rFactor 2 | Competition System Development Blog Post #2 Released

Cote Dazur

SIM Addict
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Ottawa
I would be glad to participate but at this point RF2 does not want to launch, cant even finish verifying on steam, Needless to say it is my only game having this issue, all other launch and run just fine. Let's all hope RF2 is off beta stage in a near by future.:roflmao:

Edit: after many trials, I eventually launched the game and it was running fine, no idea what was preventing it from running earlier. I had a nice race around Sebring, all good. :)
 
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Guys, go cheack the Steam workshop. The Enduracers team released the Alpine GT4 Series mod.
Also, check the recent tracks list.
I've played mostly with Enduracers's cars, they felt great, it reminded me of gtr2 (alms mod). It was before the AI had been broken, I don't know whether the mod still works fine. Have the graphics been updated to the latest rfactor2's features?
 
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I was refering to the endurance series, gt4, slow cars, are not my cup of tea. I just read the steam page of.the mod, last update was in january 2019. And some have compatbility issues between the mod and the new UI. Mmm
 
even if not all cars would have to be purchased to race against them, they still would need to be installed either way, also if the situation comes where only one car is needed no packs will be there

and the Reiza Pack thing you mentioned is only down to Reiza, not S397, only Reiza has the legal rights to change anything, which they said they plan on doing sometime this year if all works out
I am not talking about online whatsoever. It bugs me that I don't have a choice if content I bought will be installed, especially with a modular sim like this one. Apparently it is a known design decision to automatically reinstall if you unsubscribe from it. But then why give the option to unsubscribe in the first place? It's a mess.

It might be down to Reiza, yes, but it is on rFactor 2's official content store. If S397 cannot urge Reiza to update it, I really think they could do it themselves, after all it is in THEIR best interest that content they sell represent them well. After all, we are talking about a couple of pictures inside the package, that S397 has the tools for to create, since they made it! Pictures that are on the content store, but not in-game! I am guessing it would take 30 minutes for a car tops. But old content is neglected anyway. Just pump out the new one to make money... Just compare the, let's say GT3 R interior to the C8R's. Comparable? Nope. Is it going to be updated? No word about that... I wouldn't hold my breath though... If it was constantly kept up to date, I would say buying content for rF2 is a no brainer.
 
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Agree, after all that time.without having launched the game, and so many mods subscribed, I would not know which car to use. I don't know whether the content I've paid for before, 1st formula E, kartsim, 1st gt3 pack, sebring, reiza pack, is up to date or just unusable. And the original rfactor2 content? And there is no indication about that ingame. That would be simple to implement. By the way, why van't we have categories which makes sense? "Reiza pack" for example, "enduracers series".

The presentation is a huge mess, not any UI can help if the logic isn't there. AC at least tried to use meta data to allow easy search with keywords. It's far from perfect with mods, but at least with official content it's fine.

Let me guess, that's the "code" thing... well, if everything wrong is linked to the code, just hire competent coders and get rid of all the bad code and stay focus on that until all of these awful issues are solved. Better 2 more years on the code than 2 more with the same issues and new ones, half features, if not broken, not meeting the expectations, the promises.
 
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I am not talking about online whatsoever. It bugs me that I don't have a choice if content I bought will be installed, especially with a modular sim like this one. Apparently it is a known design decision to automatically reinstall if you unsubscribe from it. But then why give the option to unsubscribe in the first place? It's a mess.

It might be down to Reiza, yes, but it is on rFactor 2's official content store. If S397 cannot urge Reiza to update it, I really think they could do it themselves, after all it is in THEIR best interest that content they sell represent them well. After all, we are talking about a couple of pictures inside the package, that S397 has the tools for to create, since they made it! Pictures that are on the content store, but not in-game! I am guessing it would take 30 minutes for a car tops. But old content is neglected anyway. Just pump out the new one to make money... Just compare the, let's say GT3 R interior to the C8R's. Comparable? Nope. Is it going to be updated? No word about that... I wouldn't hold my breath though... If it was constantly kept up to date, I would say buying content for rF2 is a no brainer.
What a load of nonesense, really. Following your logic Steam should take all the games off their store page that don't have a perfect user rating and follow their standards. It's a freaking DLC by a 3rd party developer, so get over it and stop being a drama queen. You can still use the content and if you really feel the urge to constantly complain about something, then make a request in the respective threat in the rF2 forum or in the Reiza forum. Renato will have to deal with it.

And why do people keep on banging that they can't uninstall content that they don't use? It is like that for the majority of games that I own, yet rF2 is the one and only sim where I see people mentioning this as an issue. There is never enough cheese for the whine it seems. If you don't want to use the content simply ignore it. Or have you installed the game on 3,5 inch Floppy disks? It's getting ridiciolous the more time people have at hand to find something that they can complain about. I mean, there are so many issues in all of the sims and different products, that are really worth mentioning and people come up with nonesense like that.

Maybe it's the right time for you to move on to the perfect alternative product XYZ for you, because there is no enjoyment to be gained within rF2.
 
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If you own Packs but only require an individual item then it looks like you'll still only need to buy that individual item not the entire bundle (I think), again bearing in mind this is Beta and they may well tweak things as it progresses. Note, individual Cars & Tracks could also get special discounts in the store, exactly what RaceRoom are doing this week with reference to their Multi Class Ranking Races for the coming week.

This quote From Marcel was in reference to one of the first Series in the Comp System a week or so ago:

"It's important to know that you need to subscribe and therefore own all content to sign up. If you do not own all content, we will try to make you the cheapest possible offer based on our current bundles in the store. We put that proposal in your shopping cart and leave it up to you to buy these items, make changes or simply decide to back out. Note that this also means that sometimes you get an individual item that is also part of a pack, so we encourage you to look if this is indeed what you want to buy or if you want to go for the full pack in such cases.

Note that we did not aim to optimize this series in any way for people who are completely new to rFactor 2 so we realize that it's not the cheapest competition to sign up for if you do not own any of the content yet. We'll always keep hosting competitions based on free content so there will be something for everybody."

I perfectly understand this, but the cars you'd most likely want to have are at least all of the GT3 and/or GTE (unless you're going to do - for example - "endurance bundle 1 competition" instead of "GTE competition").
Assuming you're new this makes you want GT3 pack + ferrari 488 or both endurance bundles + ferrari 488 (35€ for either one), and you know that after spending those 35€, when (there's no if) a new car comes out, you're going to be forced to spend 5€ more unless you don't want your 35€ becoming basically useless to play online. And that's something i REALLY don't like.
I'like to buy the ferrari, both GT3 and GTE, but won't do so untill i see some more reasonable price or price policy, i also refused to buy endurance bundle 2 because of the not-included ferrari GTE, basically forcing you to buy it separately anyway to get the complete pack. It'snot even really about the very few more €, it's the policy itself that's wrong!

EDIT: just for fairness, i want to add RF2 is my go-to sim right now and i really like how it's developing, even if at a slow pace, but excpecially because of that i'd like a DLC system that allows users to get complete content packages at fair prices, either by allowing them to not buy entire categories or by at least giving them a discount on packs with owned content (as raceroom does wonderfully, and as a fact i for sure have spent more €/playtime on that than on RF2)
 
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Agree, after all that time.without having launched the game, and so many mods subscribed, I would not know which car to use. I don't know whether the content I've paid for before, 1st formula E, kartsim, 1st gt3 pack, sebring, reiza pack, is up to date or just unusable. And the original rfactor2 content? And there is no indication about that ingame. That would be simple to implement. By the way, why van't we have categories which makes sense? "Reiza pack" for example, "enduracers series".

The presentation is a huge mess, not any UI can help if the logic isn't there. AC at least tried to use meta data to allow easy search with keywords. It's far from perfect with mods, but at least with official content it's fine.

Let me guess, that's the "code" thing... well, if everything wrong is linked to the code, just hire competent coders and get rid of all the bad code and stay focus on that until all of these awful issues are solved. Better 2 more years on the code than 2 more with the same issues and new ones, half features, if not broken, not meeting the expectations, the promises.
You have a search function for content, how about just using it? Content get's updated automaticely if it is distributed via the steam workshop, so it is alot easier than in AC to know if your content is up to date or not, even with mods. Why is something like that considered a mess? How about simply trying the content and making up your mind? There are two different FE cars - that I don't own btw - so what really keeps you from simply using them? I don't get it.

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What a load of nonesense, really. Following your logic Steam should take all the games off their store page that don't have a perfect user rating and follow their standards. It's a freaking DLC by a 3rd party developer, so get over it and stop being a drama queen. You can still use the content and if you really feel the urge to constantly complain about something, then make a request in the respective threat in the rF2 forum or in the Reiza forum. Renato will have to deal with it.

And why do people keep on banging that they can't uninstall content that they don't use? It is like that for the majority of games that I own, yet rF2 is the one and only sim where I see people mentioning this as an issue. There is never enough cheese for the whine it seems. If you don't want to use the content simply ignore it. Or have you installed the game on 3,5 inch Floppy disks? It's getting ridiciolous the more time people have at hand to find something that they can complain about. I mean, there are so many issues in all of the sims and different products, that are really worth mentioning and people come up with nonesense like that.

Maybe it's the right time for you to move on to the perfect alternative product XYZ for you, because there is no enjoyment to be gained within rF2.
Mate, yes, complaining about uninstalling topic is not something "crucially important". Nowadays games have become enormous in size and it would be nice to save some space whenever possible, especially when you need an SSD to have bearable loading times with rF2. In the case of rF2 you have the same content on your HDD twice, once in package, once installed. Not allowing uninstalling content was the decision of Studio 397 and I don't see why can't I criticize it. If I could do that, for example, I wouldn't have to argue about the obsolete Reiza stuff, not only is it forced to be there if I want rF2 installed, it keeps bugging me with its UI issues. So this is all connected.

My main criticism is that old premium content is not kept up to date graphically with newer one. But that point seems to be missing from all replies to my posts...
 
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Mate, yes, complaining about uninstalling topic is not something "crucially important". Nowadays games have become enormous in size and it would be nice to save some space whenever possible, especially when you need an SSD to have bearable loading times with rF2. In the case of rF2 you have the same content on your HDD twice, once in package, once installed. Not allowing uninstalling content was the decision of Studio 397 and I don't see why can't I criticize it. If I could do that, for example, I wouldn't have to argue about the obsolete Reiza stuff, not only is it forced to be there if I want rF2 installed, it keeps bugging me with its UI issues. So this is all connected.

My main criticism is that old premium content is not kept up to date graphically with newer one. But that point seems to be missing from all replies to my posts...
That's a completely different issue though and doesn't have much to do with the topic here, wich is the competition system after all. That's an issue I find worth mentioning aswell, but it's allways wierd that a blog post from them explaining that they will adress issues for a very specific part of the sim lead to discussions not really contected to the topic. It's been mentioned by S397 in their last Roadmap that they plan on gradualy updating the content throughout next year, so I think it is acknowledged. Reiza will deal with their stuff aswell so I don't really see a reason to keep on dragging this into endless discussions.

That software takes more and more diskspace is a totaly natural process and nothing that anyone of us will change. Different products have different architecture and will require different space for different reasons. Raceroom and iRacing store data on your harddrive even if you don't own them. It all has it's pros and cons. On the other hand you can drive against those cars in online races. rF2 has the opposite approach. It installs all the official content by default to get rid of people searching for their content. Again, it's a concious desicion to get around a very specific issues that people aren't aware of and that could be the source of new bugs and glitches. The much more important thing is, that people get the stuff that they payed for on their harddrive and not the other way around.
 
That's a completely different issue though and doesn't have much to do with the topic here, wich is the competition system after all. That's an issue I find worth mentioning aswell, but it's allways wierd that a blog post from them explaining that they will adress issues for a very specific part of the sim lead to discussions not really contected to the topic. It's been mentioned by S397 in their last Roadmap that they plan on gradualy updating the content throughout next year, so I think it is acknowledged. Reiza will deal with their stuff aswell so I don't really see a reason to keep on dragging this into endless discussions.

That software takes more and more diskspace is a totaly natural process and nothing that anyone of us will change. Different products have different architecture and will require different space for different reasons. Raceroom and iRacing store data on your harddrive even if you don't own them. It all has it's pros and cons. On the other hand you can drive against those cars in online races. rF2 has the opposite approach. It installs all the official content by default to get rid of people searching for their content. Again, it's a concious desicion to get around a very specific issues that people aren't aware of and that could be the source of new bugs and glitches. The much more important thing is, that people get the stuff that they payed for on their harddrive and not the other way around.
Yeah, you are right, I went off-topic. I apologize. rF2 is just great... but it's frustrating that so many little things, decisions are not "bad", but simply don't work along with my expectations, needs... I am aware that I can have very high standards, and while people enjoy something I can only see the things that aren't according to my expectations. Which sucks believe me. I see your point, I understand it, but I still don't like it. Sure, let the sim install everything initially, but it would be nice if the user could manually remove some content. Which the user can do through Steam, but the sim overrides it. Another point, my previous internet connection was data limited, it's no longer the case thankfully, but the current solution really screws people like that. Reiza stuff will be updated, yes, just went to their forum, expected in the second half of 2021. S397 content, will see, I will be following the news. Anyway, that's enough off-topic from me...
 
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I perfectly understand this, but the cars you'd most likely want to have are at least all of the GT3 and/or GTE (unless you're going to do - for example - "endurance bundle 1 competition" instead of "GTE competition").
Assuming you're new this makes you want GT3 pack + ferrari 488 or both endurance bundles + ferrari 488 (35€ for either one), and you know that after spending those 35€, when (there's no if) a new car comes out, you're going to be forced to spend 5€ more unless you don't want your 35€ becoming basically useless to play online. And that's something i REALLY don't like.
I'like to buy the ferrari, both GT3 and GTE, but won't do so untill i see some more reasonable price or price policy, i also refused to buy endurance bundle 2 because of the not-included ferrari GTE, basically forcing you to buy it separately anyway to get the complete pack. It'snot even really about the very few more €, it's the policy itself that's wrong!

EDIT: just for fairness, i want to add RF2 is my go-to sim right now and i really like how it's developing, even if at a slow pace, but excpecially because of that i'd like a DLC system that allows users to get complete content packages at fair prices, either by allowing them to not buy entire categories or by at least giving them a discount on packs with owned content (as raceroom does wonderfully, and as a fact i for sure have spent more €/playtime on that than on RF2)

Yeah so we don't know what the prices will be yet as Marcel has said they will offer prices accordingly as per the blog, not forgetting Steam Sales & Special Discounts from time to time to coincide with a Comp at that time. For sure it may seem expensive if you own none of the content, but again no one is forcing you to buy anything, there will be Comps with Free content.
I agree it sucks with the need to Buy it all and not individually if you only want to Race one of the cars in a 5-Pack Bundle for example, but it is the way it is, either get used too it or don't, you'll still be able to join Comps and perhaps gradually purchase Bundles as the months roll buy. I mean for RaceRoom I bought their Premium Pack and have no intention of driving most of the cars, but the Pack was on Offer and worked out a lot cheaper to buy that than all the content I wanted to purchase individually in the end, there's not much difference here with what S397 will do.


Side note (not directed at you but in general):
For 35Euros you're getting a lot of cars which when priced individually are cheap, I think Sim Racers just worry far too much and jump behind the keyboards to rant about how much they're spending on a Race Sim, all the while sat behind their PCs....with Wheels...with VR....with a 3080....having already bought RF2/ACC/AMS2/pCars3/CyberPunk2077/MSF2020 etc etc, this very valid point falls on a lot of deaf ears every time the cost of DLC is brought up on Forums - self-entitlement is rife and it's quite silly on the face of it.
35Euros will get you 2 Average looking Airports in MSF2020, or 1 1/2 badly designed Planes...some realisation that the Cost of Sim racing in general (and I'm talking broadly here across all Sims) is actually cheap is needed. How many hours & hours of fun have you had with that car you paid just a few quid for? How many laps have you completed on Nords after paying £10 for it? Think about it.
Imagine a world here like Flight Sims, where a lot of 3rd Party Content (some of it absolute trash!) was charged for and for a lot more than what we're paying right now for Official Content, we've got it easy believe you me!

Sim racers seemingly worry too much about DLC Price and not how they're gonna feed their families each month, some realisation in general acceptance that Sim Racing DLC is Cheap is needed here.
 

avenger82

Krzysztof Maj
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Who has created a competition system to rival iRacing? They're still the king's and again this RF2 one is in beta, give it time but if you're ready to write it off now then so be it.
RaceRoom did, it works but because people got used to iRacing which is a go to sim for multiplayer, participation is modest.
When did I write it off? I said:
“I hope competition system would be good enough to bring some iRacers (to rF2), but I’m not holding my breath.”
Meaning I’m skeptical it would be revolution soon, but I hope one day rF2 with its competition system would attract significant number of iRacers.
 
Holy cow. This Alpine is already good, the Ginetta LMP1 fantastic. It's of excellent quality. I spent many hours with it yesterday together with the season 2019 WEC mod.


Regarding compsys: things must evolve. If S397 provide a decent experience I'm not worried about too little playerbase. This will happen.
 
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But obviously your magnificent package system works in a way that I cannot uninstall payware content if I e.g. bought it in a pack for a better value. So we are stuck with content we do not want on our hard drive twice because of course a copy has to be installed and another .rfcmp package file just sits there minding its own business.

That's ridiculous, so I already own Sebring and if I buy track expansion budle I will have 2 copies of Sebring on my HDD?

Without offering discounts on individual items S397 is gonna bury itself. With the amount of conecnt atm it's still bearable but few years down the line when people realize they have to spend 150€ to play online it would be a huge deal breaker.
 
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That's ridiculous, so I already own Sebring and if I buy track expansion budle I will have 2 copies of Sebring on my HDD?

No, it will still be one copy because only one actual Sebring exists in the Studio 397 workshop. What you'll see though is two copies in the Steam inventory page, but not in the actual game. I had this confirmed with some previous item I bought twice.
 
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No, it will still be one copy because only one actual Sebring exists in the Studio 397 workshop. What you'll see though is two copies in the Steam inventory page, but not in the actual game. I had this confirmed with some previous item I bought twice.

Thanks for clarifying this situation. I know it's about 1.4GB so I thought I would take double of that size on HDD with another purchse in bundle.
 
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