RD Tech Review | VPG Elemento First Impressions

MJQT

50RPM
Dec 25, 2019
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If anything sim racing hardware is very much more pay for immersion rather than pay to win.
Don't have high-end gear myself, but just wanted to echo what @Slapped said above – I think that's a really thoughtful and accurate take on how gear in sim racing works that I don't hear people say often enough. Not pay-for-fun or pay-for-speed, but (to some extent) pay-for-immersion.

EDIT: and the chance to have this sort of wheel for immersion when you're into open-wheel racing is so damn cool. I doubt I'd go for it even if I had the money, but it's neat we live in a time where stuff like this is even possible.
 
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TRASGU

25RPM
Feb 17, 2019
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It's meatware, not hardware, just sayin

I know you didn't direct this at me, but honestly I'm 2 - 3 seconds a lap off the best drivers - and that's with a tailwind going downhill, but I'm happy with my "meatware". I'm not into sim racing to be the best, I'm into it because I enjoy it.

I don't think it's fair to criticise somebody who maybe slower than you like that. A lot of us here are pushing a fair few years and don't have the reactions and precision we could demonstrate 30 or 40 years ago. Even back then I doubt I would be anything more than average.
I really don't care at all nor I ever did if somebody is alien fast or if he laps 8 seconds out of the pace, everybody has a different personal limit in his abilities and once you reach it and you even have read and practiced all there is to read about technique that personal limit it is like a invisible wall that can't be overcome.

You have mentioned a great point that I share with You: simracing is about having fun. Some pursue performance, others like the social aspect of it, there is who like to just cruising with other people, to drift at near impossible angles or simply extract the more they can from themselves. All they have in common is to have fun with simracing in their own personal way that makes them feel fullfilled.

I'm not criticising him for his level of speed, that's elitist and in my opinion shortminded. His speed is irrelevant for the argument.

But what he did blaming gear and low key belliting aliens reducing all they amount to just purchasing expensive gear is disrespectful and irrational. He basically lowkey hinted that if he owned a setup like the one that jimmy broadbent has, he would be fighting gregger huttu category drivers or close to them. And it is wrong, even You in your initial post shared my exact same point of view.

Nowadays newcomers and even simracers oldschool see professional simracing teams, and youtubers with gear that is worth more than my real life car. And people new in simracing starts to make the unconscious association that because everybody that seems to bo important in the simracing world and in competitions uses that incredibly expensive gear it must be because that hardware is the best and fastest. That gear is the best, but wether it is the fastest or not only depends of the human behind the controls. An alien G25 can make an upset in a iracing world championship to other top level alien with several thousands worth of gear. Just look what hardware Jardier had when he started streaming and what he has now, but his speed keeps being the same.

Those pros and youtubers just because they earn their living or earn a significant part of it from simracing need to pay the bills from within the simracing world in some way, and here is where the simracing manufacturers come into picture. The manufacturers send gear and/or pay money to youtubers and simracing teams to advertise themselves. And because it is great hardware and free of charge for them they keep using it, creating an aura around that hardware.

I didn't criticise anybody, I debunked the very popular but irrational argument that the user had "simracing is pay to win" providing abundant cold data that that demonstrated that his argument was factualy wrong. The data proved that it is him who is at fault for not being able of reach his sky high expectations of topping the timesheets and leaderboards in the online servers.

Personally I found his post missinformed, and what it's worse misinforming others that can be influenced by this kind of posts into wasting absurd amounts of money in a never ending and senseless pursue of competitivity in leagues and online races, those are seconds of speed that are never going to be found.

At the end of the day we both share the same point of view, it's just I unintentionaly came across rude.
 
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Highlandwalker

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Jun 18, 2017
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The price of sim racing gear is becoming a joke, I have spent in the region £5600 for all my gear including computer and monitor, more than I ever wanted to spend, if I wanted to upgrade I would probably have to spend another £3000 to see any real improvement and any body who says better gear doesn't make you faster is lying providing your reasonably competent to start with. It is a nice looking wheel though.
 

TRASGU

25RPM
Feb 17, 2019
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The price of sim racing gear is becoming a joke, I have spent in the region £5600 for all my gear including computer and monitor, more than I ever wanted to spend, if I wanted to upgrade I would probably have to spend another £3000 to see any real improvement and any body who says better gear doesn't make you faster is lying providing your reasonably competent to start with. It is a nice looking wheel though.
Wait, what???. You are saying that GPLrank and RSR live timing hotlaping leaderboards lie?, because in any car/track combo the top 4 positions are full of cheap g25/g27/g29 times mixing with expensive fancy loadcell pedals and direct drive wheels.

Gregger Huttu dominated the simracing scene for nearly a full decade with a microsoft sidewinder plastic wheel that had a 8bit controller and cheap potentiometers, later he joined team Redline and got sponsored Fanatec gear and kept fighting against the exact same guys he was before, and he didn't got any faster.

Better gear is better hardware, feels better, has better ffb, probably last longer, and it is easier to be consistent with it. But it isn't any faster than cheap gear like an old and trusty G25.

Back in the day I was obsessed with hardware, and because I didn't had the money for it I built my own electronics and pedals. I jumped from stock G25 to tailor made pedals with load cell, hall sensors and a 16bit controller that I designed, built and programmed both the mcu and a windows interface to modify parameters that still nowadays has more features that the ones from heusinkveld and leo bodnar.

And guess what?, I was as fast as before, it felt better and easier to be consistent, I made some pb at some tracks feeding my confirmation bias further. But I did a experiment after months of use of the new pedals. I went back to stock G25 pedals and after 2 evenings of re-adaptation I was matching my times with the other set of pedals and being as consistent was a lot harder but still possible to match the new set.
 
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Highlandwalker

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Jun 18, 2017
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Wait, what???. You are saying that GPLrank and RSR live timing hotlaping leaderboards lie?, because in any car/track combo the top 4 positions are full of cheap g25/g27/g29 times mixing with expensive fancy loadcell pedals and direct drive wheels.

Gregger Huttu dominated the simracing scene for nearly a full decade with a microsoft sidewinder plastic wheel that had a 8bit controller and cheap potentiometers, later he joined team Redline and got sponsored Fanatec gear and kept fighting against the exact same guys he was before, and he didn't got any faster.

Better gear is better hardware, feels better, has better ffb, probably last longer, and it is easier to be consistent with it. But it isn't any faster than cheap gear like an old and trusty G25.

Back in the day I was obsessed with hardware, and because I didn't had the money for it I built my own electronics and pedals. I jumped from stock G25 to tailor made pedals with load cell, hall sensors and a 16bit controller that I designed, built and programmed both the mcu and a windows interface to modify parameters that still nowadays has more features that the ones from heusinkveld and leo bodnar.

And guess what?, I was as fast as before, it felt better and easier to be consistent, I made some pb at some tracks feeding my confirmation bias further. But I did a experiment after months of use of the new pedals. I went back to stock G25 pedals and after 2 evenings of re-adaptation I was matching my times with the other set of pedals and being as consistent was a lot harder but still possible to match the new set.
As I said reasonably competent driver not aliens and if easier for consistent lap times means an overall faster race, so your faster. When I up graded from my G29 individual laps were not much faster but overall race time was faster so I'm faster. But there does become a point of diminishing returns of time gained against expense.
 
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michelforest

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Mar 2, 2010
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It's not really. There's a lot of top sim racers that still use beaten up old G25s. It's like many sports; having really good equipment might give you a slight edge if you are absolutely at the top, but for everybody else it is essentially a vanity purchase.

Having a top end DD wheel with load cell pedals isn't going to turn a sim racing Lord Maheveer into a sim racing Senna simply through an equipment upgrade. A talented driver with a G29 is always going to dominate a klutz with €50'000 of equipment.

If anything sim racing hardware is very much more pay for immersion rather than pay to win.
I completely agree. I was finally able to buy a Fanatec CSL elite F1 set last summer to replace my G27 wheel. I really prefer my new gear, it's a lot of fun to have a F1-style steering wheel and I would not go back to my G27. However, I'm still a very bad sim racer! :roflmao:
 
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TheNatural

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Dec 30, 2019
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any body who says better gear doesn't make you faster is lying providing your reasonably competent to start with. It is a nice looking wheel though.
Up to a certain point, maybe. but the bar is much lower than it's being presented here.

A guy with a bodnar SS2 and custom hydraulic pedals would be just as fast on a CSL elite with LCs. Are they going to feel more immersed? Certainly, faster? No, not because of the equipment.

I'm also not someone with a small budget just coping, either. My last base was a SC2 Pro.
 
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Micvand13

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Jul 19, 2016
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Yes it’s up there with top tier cube controls, Rexing and PSE kind of prices, although I really like the quality the manufacturing of it + the engraving which is nice for the owner but be an hard sell trying to pass it on to another user unless it was much cheaper with it been so customised and personal, I think out of 3/4 wheels in this price range would be my last choice, seems 30/40% overpriced.
Looking the website, customization on the back is an optional. Regarding the price, I think is good if you compare with other competitors (materials used, finishes,etc...). Your idea of 30%/40% overpriced is totally no sense in my opinion
 

CC

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Apr 27, 2013
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Looking the website, customization on the back is an optional. Regarding the price, I think is good if you compare with other competitors (materials used, finishes,etc...). Your idea of 30%/40% overpriced is totally no sense in my opinion
Hi,
I wasn't disputing the building costs or the quality like I stated looks exceptional, but I am confused to where it sits in the market considering at this price range the competition is fierce to say the least,
its a unkown brand to the consumer the end user, just saying its an hard sell at that price range,
where as placing it lower in the market say for example 30% less cost currently there is no one here making top quality wheels with displays around 7-800 euros which would have gave them the edge over the competition and maybe made the main brand contenders reconsider there prices somewhat,

but in no way am I am disputing the build quality, the materials used of the time taken to build such hardware, but I am confused to why wheels with no displays are 3-400 euros but when you add a 100 euros display the price triples but seems acceptable because these displays are not 800 euros extra cost.

Like here I just purchased this wheel for 350 euros simply because the grips drive me crazy the quality of them is like true F1 wheel grips there sensational, but take the same wheel add a display does this make it worth 1000 euros more money ?

125 more euros you can but this wheel

or this wheel
 
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Micvand13

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Jul 19, 2016
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Hi,
I wasn't disputing the building costs or the quality like I stated looks exceptional, but I am confused to where it sits in the market considering at this price range the competition is fierce to say the least,
its a unkown brand to the consumer the end user, just saying its an hard sell at that price range,
where as placing it lower in the market say for example 30% less cost currently there is no one here making top quality wheels with displays around 7-800 euros which would have gave them the edge over the competition and maybe made the main brand contenders reconsider there prices somewhat,

but in no way am I am disputing the build quality, the materials used of the time taken to build such hardware, but I am confused to why wheels with no displays are 3-400 euros but when you add a 100 euros display the price triples but seems acceptable because these displays are not 800 euros extra cost.

Like here I just purchased this wheel for 350 euros simply because the grips drive me crazy the quality of them is like true F1 wheel grips there sensational, but take the same wheel add a display does this make it worth 1000 euros more money ?

125 more euros you can but this wheel

or this wheel
Polsimer is a great wheel but built it with 3d printed parts (back) with less buttons and rotary. Cube and Rexing are also fantastic wheels but more expensive than this-one. Yes, VPG is unknow brand at the moment but I like they proposed something different form the rest,they have to start from something, right? They'll also present Elemento w/o LCD in March
 
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CC

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Polsimer is a great wheel but built it with 3d printed parts (back) with less buttons and rotary. Cube and Rexing are also fantastic wheels but more expensive than this-one. Yes, VPG is unknow brand at the moment but I like they proposed something different form the rest,they have to start from something, right? They'll also present Elemento w/o LCD in March
Yes I agree you have to start somewhere in the food chain but to come straight out of the gate fighting at the top like I say personally for me its an hard sell considering the competition for the same money roughly be my last choice,
but like I mentioned making it cheaper and placing it inside the market where currently there is 0 competition would have gave them the advantage,

Anyways I am more interested to see where this Thrustmaster new F1 wheel will sit inside the market because if this is around 6-7-800 euros every single high end wheel maker will have to reconsider there pricing because this wheel looks insane.
 
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Barry Waterfield

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To everyone,

I was having a bad day yesterday I guess I was just channeling my frustration onto everything else. Thanks for the feedback.

I should be proud I have a gaming rig at all. My space is limited so I designed and build a custom desk where my wheel rotates from under the desk and locks in place with pedal camera and light in situ. My pedals have been mounted upside down to a custom made A frame too. It works and I have won many races.

I think the seat to wheel interface needs the "grumpy 1.0" software updated to "keep trying 2.0"

My 40th is coming up next year maybe if I badger the wife I can get a DD wheel



The point of simracing is fun, I guess I wasn't getting much of that recently.
 
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Beef36

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Jul 14, 2011
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I think the steering wheel is perhaps the single most important component of a sim rig.

It's the one thing in your field of view that you are in active contact with 100% of the time.

In my view, it's worth spending an outsized portion of your sim racing budget on at least one really good wheel, and the force feedback system behind it.

It won't make you faster, but it definitely increases your enjoyment, and for that alone it's worth it.
 
May 27, 2020
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If a 2000$ wheel isn’t top tier I don’t know what is
If the implication of "top tier" is "top quality", I would have to add that It's definitely not my life's experience that a high price tag ALWAYS correlates to a high quality product:)
 

PegaMixel

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Jun 4, 2017
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A high price tag doesnt mean the quality is equally high.

I for myself use a Cube controls formula wheel since 2017 and i'm not really happy with the quality it delivers for its hefty price tag.
 

CC

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Apr 27, 2013
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If the implication of "top tier" is "top quality", I would have to add that It's definitely not my life's experience that a high price tag ALWAYS correlates to a high quality product:)
I never even suggested otherwise at all im struggling to see what point you are trying to make,
its kinda common sense the price does not relate to quality and this is everything in life not simracing even bread does buying expensive bread make it taste any better than buying cheaper bread ?
 
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