Podium DD's VS Simucube 2's

[Darren Byrne]

Hi guys, the past while I was trying to find good comparisons between these two models of dd's. Has anyone tested both ? I understand that the software for these aren't complete yet but is there any clear winner here ? thanks.

 

[sam75]

Demon Tweeks have the R1 in stock if anyone is looking for one:

Simucube 2 Pro Direct Drive System - R1

The Simucube 2 Pro Direct Drive System - R1 raises the bar for sim racing steering wheel systems. It offers the most realistic and detailed force feedback currently available through a high torque, brushless motor. With 25Nm of torque available, the Pro is capable of providing a high level of...

www.demon-tweeks.com

 

[jamescarruthers]

Sorry if this has been covered already but why don't you trust the R2? I'm looking to upgrade from my DD1 within the next few months.

It's most scaremongering. Nobody has any real proof. Buy whatever you can get and be happy with it. Don't worry about it.

 

[sam75]

I have the R2 and it is fantastic .

 

[cap7ainclu7ch]

Thanks for the info. Will probably sell my Podium setup this summer and pick up an R2.

 

[Wreckoning]

Thanks for the info. Will probably sell my Podium setup this summer and pick up an R2.

Just out of curiosity how much of an upgrade do you think you will be getting? I know there are various ways of looking at it, out of the box compatibility, wheel options, support etc but I get the impression straight performance difference is fairly small.

No argument with you doing what you’ve doing It just seems these wheels are sitting together in a very narrow performance window which is potentially even more marginal depending on how much time you spend tuning them.

 

[TedBrosby-]

Just out of curiosity how much of an upgrade do you think you will be getting? I know there are various ways of looking at it, out of the box compatibility, wheel options, support etc but I get the impression straight performance difference is fairly small.

No argument with you doing what you’ve doing It just seems these wheels are sitting together in a very narrow performance window which is potentially even more marginal depending on how much time you spend tuning them.

Hi, I had an SC2 Pro and sold it to get a Podium Racing Wheel F1.
The SC2 is incredibly smooth, it's probably at least 5% better at the Podium's best, and 20% better at the Podium's worst.

Also, the software is lighter and requires less CPU resources. Fanatec software has to do stuff like RPM lights, clubsport vibration motors and is in general a much larger application.

The SC2 Pro also has a more rigid quick release.

The thing is, you're a little bit wrong to say that the window gets more narrow if you spend time tuning them. That was opposite of my experience. The truth is, the SC2 has a lot of performance waiting for you to tune into it. You can fine comb the force reconstruction filter, the inertia, friction and static force reduction in order to more or less completely eliminate clipping, make the wheel powerful at low torque but not too powerful in high torque situations.

The disadvantage is, you'll have to spend quite some time finding these settings. If you just use available pre-made recommended settings by Fanatec or Simucube, the delta is less, but still not so small you won't notice. Even at the default settings, the Fanatec has torque ripple at low speeds (such as entering/exiting the pit, or during formation laps) that makes it feel slightly similar to a stepper motor. This torque ripple becomes harder to notice at higher torque levels like 5+ Nm of force, but even at higher torque levels such as in a corner at speed with 70% FFB, if you slightly turn the wheel more you can feel very very subtle "cogging" compared to the SC2. The SC2 is smooth to a point where you literally will not feel any positional detents at all.

For me though, this performance difference wasn't worth sacrificing the advantages I wanted with Fanatec: console compatibility, analog clutches on wireless wheels, ability to change settings from the wheel using tuning menu, single USB cable for shifter and wheelbase, cheaper Fanatec wheels without USB cable (I personally like Formula V2 more than Ascher F28 and F64 is too expensive and requires a USB cable, that's my taste and I don't feel the same as others).

There's no mistake here, SC2 is smoother for FFB and it's noticeable. Anyone saying it isn't, I think they should adjust their settings, but for me it didn't take long to notice a difference.

I chose Podium Racing Wheel F1 even though SC2 is smoother and I had an SC2 Pro, I think that qualifies me as the most unbiased perspective regarding it.

 

[Wreckoning]

Hi, I had an SC2 Pro and sold it to get a Podium Racing Wheel F1.
The SC2 is incredibly smooth, it's probably at least 5% better at the Podium's best, and 20% better at the Podium's worst.

Also, the software is lighter and requires less CPU resources. Fanatec software has to do stuff like RPM lights, clubsport vibration motors and is in general a much larger application.

The SC2 Pro also has a more rigid quick release.

The thing is, you're a little bit wrong to say that the window gets more narrow if you spend time tuning them. That was opposite of my experience. The truth is, the SC2 has a lot of performance waiting for you to tune into it. You can fine comb the force reconstruction filter, the inertia, friction and static force reduction in order to more or less completely eliminate clipping, make the wheel powerful at low torque but not too powerful in high torque situations.

The disadvantage is, you'll have to spend quite some time finding these settings. If you just use available pre-made recommended settings by Fanatec or Simucube, the delta is less, but still not so small you won't notice. Even at the default settings, the Fanatec has torque ripple at low speeds (such as entering/exiting the pit, or during formation laps) that makes it feel slightly similar to a stepper motor. This torque ripple becomes harder to notice at higher torque levels like 5+ Nm of force, but even at higher torque levels such as in a corner at speed with 70% FFB, if you slightly turn the wheel more you can feel very very subtle "cogging" compared to the SC2. The SC2 is smooth to a point where you literally will not feel any positional detents at all.

For me though, this performance difference wasn't worth sacrificing the advantages I wanted with Fanatec: console compatibility, analog clutches on wireless wheels, ability to change settings from the wheel using tuning menu, single USB cable for shifter and wheelbase, cheaper Fanatec wheels without USB cable (I personally like Formula V2 more than Ascher F28 and F64 is too expensive and requires a USB cable, that's my taste and I don't feel the same as others).

There's no mistake here, SC2 is smoother for FFB and it's noticeable. Anyone saying it isn't, I think they should adjust their settings, but for me it didn't take long to notice a difference.

I chose Podium Racing Wheel F1 even though SC2 is smoother and I had an SC2 Pro, I think that qualifies me as the most unbiased perspective regarding it.

Hi, thanks for the detailed response.

This is one of those things where unless everyone is sitting together doing back to back testing it’s really hard to get your head around how people interpret things. I’ve had a go on both and also went DD1 but didn’t have them both at the same to test back to back. I tend to faff about with a lot of different sims and cars and DD1 just seemed easier and there were trade offs on both sides.

I agree the SC2 pro is smoother but one of the things that I think confuses the issue is the built in rumble/effects you get on the Fanatec wheels. Probably not the purist view but for me that made it feel like something was missing on the SC2 pro. I also wonder sometimes whether that rumble being on by default on the Dd1 gets baked in with the difference in smoothness.

If you haven’t got either you can look at everyone's feedback and make your decision and buy the one that works for you. Both these wheels will have been iterated on over time both from a software and hardware perspective. My DD1 (a couple of months old) doesn’t have the issues that get talked about in the early reviews and I’m sure simucube will also continue to improve without them releasing it as a new model. I just think changing between the two is a bit of a tougher call than just buying one or the other to start with.

Cheers.

 

[cap7ainclu7ch]

Just out of curiosity how much of an upgrade do you think you will be getting? I know there are various ways of looking at it, out of the box compatibility, wheel options, support etc but I get the impression straight performance difference is fairly small.

No argument with you doing what you’ve doing It just seems these wheels are sitting together in a very narrow performance window which is potentially even more marginal depending on how much time you spend tuning them.

Reliability first. My DD1 failed a few weeks ago and it took a month to get a replacement. Not uncommon to hear these kind of stories and I don't have much faith in it not failing again at some point in the future. Secondly highly quality wheels. The Fanatec stuff just has a bit of flex to it that takes away from that true automotive grade feeling. It's tiny stuff, but when you are on it you do notice it. Whenever I get in my GTI I always notice how solid the steering feels compared to my rig and I may be a bit insane, but I'd like to get that few tiny percent of slop out of the system (mainly from the QR, but some of the wheel rims have a bit of flex as well). Lastly the bit of smoothness that replicates that "rubber on road" sort of feeling would be nice.

I can sell my DD1 for more than I paid for it so ultimately I think it will be worth it, but I'm not expecting any insane improvements and I will miss the quality of life stuff that Fanatec brings.

 

[Cameltotem]

So been racing on a g29 for 5 years now and ready to take deep dive.

I'm driving a bunch of different sims and honestly got maybe 1-2 hours a day so ease of use is very important to me.

I just wanna set some base FFB and just play, don't wanna spend hours tweaking FFB settings all day, ive heard you need less tinkering with the Fanatec DD1? Not sure if this is the case?


From what I've understood a SC2 sport + Cube wheel is going to be around 800 euros more than DD1 + BMW wheel so that seems like one thing to consider.

One thing that puts me off the Fanatec solution is the reliability issues, not sure if this been improved though.

I've heard the Simucube is a bit better but are we talking 2-5 % or 30-50% better?

What base would fit me the best? Thank you!

 

[RCHeliguy]

I just wanna set some base FFB and just play, don't wanna spend hours tweaking FFB settings all day, ive heard you need less tinkering with the Fanatec DD1? Not sure if this is the case?

I can relate to that.

SimuCube seems to have solved this configuration issue with their True Drive Paddock software. Basically this is a cloud configuration sharing platform. So you plug your SC2 in, open up True Drive Paddock, then select the sim title and pick from a bunch of rated profiles. Pick one with a trophy on it that has consistently high ratings and it should feel pretty good.

You can very quickly flip between the profiles that other people have spend hours tweaking to get perfect and pick one that you like. When you have a winner, just save it locally.

 

[AccAkut]

I can relate to that.

SimuCube seems to have solved this configuration issue with their True Drive Paddock software. Basically this is a cloud configuration sharing platform. So you plug your SC2 in, open up True Drive Paddock, then select the sim title and pick from a bunch of rated profiles. Pick one with a trophy on it that has consistently high ratings and it should feel pretty good.

You can very quickly flip between the profiles that other people have spend hours tweaking to get perfect and pick one that you like. When you have a winner, just save it locally.

Interesting. I did not touch my Truedrive since installing it last year and finding some settings that I like, and I remember the booing and concerns towards the announced online feature.

 

[Cameltotem]

I can relate to that.

SimuCube seems to have solved this configuration issue with their True Drive Paddock software. Basically this is a cloud configuration sharing platform. So you plug your SC2 in, open up True Drive Paddock, then select the sim title and pick from a bunch of rated profiles. Pick one with a trophy on it that has consistently high ratings and it should feel pretty good.

You can very quickly flip between the profiles that other people have spend hours tweaking to get perfect and pick one that you like. When you have a winner, just save it locally.

Thanks! Sounds like a great tool!

 

[RCHeliguy]

Interesting. I did not touch my Truedrive since installing it last year and finding some settings that I like, and I remember the booing and concerns towards the announced online feature.

I initially questioned it myself.

If you download the latest version it will have both True Drive and True Drive Paddock. You can use either one.

But I tried out a well rated Dirt Rally 2.0 profile that included the matching in game settings and it was night and day better than what I was using for that title. Someone had spent a lot of time with that.

I had a pretty good iRacing profile, but I'm currently using one by Jon Miller Racing that is better. There are a number of very good iRacing profiles.

I've pulled over a highly rated ACC profile, but I haven't opened that title up in ages. I also pulled over a KartKraft profile that I haven't tested out.

I'd highly suggest trying it out. I know I've been much more impressed with my SC2 Pro since I've had better profiles for it.

 

[AccAkut]

I initially questioned it myself.

If you download the latest version it will have both True Drive and True Drive Paddock. You can use either one.

But I tried out a well rated Dirt Rally 2.0 profile that included the matching in game settings and it was night and day better than what I was using for that title. Someone had spent a lot of time with that.

I had a pretty good iRacing profile, but I'm currently using one by Jon Miller Racing that is better. There are a number of very good iRacing profiles.

I've pulled over a highly rated ACC profile, but I haven't opened that title up in ages. I also pulled over a KartKraft profile that I haven't tested out.

I'd highly suggest trying it out. I know I've been much more impressed with my SC2 Pro since I've had better profiles for it.

To contribute from all this I'd simply need to race more as all I drive in is AC, on my 350mm rim which I get is rather unusually big. But good to know in case I venture somewhere else come winter.

 

[Clover11]

I think that new True Drive Paddock is not open up for all models yet and is still in Beta. Not 100% sure, but I think the Pro R2s and maybe the Sports are still excluded. I just recently updated to it and like it. Not as many profiles out there as I expected though.

 

[RCHeliguy]

I think that new True Drive Paddock is not open up for all models yet and is still in Beta. Not 100% sure, but I think the Pro R2s and maybe the Sports are still excluded. I just recently updated to it and like it. Not as many profiles out there as I expected though.

I understood that they were opening it up for everyone this August. Has that not happened yet?

I understood it was all SC2 Ultimates and SC2 Pro (rev 1) in the open beta.

I've had mine for 2 years next month, so I was definitely in the initial open beta. I imagine that once it is officially released there will be a lot of new profiles added.

What sim title are you looking for?

 

[Clover11]

I mainly use iRacing but but went around selecting profiles for everything I own when I first install the Paddock a week or so back. There was no iRacing profile for the MX-5 which I like to drive but has really weak FFB. The generic profiles were not doing it for me in that car so I ended up importing my old profile and uploading it for others to use. I know a handful of people downloaded it right away.

If I remember right, there was not anything for Beam.NG and limited options for AMS2, and RaceRoom and another if I remember correctly. I am guessing once it goes live here soon, a ton of new profiles will get added.

 

[RCHeliguy]

Maybe you should upload your MX-5 specific profile and label it as such.
I'll give it a try

 

[Deleted member 197115]

Must be embarrassing after owning DD wheel for such a long time not being able to tune it yourself to your own liking.

 

[RCHeliguy]

Must be embarrassing after owning DD wheel for such a long time not being able to tune it yourself to your own liking.

LOL! It would be if I had actually spent any time learning how to tune it in the last two years. Instead all I've done it try other people's profiles out ( and I didn't do that much). As I said I relate to that other guy who just wanted to plug it in and use it.