I think we all are mature enough here to do it without a flame war. So who is first? @Moderators: if you feel this is not a good idea,please accept my apologies and delete this thread.
FM4 So do we want to start a Forza4 vs GT5 comparison here?
- Thread starter Hiroshi Awazu
- Start date
Forza Motorsport 4 (Turn 10 Studios)
Well upon playing Forza more here are my views:
Graphics: Just as stunning as GT5. I will argue that with anyone anyday.
Driving Physics: I like better than GT5. In Forza when race tires are used, it is still not "Overgrippy" like GT5 hence you don't get the arcadish feeling. "Well you can just use Sport tires" is not a excuse! For some races you need to use Race tires.
Car Selection: WOW! is all i can say, PD really missed the mark there plus ten car DLC's a month, definitely will keep me excited month to month. Thank you Turn Ten for mixing up car selections from around the world. PD concentrated way too much and put too much emphasis on Japanese cars (Phew for not having overabundance of Skylines). I'm really liking the US car selection! Wait, I'm Japanese! roflmao!.
Track Selection: Well could be better but i'm hoping that DLC's will take care of that. So goes the same for GT5 i hope for the fans.
In Car View: Far better than GT5. The Field of View is better than GT5. I found on GT5 you sit way too close to dash or it feels like you are 6ft9 and you are sitting to high. The zoom option for in car view on GT5 doesn't help either, just makes things worse!.
Car Engine Sounds: Is second to none,by far the best in than ANY driving sim produced. And that is for all the cars in Forza.
Auto Vista: What a awesome thing to put in Forza, and to have Jeremy Clarkson as narrator to boot "Fantastic". It is also a great way to check out the cars of Forza.
Driving Challenges and Games: Awesome! i'm really diggin the Car Bowling LOL!
Photo Mode: Again awesome! I can't believe the Top Gear studio is in there!
Online Play: Well no XBL yet so i cannot judge but please feel free to enlighten me about it eg: Connection issues, Player behavior etc etc.
So all around even though i'm not online, i'm enjoying Forza 4 far more than i ever did than any of the GT series and i used to be a big fan of the series. I'm also glad that Forza was not rushed to be released at the same time as GT5. As far as i'm concerned, Turn Ten got Forza pretty much right from the start. My girlfriend is liking Forza too but won't play it until i get a wheel for it LOL! that is how much she is getting into driving games now
.
Way to go Turn Ten, you are all awesome!
Graphics: Just as stunning as GT5. I will argue that with anyone anyday.
Driving Physics: I like better than GT5. In Forza when race tires are used, it is still not "Overgrippy" like GT5 hence you don't get the arcadish feeling. "Well you can just use Sport tires" is not a excuse! For some races you need to use Race tires.
Car Selection: WOW! is all i can say, PD really missed the mark there plus ten car DLC's a month, definitely will keep me excited month to month. Thank you Turn Ten for mixing up car selections from around the world. PD concentrated way too much and put too much emphasis on Japanese cars (Phew for not having overabundance of Skylines). I'm really liking the US car selection! Wait, I'm Japanese! roflmao!.
Track Selection: Well could be better but i'm hoping that DLC's will take care of that. So goes the same for GT5 i hope for the fans.
In Car View: Far better than GT5. The Field of View is better than GT5. I found on GT5 you sit way too close to dash or it feels like you are 6ft9 and you are sitting to high. The zoom option for in car view on GT5 doesn't help either, just makes things worse!.
Car Engine Sounds: Is second to none,by far the best in than ANY driving sim produced. And that is for all the cars in Forza.
Auto Vista: What a awesome thing to put in Forza, and to have Jeremy Clarkson as narrator to boot "Fantastic". It is also a great way to check out the cars of Forza.
Driving Challenges and Games: Awesome! i'm really diggin the Car Bowling LOL!
Photo Mode: Again awesome! I can't believe the Top Gear studio is in there!
Online Play: Well no XBL yet so i cannot judge but please feel free to enlighten me about it eg: Connection issues, Player behavior etc etc.
So all around even though i'm not online, i'm enjoying Forza 4 far more than i ever did than any of the GT series and i used to be a big fan of the series. I'm also glad that Forza was not rushed to be released at the same time as GT5. As far as i'm concerned, Turn Ten got Forza pretty much right from the start. My girlfriend is liking Forza too but won't play it until i get a wheel for it LOL! that is how much she is getting into driving games now
.Way to go Turn Ten, you are all awesome!
This is about the only comment I can fully agree with in this entire thread.
From this comment alone I can see that some people are a little too sensitive for an opinion that differs from theirs. What I will say is that I love both of these games and find the write ups in this thread very biased, comparing F4 and GT5 by the strengths of F4 isn't really a comparison of the the two games, especially when the strengths of GT5 are ignored.
To be fair though, this is just the way these versus threads work and shouldn't be surprised to see these kind of comments.
Well, if GT5 is that good why not tell us its strenghts that F4 doesn't already have ?
Hi Carl, i did mention that i was a GT fan from the get go, I just feel that Forza4 is the winner this time around. I by no means was slamming GT5 fans at all for that would be wrong to do. My write up is based on my personal experience with the two games.
I did play GT5, and I personally don't know what it has more, and obviously you don't either...
Although I would like their Nordschleife !
Although I would like their Nordschleife !
If this is the case then im not sure how much of GT5 you have actually played, if at all fella. im not sure where this hostility towards me has come from, i have made no comparison between the the two nor have i shown any loyalty to either title, i commented on the biased nature of this thread.
So if someone asked who was better..... Man Utd or Man City and the majority said it was Man Utd, would you say that the posters were biased towards Man Utd?
Hiroshi asked for players opinions of the comparisons between F4 and GT5. I put down some opinions of my own, and because I felt F4 was better in the categories I mentioned, I'm all of a sudden biased. It's my opinion. I didn't break each game down in to a multitude of categories, I just highlighted several for my post.
I have every GT game that Polyphony ever released so feel I've played quite a bit of GT in my time. GT5 for all its 5 years plus in the making wasn't the great leap forward from GT4 I was expecting. I compared my early findings from F4 and compared them to GT5. I just feel at this time, F4 is the better of the two.
By all means, tell us what you feel GT5's strengths are, but be careful, as some folks may think you're showing a bias towards the game, lol.
And all I did was disagree, my reply wasn't aimed at anyone in particular (athougth it would seem you have chosen to take it that way)
but at these kind of threads in genral. no need to get so defensive fella, im not attacking you, your opinion or forza.
i wonder what kind of response i would get if i had.
but at these kind of threads in genral. no need to get so defensive fella, im not attacking you, your opinion or forza.
i wonder what kind of response i would get if i had.
See ? Again you're not even putting arguments in any ways !?
If you don't agree with what we said tell us why ? Simple really...
If you don't agree with what we said tell us why ? Simple really...
Moderators: Can we please close this thread for I honestly was not expecting this to happen. There is nothing wrong with comparing the two games, thats what we do in a racing community but obviously this isn't working out. So i'm very sorry that i started this thread for i really feel bad now that there is some tension among us here and this will be my last comment here.
In order to make a comparison you have to of played the games for at least X amount of hours, And no matter how good one is over the other, if you dont own that console it becomes a very expensive game and not worth it..
The thread doesn't need to be close just yet Hiroshi. People just need to calm down a bit and take a deep breath. Also don't apologize for starting a thread up. It's others who may need to act a bit more mature to differing opinions.
If one of you has GT5 then do a like for like comparison with only the facts, stats and maybe some screenshots. I remember seeing one in depth comparison in this thread, so why don't the people getting worked up, provide some helpful information to make a full comparison instead of slating another persons opinion.
really?
let me start by saying that i have aready stated why i do not agree with most of the comments in this thead
i have not written a comparison nor do i intend to, i have also not stated that i prefer one game over the other i haven't attacked anyones opinion in this thread but rather commented that i did not agree(while at the same time agreeing with a very valid point).
while i no longer have access to a playstation 3 or gt 5 i can tell you that i have played gt5 as much as i have forza 4 and have been a big fan of both franchises from the start to the point that i have owned every single one.
now if you guys are as mature as you say you are and not as zealous as you appear, what is it that i have said that is so offensive that some of you seem to feel the need to get so defensive?
let me start by saying that i have aready stated why i do not agree with most of the comments in this thead
i have not written a comparison nor do i intend to, i have also not stated that i prefer one game over the other i haven't attacked anyones opinion in this thread but rather commented that i did not agree(while at the same time agreeing with a very valid point).
while i no longer have access to a playstation 3 or gt 5 i can tell you that i have played gt5 as much as i have forza 4 and have been a big fan of both franchises from the start to the point that i have owned every single one.
now if you guys are as mature as you say you are and not as zealous as you appear, what is it that i have said that is so offensive that some of you seem to feel the need to get so defensive?
I wasn't going to post again, but this is my last. I think there have been 2 comparison posts, one by me, one by Hiroshi. You are claiming these comparisons have been done using Forza 4 and its strengths compared against GT5. If you actually read mine, which wasn't a full blown review or head-to-head of both games, but my impressions of playing Forza 4 for a number of days compared to months and months of GT5 using a few selected areas of both games.
I compared......
Feel of the cars through the game-pad
Sound
Car Modifications
Tracks
Graphics
Cockpit View
Career Mode
Marketplace - Buy/Sell Cars
Online Racing
How do you arrive at the fact that I have used Forza 4's strengths in my write-up? I selected elements that are present in both games and did a personal comparison. Because one game was better in a particular area (in my opinion) doesn't mean I have chosen a strength of a particular game game to show bias.
Maybe the only 'strength' I may have selected regards Forza 4 was the 'Rivals' mode, as GT5 doesn't have anything like this, but then that surely is reason for Forza 4 getting the nod in that particular area, much like using EA's 'Autolog' feature to compare to other racing games. Only Forza 4 can offer a challenge in this area as it has something similar with its 'Rivals' mode. GT5 doesn't so would lose out to NFS: Hot Pursuit in this category, but may very well out do it many others.
Because my overall conclusion was to prefer Forza 4, you claim I have used Forza's strengths to arrive at this outcome. Please tell me which of the nine categories listed above you feel are strengths of Forza and unfair to use in a comparison with GT5.
I compared......
Feel of the cars through the game-pad
Sound
Car Modifications
Tracks
Graphics
Cockpit View
Career Mode
Marketplace - Buy/Sell Cars
Online Racing
How do you arrive at the fact that I have used Forza 4's strengths in my write-up? I selected elements that are present in both games and did a personal comparison. Because one game was better in a particular area (in my opinion) doesn't mean I have chosen a strength of a particular game game to show bias.
Maybe the only 'strength' I may have selected regards Forza 4 was the 'Rivals' mode, as GT5 doesn't have anything like this, but then that surely is reason for Forza 4 getting the nod in that particular area, much like using EA's 'Autolog' feature to compare to other racing games. Only Forza 4 can offer a challenge in this area as it has something similar with its 'Rivals' mode. GT5 doesn't so would lose out to NFS: Hot Pursuit in this category, but may very well out do it many others.
Because my overall conclusion was to prefer Forza 4, you claim I have used Forza's strengths to arrive at this outcome. Please tell me which of the nine categories listed above you feel are strengths of Forza and unfair to use in a comparison with GT5.
lets not be silly about this fella, i have no problem with the areas of the game you chose to compare, it was the defining factors within them. i have nothing more to say other than , i have done nothing wrong here and yet every time i log in i have defend myself because i chose to disagree, and to be honest its becoming a bit of a chore, let the thread get back on track and get over it.
And the reason for that is that you don't stand your point with arguments, that's all...
It's the most annoying thing ever in a comparison when someone shows up, says "Ah ! I disagree with you all !" and don't say anything after that...
It's the most annoying thing ever in a comparison when someone shows up, says "Ah ! I disagree with you all !" and don't say anything after that...
As someone who rarely posts on RD, I saw this thread and decided I'd have a go at giving some further direct comparison between Forza 4 and GT5, in a few areas which haven't been covered yet.
One key point is that all comparisons so far have been discussing Forza 4 used via the controller. And sadly I've come to the conclusion (together with many other wheel users) that Forza 4 at launch is very well tuned for controller users, and that wheel users are somewhat left behind.
For the record: I currently use a Fanatec GT2 wheel with CSP pedals both for Forza 4 and for GT5 spec 2 (it runs in GT5 using the G25 preset which was added in Spec 2).
Running through the pros and cons:
Graphics: Close, but GT5 in 1080p is less jaggy and has slightly better lighting during normal gameplay or replays. Forza 4 however has guaranteed 60fps 720p gameplay and the trump card of the amazing homespace (Top Gear studio backdrop and glorious car models on show).
Sound: Forza has far more realistic sounds, but for some reason they sound just a bit too "in yer face". I would prefer Forza sounds but mixed to volume levels of GT5, i.e. less distortion.
Car catalogue: Forza 4 has an easy win here, vastly better car catalogue, all of high quality.
Car collecting: GT5 is after all a car collecting game more than anything, and the used car dealer idea is actually quite fun at making you feel like you want to just do one more race to see if something neat pops up. This may or may not be something you care about, but I rather like it. In comparison Forza 4 encourages you just to buy what you actually want to use for the different car classes, there's not much incentive to try all kinds of cars.
Single player mode: Forza 4's world tour is fun and I love being able to race my choice of car for most races. And rivals is a really great idea which will give considerable longevity. On the other hand, GT5's special events and license tests are more unique and interesting than anything Forza 4 can offer in single player, as are the various seasonals which encourage you to try cars from different periods to get you to browse through your car collection. So the two games cancel each other out in this respect.
Multiplayer mode: I don't race online much so I can't call this one.
Car Tuning: I'd call this one a tie. Forza is better in having a broader set of upgrade options, GT5 gives you more of a feeling of owning and maintaining a car (this might be a turn-off for some).
AI: Forza's AI is slightly aware of your presence, GT5 AI is totally dumb. Neither game is close to Simbin-quality AI.
Tracks: In terms of quantity of good real world tracks, I'd give Forza a slight edge. However, Forza has some glaring inaccuracies, including the fact that the Forza 4 Nordschleife is 15% oversize (I tested this personally). GT5 wins by having a far more accurate Nordschleife, and Spa is the bonus on top.
Physics: This is where it gets tricky. A race sim shows off the physics in two ways - how the cars behave, and what you feel through the FFB. For me those two are inherently linked together.
I get the impression that Forza has a more progressive tyre model, better suspension physics, more realistic tyre grip levels per car.... but the FFB is a lot worse. Almost no track surface information is communicated through the FFB, and there are currently a bunch of bugs around 900 degree wheel support which are very frustrating. For instance the steering doesn't feel linear in Forza (it's very twitchy in many cars), and there's no option to alter this. Likewise slides are too easy to catch which somewhat ruins the feeling of realism (supposedly because as soon as you oversteer the game switches to 270 degrees steering mode... fix for this is incoming). GT5 Spec 2 has noticeably improved wheel support including giving much more track surface information through the FFB and the improvements to the tyre model and suspension. Not flashy changes, but the more you play the more you appreciate them (especially after you dial the tyres back to Comfort Softs on the sports cars).
So with the current problems in Forza 4's FFB it's really hard to tell which underlying physics engine is currently better.
GT5 has been out for a year and I'm still playing. It's hard to tell which of the two I'll still be playing in another year. I've signed up to the Forza 4 season pass, so I have another 5 months of DLC to play through. But GT5's first DLC pack apparently sold over a million copies (mostly thanks to Spa) and they have now promised more every 2 months. Plus GT5 Spec 2 did seriously improve the core driving experience and there's no reason not to expect more of the same still to come.
Will Turn10 just add cars to Forza 4 and leave the core sim untouched, or will they continue to improve it and polish it as PD are doing for GT5?
Conclusion: In case it wasn't already clear, my conclusion is that both games have good and bad points. I happily play them both, and happily switch between them on a daily basis. Owning a multiplatform wheel (which I bought along with an XBox just for Forza 4) is the best solution.
One key point is that all comparisons so far have been discussing Forza 4 used via the controller. And sadly I've come to the conclusion (together with many other wheel users) that Forza 4 at launch is very well tuned for controller users, and that wheel users are somewhat left behind.
For the record: I currently use a Fanatec GT2 wheel with CSP pedals both for Forza 4 and for GT5 spec 2 (it runs in GT5 using the G25 preset which was added in Spec 2).
Running through the pros and cons:
Graphics: Close, but GT5 in 1080p is less jaggy and has slightly better lighting during normal gameplay or replays. Forza 4 however has guaranteed 60fps 720p gameplay and the trump card of the amazing homespace (Top Gear studio backdrop and glorious car models on show).
Sound: Forza has far more realistic sounds, but for some reason they sound just a bit too "in yer face". I would prefer Forza sounds but mixed to volume levels of GT5, i.e. less distortion.
Car catalogue: Forza 4 has an easy win here, vastly better car catalogue, all of high quality.
Car collecting: GT5 is after all a car collecting game more than anything, and the used car dealer idea is actually quite fun at making you feel like you want to just do one more race to see if something neat pops up. This may or may not be something you care about, but I rather like it. In comparison Forza 4 encourages you just to buy what you actually want to use for the different car classes, there's not much incentive to try all kinds of cars.
Single player mode: Forza 4's world tour is fun and I love being able to race my choice of car for most races. And rivals is a really great idea which will give considerable longevity. On the other hand, GT5's special events and license tests are more unique and interesting than anything Forza 4 can offer in single player, as are the various seasonals which encourage you to try cars from different periods to get you to browse through your car collection. So the two games cancel each other out in this respect.
Multiplayer mode: I don't race online much so I can't call this one.
Car Tuning: I'd call this one a tie. Forza is better in having a broader set of upgrade options, GT5 gives you more of a feeling of owning and maintaining a car (this might be a turn-off for some).
AI: Forza's AI is slightly aware of your presence, GT5 AI is totally dumb. Neither game is close to Simbin-quality AI.
Tracks: In terms of quantity of good real world tracks, I'd give Forza a slight edge. However, Forza has some glaring inaccuracies, including the fact that the Forza 4 Nordschleife is 15% oversize (I tested this personally). GT5 wins by having a far more accurate Nordschleife, and Spa is the bonus on top.
Physics: This is where it gets tricky. A race sim shows off the physics in two ways - how the cars behave, and what you feel through the FFB. For me those two are inherently linked together.
I get the impression that Forza has a more progressive tyre model, better suspension physics, more realistic tyre grip levels per car.... but the FFB is a lot worse. Almost no track surface information is communicated through the FFB, and there are currently a bunch of bugs around 900 degree wheel support which are very frustrating. For instance the steering doesn't feel linear in Forza (it's very twitchy in many cars), and there's no option to alter this. Likewise slides are too easy to catch which somewhat ruins the feeling of realism (supposedly because as soon as you oversteer the game switches to 270 degrees steering mode... fix for this is incoming). GT5 Spec 2 has noticeably improved wheel support including giving much more track surface information through the FFB and the improvements to the tyre model and suspension. Not flashy changes, but the more you play the more you appreciate them (especially after you dial the tyres back to Comfort Softs on the sports cars).
So with the current problems in Forza 4's FFB it's really hard to tell which underlying physics engine is currently better.
GT5 has been out for a year and I'm still playing. It's hard to tell which of the two I'll still be playing in another year. I've signed up to the Forza 4 season pass, so I have another 5 months of DLC to play through. But GT5's first DLC pack apparently sold over a million copies (mostly thanks to Spa) and they have now promised more every 2 months. Plus GT5 Spec 2 did seriously improve the core driving experience and there's no reason not to expect more of the same still to come.
Will Turn10 just add cars to Forza 4 and leave the core sim untouched, or will they continue to improve it and polish it as PD are doing for GT5?
Conclusion: In case it wasn't already clear, my conclusion is that both games have good and bad points. I happily play them both, and happily switch between them on a daily basis. Owning a multiplatform wheel (which I bought along with an XBox just for Forza 4) is the best solution.
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