As you may of read HERE, we are trying a new format to the racing club. We hope you will like the changes but if you have any issues or ideas, please post them in this thread and we will take all of the posts into consideration. 
rFactor Racing Club Feedback
- Thread starter Adam Eggbeer
- Start date
Got me a bundle gift over at Steam (Race On, 07 and STCC) and I was prowling thru their Club forums and I've noticed a bit of panic going on there with the new system. I've read the whole tread, so I got a pretty good idea about how things are turning out there.
There are good and bad sides of this I think. But sadly, the good seems to be overrun by the bad things, so I'll start with them.
1. 3 events stuck in the same tread. If the event is successful, like the rF V8s, I recon all 3 events will be full. Would be kinda hard to read all that goes on in the tread.
2. Lack of sign-up list. I'm used to seeing who I'll be racing with. I know a lot of the guys, they know me too. We sort of click together. Not seeing them will trigger an automatic reaction - Oh, they're not racing; which leads to - Why should I bother then; sort of thing.
3. Possible lack of Admins/Staff in the non-EU events. Do I need to give an explain for that one. We need you guys ! Desperately at times.
4. Revision of 3. Lack of Staff, means lack of decent reports, means lack of infractions. I know there are usually not that many applied, but at least the Staff is bothered to look at all Lap 1 incidents by RD's laws and if that's taken away, non-EU events will become carnage.
5. Revision of 2. Lack of sign-up posts, means that you might get around to spend 3-4 days, working out your setup and/or learning the track and then when it comes to joining the server - Ops, server is full. Yeah, sure, a second server will solve that, but I would personally like to race with the same mates that I'm used to race. The same guys that check the forums daily, see if there's a new interesting event put up and sign for it. In case a second server pops up, I'm not sure I'll be bothered about it. S1 will be full and S2 will have 10-15 people tops. And let me tell you - last WTM Club Race @ St. Peter... something, wasn't that much fun exactly because we weren't 25+ in it.
6. Are you actually sure that this is going to make the RD Staff's workload less ? Coz I'm kinda thinking the other way around. Just think about it - no sign-up post, people show up from outta nowhere in the last minute or so. No organization in the non-EU events. Possible last minute 2nd server has to be put up for something like the V8s (and F1 92 perhaps). The "unguarded" non-EU events might lead to a flood of infraction appeals, with pretty much everyone getting their heads on fire. And last but not least - people like me moaning on the forums about the new system. Did I just wrote that ?! Never mind - continue reading please.
7. Drop of interest. A lot of people will just turn their backs on this because they either don't understand the new system and are far more used to the old one, or simply because of the all that's been mentioned above. And we all know how one thing leads to another.
The good things are that people who are new to RD, I mean - joining from now on, will have easier access to many good races and that the RD site, with the upcomming Auto Sign-up feature that I've been reading about, will start working on itself, without the need of that much men power to run the events.
And that's pretty much all the good side I think. Sure 3 different time zones are nice, but having two of them without supervision by RD Staff member is just like joining any old public server.
Would've loved if that whole thing was tested for a month before introduced to us. Yeah, I knew sort of about it, but I didn't read in-dept. Prolly my fault. I would've ringed the bell back then. Also I think it's a bit of a mistake to start it before the new Sign-up system is being introduced.
I loved the things how they were when I joined RD. We had Rankings, which were awesome. Events were packed by top level people, which was awesome. We DIDN'T had stupid Facebook support, which was totally super awesome. And we didn't had that confusing new Club Racing system that's causing all the mess, which was awesome.
RD in general was just AWESOME ! And why fix something that ain't broken really ?
There are good and bad sides of this I think. But sadly, the good seems to be overrun by the bad things, so I'll start with them.
1. 3 events stuck in the same tread. If the event is successful, like the rF V8s, I recon all 3 events will be full. Would be kinda hard to read all that goes on in the tread.
2. Lack of sign-up list. I'm used to seeing who I'll be racing with. I know a lot of the guys, they know me too. We sort of click together. Not seeing them will trigger an automatic reaction - Oh, they're not racing; which leads to - Why should I bother then; sort of thing.
3. Possible lack of Admins/Staff in the non-EU events. Do I need to give an explain for that one. We need you guys ! Desperately at times.
4. Revision of 3. Lack of Staff, means lack of decent reports, means lack of infractions. I know there are usually not that many applied, but at least the Staff is bothered to look at all Lap 1 incidents by RD's laws and if that's taken away, non-EU events will become carnage.
5. Revision of 2. Lack of sign-up posts, means that you might get around to spend 3-4 days, working out your setup and/or learning the track and then when it comes to joining the server - Ops, server is full. Yeah, sure, a second server will solve that, but I would personally like to race with the same mates that I'm used to race. The same guys that check the forums daily, see if there's a new interesting event put up and sign for it. In case a second server pops up, I'm not sure I'll be bothered about it. S1 will be full and S2 will have 10-15 people tops. And let me tell you - last WTM Club Race @ St. Peter... something, wasn't that much fun exactly because we weren't 25+ in it.
6. Are you actually sure that this is going to make the RD Staff's workload less ? Coz I'm kinda thinking the other way around. Just think about it - no sign-up post, people show up from outta nowhere in the last minute or so. No organization in the non-EU events. Possible last minute 2nd server has to be put up for something like the V8s (and F1 92 perhaps). The "unguarded" non-EU events might lead to a flood of infraction appeals, with pretty much everyone getting their heads on fire. And last but not least - people like me moaning on the forums about the new system. Did I just wrote that ?! Never mind - continue reading please.
7. Drop of interest. A lot of people will just turn their backs on this because they either don't understand the new system and are far more used to the old one, or simply because of the all that's been mentioned above. And we all know how one thing leads to another.
The good things are that people who are new to RD, I mean - joining from now on, will have easier access to many good races and that the RD site, with the upcomming Auto Sign-up feature that I've been reading about, will start working on itself, without the need of that much men power to run the events.
And that's pretty much all the good side I think. Sure 3 different time zones are nice, but having two of them without supervision by RD Staff member is just like joining any old public server.
Would've loved if that whole thing was tested for a month before introduced to us. Yeah, I knew sort of about it, but I didn't read in-dept. Prolly my fault. I would've ringed the bell back then. Also I think it's a bit of a mistake to start it before the new Sign-up system is being introduced.
I loved the things how they were when I joined RD. We had Rankings, which were awesome. Events were packed by top level people, which was awesome. We DIDN'T had stupid Facebook support, which was totally super awesome. And we didn't had that confusing new Club Racing system that's causing all the mess, which was awesome.
RD in general was just AWESOME ! And why fix something that ain't broken really ?
Nik makes some great points the main one being if it ain't broke don't fix it.
Also, with the old system you could spend 3 or 4 days practising assured that you would get a spot in the race, now you cant be sure of your spot so what will happen? People will join the server 2 or 3 hours early to make sure of a spot. Go away and do all of the real life stuff that needs doing and come back at the time they usually would join.
I personally don't understand the logic behind this other than to make the races at better times for non Eu folk, but they will be running in non admin servers where you might have AFK people which will prevent the sessions being changed by vote. We had the same thing happen at Hockenheim the other week.
Also, we ran a Megane race with no admins. It went quite well but when it came time to change sessions, it took a long time to get people to vote.
Can someone from RD tell us the main reason for the change? If it is to reduce your own work load i dont think it will, especialy as you will have so many incidents to review if the standard of driving reduces.
If you good RD people needed to reduce your workload, surely you could have asked the community for help. RD has plenty of dedicated guys who would probably welcome the chance to get involved in helping out - example, I could have easily run the sign up list for F1 and posted the Race details on a weekly basis.
I have heard Scott Beck refer to another F1 1992 server he runs in, but his main complaint there is the lack of people. If this system spreads the existing 13 or 14 hardcore regulars Sunday night crew over 3 races, we will have 3 races of smaller fields and less quality, which means eventually people will be off to race elsewhere and the events will die.
Also, with the old system you could spend 3 or 4 days practising assured that you would get a spot in the race, now you cant be sure of your spot so what will happen? People will join the server 2 or 3 hours early to make sure of a spot. Go away and do all of the real life stuff that needs doing and come back at the time they usually would join.
I personally don't understand the logic behind this other than to make the races at better times for non Eu folk, but they will be running in non admin servers where you might have AFK people which will prevent the sessions being changed by vote. We had the same thing happen at Hockenheim the other week.
Also, we ran a Megane race with no admins. It went quite well but when it came time to change sessions, it took a long time to get people to vote.
Can someone from RD tell us the main reason for the change? If it is to reduce your own work load i dont think it will, especialy as you will have so many incidents to review if the standard of driving reduces.
If you good RD people needed to reduce your workload, surely you could have asked the community for help. RD has plenty of dedicated guys who would probably welcome the chance to get involved in helping out - example, I could have easily run the sign up list for F1 and posted the Race details on a weekly basis.
I have heard Scott Beck refer to another F1 1992 server he runs in, but his main complaint there is the lack of people. If this system spreads the existing 13 or 14 hardcore regulars Sunday night crew over 3 races, we will have 3 races of smaller fields and less quality, which means eventually people will be off to race elsewhere and the events will die.
As a fairly new member to RD I am quite shocked at the way things have been changed. I didn't have any problems joining in with club events when i first joined and thought the system in place worked well. I see that some of the admin/mods keep referring to how much work it takes to organise events and keep lists updated etc. Maybe instead of changing the way club events are organised the real solution to all this is to have more mods. Seems to me if the workload is too much then more staff are required.
I have been admin/moderator on other sites where we ran leagues and casual events. If you drop the sign ups then, from experience, you can expect the quality of the events to drop. People will have less respect for the rules and regulations and like others have said, it isn't long before you might as well join a public server because it ends up being pretty much the same.
The idea to have the server open for the different time zones is good in theory but I think it still needs a little tweaking. The "i will attend" thread really needs to be separated into the different time zones, especially when there is no sign up list. The admins are quick to remind us that they have lives outside RD which is a fair point, but so do we. It's quite time consuming and not much fun trawling through countless pages in a thread where maybe a 3rd of the information in there isn't relevant to the event you intend to race.
I think it would be a good idea to have general moderators of each club section of the forum as there is now. Then in each section have a small group of event moderators who's job is only moderating events. You could even have a different person resposible for moderating events each day. Mod1 does Mondays events, Mod2 does Tuesday, Mod3 does Wednesday etc. That would mean an events mod would have to look after 1 thread.
There seems to be a lot of the more established RD users up in arms about the changes being made. It seems to me that if they care about their club nights that much, they must all race in them regularly. If someone knows they regularly attend a certain event why not volunteer to moderate that event.
Maybe I'm being a little outspoken, especially for a fairly new member. I will apologise now if any of my views or comments have offended anyone.
I have been admin/moderator on other sites where we ran leagues and casual events. If you drop the sign ups then, from experience, you can expect the quality of the events to drop. People will have less respect for the rules and regulations and like others have said, it isn't long before you might as well join a public server because it ends up being pretty much the same.
The idea to have the server open for the different time zones is good in theory but I think it still needs a little tweaking. The "i will attend" thread really needs to be separated into the different time zones, especially when there is no sign up list. The admins are quick to remind us that they have lives outside RD which is a fair point, but so do we. It's quite time consuming and not much fun trawling through countless pages in a thread where maybe a 3rd of the information in there isn't relevant to the event you intend to race.
I think it would be a good idea to have general moderators of each club section of the forum as there is now. Then in each section have a small group of event moderators who's job is only moderating events. You could even have a different person resposible for moderating events each day. Mod1 does Mondays events, Mod2 does Tuesday, Mod3 does Wednesday etc. That would mean an events mod would have to look after 1 thread.
There seems to be a lot of the more established RD users up in arms about the changes being made. It seems to me that if they care about their club nights that much, they must all race in them regularly. If someone knows they regularly attend a certain event why not volunteer to moderate that event.
Maybe I'm being a little outspoken, especially for a fairly new member. I will apologise now if any of my views or comments have offended anyone.
Thanks for feedback guys .
Just to confirm this is an experimental exercise to see how it will go (we're hoping good), should it become clear that it does not work then the old system may well come back.
.Just to confirm this is an experimental exercise to see how it will go (we're hoping good), should it become clear that it does not work then the old system may well come back.
Thanks guys, much appreciated. As Lee says, we are trying this out and can easily make changes if we need to.
With the regards to not having an admin/staff member on a server, we've done it before when one of us cannot be there and 99 times out of 100 it runs fine. The same can happen with the old system as well and we expect you to respect the rules and change sessions at the right time. You can still report incidents to us and we can still take action so there is no reason to ignore the rules during unstaffed events.
As Lee says, we are trying this out and can easily make changes if we need to.With the regards to not having an admin/staff member on a server, we've done it before when one of us cannot be there and 99 times out of 100 it runs fine. The same can happen with the old system as well and we expect you to respect the rules and change sessions at the right time. You can still report incidents to us and we can still take action so there is no reason to ignore the rules during unstaffed events.
I'm all for trying new things to help improve racing. Having said that, I am going to stick to the original race time, 19:00GMT. It is perfect for me. The experimental time for the F1 race for the USA is right at dinner time for me. Don't think my wife will like that much.
The other league Steve is referring to is SimCar. It is a USA based league that runs on Mondays and Thursdays at 6pm PST. Mondays they race an Endurance mod, Thursdays the run the F1 1992 mod. Over the last year the numbers of drivers have dropped dramatically. Not sure why though. On Thursday, racing for an hour with 7,8, maybe 9 drivers isn't much fun. I find racing with RD on Sundays with almost full grids is a lot better, and that is why I show up Sundays and not Mondays or Thursdays for SimCar.
The other league Steve is referring to is SimCar. It is a USA based league that runs on Mondays and Thursdays at 6pm PST. Mondays they race an Endurance mod, Thursdays the run the F1 1992 mod. Over the last year the numbers of drivers have dropped dramatically. Not sure why though. On Thursday, racing for an hour with 7,8, maybe 9 drivers isn't much fun. I find racing with RD on Sundays with almost full grids is a lot better, and that is why I show up Sundays and not Mondays or Thursdays for SimCar.
I'm totally confused and worried that a good thing will get broken. I agree with Steve on all points. If the point is to get more of the EU drivers involved then I understand but that's why I race with RD. F1 Sim racers are scarce here in North America. I agree with Scott. Racing in larger fields is always more fun. From what I understand and read of this new format I'm going to watch and find out when the biggest fields join and try to join there. IMO this new format is catering to a specific set of drivers and you just want to be 'polite' about it for whatever reason. Because the faster drivers don't want to race with slower or the EU drivers don't like the time of the races. Either way why not just start an official league and have qualifying for it? Dam NASCAR I hate it.
Its not that at all its to offer events to more people. The system is designed to allow people who can't make the 19:00 to race at RD. Before this all our events were EU (in rFactor), now were allowing players from the US and Oceania to race here too. I still am expecting the most popular events to be the EU but it allows extra races for those who are unable to attend those.
"Its not that at all its to offer events to more people."
That's exactly what I was thinking when the new races were announced. I'm pretty sure 19:00GMT is no good for the guys in the Asia/Oceania areas. You may see some decent grids with the 10:00GMT race times for them.
Not sure about the US time though.
19:00GMT still works the best for me, but then again, who am I? Just an old retired guy that loves to race, that's who. Yeah!
That's exactly what I was thinking when the new races were announced. I'm pretty sure 19:00GMT is no good for the guys in the Asia/Oceania areas. You may see some decent grids with the 10:00GMT race times for them.
Not sure about the US time though.
19:00GMT still works the best for me, but then again, who am I? Just an old retired guy that loves to race, that's who. Yeah!
To be honest,it won't really affect me much at all. I'm like Scott,the sunday race suits me just fine. So for now,that's where i'll be.
If there are times i can make the other race times? Like during holidays or when my family's away.
I think there are certain things that RD do,which really make this work! Sign ins,having staff present etc. Really makes us respect what they're trying to achieve.
I have seen this happen before,(not sure if i can mention the site)and that is what has led me to RD. That's not to say the other site isn't doing well,i'm sure it is. It just became more like any other server,anyone showing up,lack of respect for admin,long standing members,driving standards and rules etc. It was sad to watch it go the way it did. People just drifted off and went elsewhere. Relationships lost.
mental thought- anyone else noticing alot of faceless/infoless profiles lately? mmmmm?
Some people don't like change,some embrace it. Me? ''If it ain't broken? Don't fix it''.
But! There's nothing wrong,with havin' a wee(scottish for small) 'look see', is there? Naaah. Let's(RD)give it a go and see what happens. Nothing ventured,nothing gained.
Good luck RD ;-)
If there are times i can make the other race times? Like during holidays or when my family's away.
I think there are certain things that RD do,which really make this work! Sign ins,having staff present etc. Really makes us respect what they're trying to achieve.
I have seen this happen before,(not sure if i can mention the site)and that is what has led me to RD. That's not to say the other site isn't doing well,i'm sure it is. It just became more like any other server,anyone showing up,lack of respect for admin,long standing members,driving standards and rules etc. It was sad to watch it go the way it did. People just drifted off and went elsewhere. Relationships lost.
mental thought- anyone else noticing alot of faceless/infoless profiles lately? mmmmm?
Some people don't like change,some embrace it. Me? ''If it ain't broken? Don't fix it''.
But! There's nothing wrong,with havin' a wee(scottish for small) 'look see', is there? Naaah. Let's(RD)give it a go and see what happens. Nothing ventured,nothing gained.
Good luck RD ;-)
Oh yeah, sure. I'm open minded towards that change and I'm going to give it a go for sure. I'm not going to back out of my favorite Club races just to sabotage it. On the opposite - I'll even dive into few AUS time based events ... coz I can, and see if I can help increase the populations of the events in those time zones. Sure lag won't be an issue with my 40/20 mbs connection.
Looking forward seeing how all this works out.
Looking forward seeing how all this works out.
For the events during the weekday, most of the North/South American drivers will be at work/school, and the Asian/Oceania drivers are asleep or getting up ready to go to school/work when the EU events take place. As Lee said, we just want to open it up to more people.
I'm sorry I know sometimes I come off as being 'sarcastic' in my writing; I really wasn't trying to be but when I go back and read my responses sometimes I think I could have said it another way. Simply put the 92 mod and RD is the best Sim Racing experience I've had hands down. Like anything else I enjoy I hate to see it change or come to an end. Like it's been said over and over we've had a great bunch of respectful fun drivers at the core of Sunday races up to this point. I only hope that will continue. I'm willing to race anytime anywhere when it's been as good as RD Club has been. I just wish all the NASCAR drivers here were F1 fanatics like me. Then we could really break up the regions geographically and still have full fields. FSR tried to do the geographical thing a long time ago; I hope RD's attempt goes better.
Chris Butcher
Red Bull Gridsters 2012 Champion
I have some feedback.
Bring the Clio's back!
Bring the Clio's back!
My only hope is that there will be some sort of Thread opened from the staff after a few months with some kind of (honest) review of the format so far. i.e has it actually done what it was meant to do. Have the event numbers gone up. How many complaints have been registered, has the standard of driving gone down/stayed the same etc...
One of the best things to happen recently was the advance announcement of club events. Can we have this again please - I realise some of you blokes are very busy so if you need help or suggestions, just ask, I'm sure some of the F1 1992 drivers will be happy to assist in recommendations for circuits.
You mean this?
http://www.racedepartment.com/rfactor-racing-club/52257-rfactor-racing-club-schedule.html
Sure Adam and Lee will update with some tracks soon.
http://www.racedepartment.com/rfactor-racing-club/52257-rfactor-racing-club-schedule.html
Sure Adam and Lee will update with some tracks soon.
You mean this?
http://www.racedepartment.com/rfactor-racing-club/52257-rfactor-racing-club-schedule.html
Sure Adam and Lee will update with some tracks soon.
Yes thats it. Having 3 events planned in advance was excellent.
Steve, thats the plan to keep updating that thread so 3 events were already in there. Sadly I've been a bit busy will be sorted soon though
.
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