone is going to say anything good or bad about AMD or Nvidia they need to be specific as to the card and model they are referring(MSI, EVGA, Powercolor, Sapphire etc...)

Both AMD and Nvidia cards are great.

Just saying that in regards to fans, most of them are made by the same manufacturer, even if MSI, EVGA, Powercolor, Sapphire makes the card itself. I was also stating that whoever makes the fans for the Titan style cooler used on many Nvidia cards rarely ever give any problem unlike whoever makes the fans for many AMD cards. That's all.