Intel 9th Gen CPUs revealed

[Deleted member 197115]

Try BO4 to see how game should be utilizing full power of CPU.

 

[RasmusP]

Try BO4 to see how game should be utilizing full power of CPU.

You got any benchmark tests or videos? I can't find a single CPU comparison...

 

[RobertR1]

@RasmusP In that spreadsheet do you know the rest of the 9900k system? that multi thread benchmark might be throttling. With a 100mhz deficit but with a 2 core advantage the 9900k should pull away harder from the 8700k. I'll run my 8086k@5 tonight for ref.

 

[RasmusP]

@RasmusP In that spreadsheet do you know the rest of the 9900k system? that multi thread benchmark might be throttling. With a 100mhz deficit but with a 2 core advantage the 9900k should pull away harder from the 8700k. I'll run my 8086k@5 tonight for ref.

Sadly I don't. It seems though that the guys who ran the test (Heise ; C't magazine) didn't raise the TDP so after a peak of 4.7 GHz on all cores it throttled down to keep 95W.
Which I agree, is a bit ridiculous compared to real life experience!

It won't really change the single thread test though. My main concern about this i9 is that when you'd OC it for games that don't use all threads, you would get something like 50% overall GPU load at 5 GHz and probably be okay with a generic high end air cooler.
But if you'd dare to start some rendering you would need to make it throttle down.

Question here: Can you OC all cores but restrict the TDP in these new bios'?
Overall it seems that you buy the higher performance with higher temperature so I'm not convinced that your 8086k won't be better for most games since it can run 5 GHz+ easier with basically a similar single thread performance.

I'd love a benchmark duel between 8700k and 9900k at let's say 150W maximum and maximum OC!
While I think there would be a clear difference, I'm not convinced that difference would be 300+ Euros big...

 

[Cristian Haba]

I recently go a deal on my i7 8086k, gigabyte z370 gaming 7, and trident gskill 3200 16gb mem. It's the best most up to date system I've ever had. Looking at all the youtube reviewer channels there seems to be a shift in new gen tech, be it gpu and cpu wise.

Intel is still on 14nm, Nvidia is shitting the bed with rtx launch but making insane money. I think the next gen cpu and gpus are the ones to watch for. Unfortunately for us we're left making some hard choices and/or sacrifices.

Really impressed with the value AMD provides with their 2700x platform. Thanks for all the visuals guys and getting all this done, it helps some of us a lot.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

You got any benchmark tests or videos? I can't find a single CPU comparison...

https://www.dsogaming.com/pc-performance-analyses/call-of-duty-black-ops-4-pc-performance-analysis/
In my system it loads all 12 logical cores. You can also adjust the number of worker threads in configuration.

 

[RasmusP]

https://www.dsogaming.com/pc-performance-analyses/call-of-duty-black-ops-4-pc-performance-analysis/
In my system it loads all 12 logical cores. You can also adjust the number of worker threads in configuration.

Sweet! I remember quick-reading through that site but I missed the "simulated CPU cores" part. Oops!
Anyway, looks really nice! It's a bit ironic though that this game scales nicely but already maintains 60+ fps on a dual-core with HT whereas our beloved sims are all stuck in single thread limits with my 2600k struggling sometimes to maintain 60 fps
I know splitting threads is hugely complicated so I guess: CPU utilization is currently done where money lies... Codemasters, Ubisoft, Activision, EA etc.

 

[BP]

@RasmusP @RobertR1 @Andrew_WOT

Right now I'm torn because of all these reports on thermals. Amazon still hasn't shipped the 9900K yet so I still have time to make up my mind. I live in the tropics and without A/C the ambient room temps are anywhere from 25 C to 30 C.

Here's my build specs (this is my first ever build), already bought everything except the 9900K (that is, until the pre-order goes through):

Case: Phanteks Enthoo Pro Tempered Glass PH-ES614PTG_SWT (link)
PSU: Seasonic Focus Plus 850 Platinum SSR-850PX 850W 80+ Platinum (link)
CPU Cooler: PHANTEKS PH-TC14PE (link)
Motherboard: ASUS ROG Maximus X Hero Wifi AC (link)
CPU: Intel 9900K
GPU: MSI GeForce RTX 2080 GAMING X TRIO (link)
RAM: Corsair Vengeance LPX 16GB (2x8GB) DDR4 DRAM 3000MHz C15 (link)

Also bought 4 of these 140mm PWM fans for the front and top of the case (will move the 2 included 120mm fans to the bottom of the case): COUGAR Vortex CFV14HP 140mm Hydro Dynamic Bearing PWM Case Fan (link)

Will this be enough to keep things cool? I have no plans on overclocking anytime soon (if ever) as it's clear GPU's have mostly been the bottleneck in gaming applications for awhile now. The only intensive multi-core rendering I'd do is with music production, and even in those cases I'm pretty sure it doesn't need 5.0 Ghz to run efficiently so I might under-clock for better thermals.

If it's not enough to keep everything cool then I might be tempted to go to a previous gen that runs cooler but still good for modern gaming...but I'd really like to go for the latest and greatest now as I plan not to do any major upgrade for approximately the next 5 years.

 

[RasmusP]

@RasmusP @RobertR1 @Andrew_WOT

Right now I'm torn because of all these reports on thermals. Amazon still hasn't shipped the 9900K yet so I still have time to make up my mind. I live in the tropics and without A/C the ambient room temps are anywhere from 25 C to 30 C.

Here's my build specs (this is my first ever build), already bought everything except the 9900K (that is, until the pre-order goes through):

Case: Phanteks Enthoo Pro Tempered Glass PH-ES614PTG_SWT (link)
PSU: Seasonic Focus Plus 850 Platinum SSR-850PX 850W 80+ Platinum (link)
CPU Cooler: PHANTEKS PH-TC14PE (link)
Motherboard: ASUS ROG Maximus X Hero Wifi AC (link)
CPU: Intel 9900K
GPU: MSI GeForce RTX 2080 GAMING X TRIO (link)
RAM: Corsair Vengeance LPX 16GB (2x8GB) DDR4 DRAM 3000MHz C15 (link)

Also bought 4 of these 140mm PWM fans for the front and top of the case (will move the 2 included 120mm fans to the bottom of the case): COUGAR Vortex CFV14HP 140mm Hydro Dynamic Bearing PWM Case Fan (link)

Will this be enough to keep things cool? I have no plans on overclocking anytime soon (if ever) as it's clear GPU's have mostly been the bottleneck in gaming applications for awhile now. The only intensive multi-core rendering I'd do is with music production, and even in those cases I'm pretty sure it doesn't need 5.0 Ghz to run efficiently so I might under-clock for better thermals.

If it's not enough to keep everything cool then I might be tempted to go to a previous gen that runs cooler but still good for modern gaming...but I'd really like to go for the latest and greatest now as I plan not to do any major upgrade for approximately the next 5 years.

If you have the money, go for it! I just hope that not many will support that price trend but you seem like you really want this sweetspot now.

My problem with this cpu is that you pay 150% of an 8700k for only 0-10% single thread boost in most games, especially Sims!
While you also pay 200% of a ryzen 2700x for again, only 10-15% multithread performance.

If the price doesn't hurt you it's still basically a combination of these two awesome CPUs and will last for a loooong time!

My only real concern was overclocking with restricted power limit but when I'm thinking about it I'm pretty sure you could overclock it to 5.1 GHz and restrict it at 90W so it will run single thread applications at the overclock and when something really uses everything you have it will not overheat

 

[RobertR1]

@johndough247 you will be absolutely fine. The hero is a great board with high end VRMs and it’ll last ages. Since you’re keeping it stock temps will be fine also for gaming. Just watch some YouTube videos on optimal fan replacement. That can make a decent difference.

You could maybe save Some money and get a 8700k or 8086k and move that money towards a 2080ti.

 

[DucFreak]

I've read some commentaries about the i9 9900K and "5.0Ghz all cores overclock for 24/7"....
Nope. It won't happen. Not with reasonable measures and the current motherboards.

The Intel i9 9900K, just like seen with the AMD R7 2700X (funny enough), is the sort of processor that is better ran at stock speeds.
Yes, I know that sounds wrong because it's a "K" chip from Intel (and a really expensive one at that) but the facts and figures you'll see around is that, at such OC'ed values (5.0Ghz all cores), it'll pull about 200W(!!!), if not more, which means that not only it'll run outrageously hot, but the VRMs on pretty much any motherboards (Z390 or Z370) will be hitting ceiling and then throttling down the CPU to protect themselves. Which defeats the whole process.
I'm yet to see a motherboard that can allow for that without having the VRMs sh!tt!ng themselves (but if there is, then at what cost?).

As side note, for those of you with eyes on expert reviewers (video on youtube and written article at website), I'd recommend to also look at Leo Waldock's (KitGuruTech). While the guy is not the most popular 'tuber, he's one of the oldest and most knowledged guys in the tech stuff, and usually going into the sort of aproach that is more practical and indepth than most.

This'll probably be controversial but, if just for gaming, then get the AMD R5 2600X (6c/12t), a good B450 motherboard and 3000+MHz DDR4 RAM. Value for money, nothing gets close atm.
And if it really needs to be top clocks for highest framerate "and so has to be Intel", the i7 8700K (6c/12t) on any decent Z370 mobo (or i7 9700K (8c/8t) on Z390) will still be good to get.
Spend the money on the graphics card instead (or hookers and cocaine, whatever).

 

[Deleted member 197115]

Why not Z390 MB?

 

[RobertR1]

I've read some commentaries about the i7 9900K and "5.0Ghz all cores overclock for 24/7"....
Nope. It won't happen.
Not with reasonable measures and regular motherboards.

The Intel i7 9900K, just like seen with the AMD R7 2700X (funny enough), is the sort of processor that is better ran at stock speeds.
Yes, I know that sounds wrong because it's a "K" chip from Intel (and a really expensive one at that) but the facts you'll see is that, at such OC'ed values (5.0Ghz all cores), it'll pull about 200W (!!!), if not more, which means that not only it'll run outrageously hot, but the VRMs on pretty much any motherboards (Z390 or Z370) will be hitting ceiling and then throttling down the CPU to protect themselves. Which defeats the whole process.
I'm yet to see a motherboard that can allow for that with without having the VRMs sh!tt!ng themselves (but if there is, then at what cost?).

As side note, for those of you with eyes on expert reviewers (video on youtube and written article at website), I'd recommend to also look at Leo Waldock's (KitGuruTech). While the guy is not the most popular 'tuber, he's one of the oldest and most knowledged guys in the tech stuff, and usually going into the sort of aproach that is more practical and indepth than most.

You can see the VRM temps here for different mobo's. On the high end Z390's the VRM's are fine for overclocking. On low end and older Z370's they'll just throttle down the chip.

https://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/asus_rog_maximum_xi_hero_review,20.html
https://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/msi_meg_z390_ace_review,20.html

 

[RasmusP]

@DucFreak But what about running 5 GHz with power limit? I never need my old i7 2600k at its 4.4 GHz on all threads, 100% use. I only really need this OC for games that are stuck at 30-60% overall CPU load, in the single thread limit.

So for, in my guesstimation, around 90% of today's games you would only need a 5 GHz 9900k while not going over 40-50% CPU load and therefore not needing the high power consumption.

Am I getting something incorrectly here?

For games that properly use all the CPU power of the 9900k, even 4.0 GHz would be plenty enough!

 

[DucFreak]

You can see the VRM temps here for different mobo's. On the high end Z390's the VRM's are fine for overclocking. On low end and older Z370's they'll just throttle down the chip.

https://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/asus_rog_maximum_xi_hero_review,20.html
https://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/msi_meg_z390_ace_review,20.html

Those may be the two exceptions (if not cherry picked for the review though) but the general situation you'll realize is that even high-end mainstream Z390 do hit throttling territory with 5.0Ghz OC'ing for 9900K.
For example, and again, check the review of Leo Waldock @ KitGuruTech, in his case using a Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Master.

 

[DucFreak]

@DucFreak But what about running 5 GHz with power limit? I never need my old i7 2600k at its 4.4 GHz on all threads, 100% use. I only really need this OC for games that are stuck at 30-60% overall CPU load, in the single thread limit.

So for, in my guesstimation, around 90% of today's games you would only need a 5 GHz 9900k while not going over 40-50% CPU load and therefore not needing the high power consumption.

Am I getting something incorrectly here?

For games that properly use all the CPU power of the 9900k, even 4.0 GHz would be plenty enough!

That's why I said that both the Intel i9 9900K and AMD R7 2700X are better ran at stock speeds.

For example, the "turbo mode" on the R7 2700X (at stock speeds/settings) is great because it auto boosts to 4.3Ghz up to 4 cores (not sure with the 5.0Ghz turbo on i9 9900K). Making it work stable at 4.2Ghz on all cores (i.e, through OC'ing) is a chore and temps then are ridiculous, on the chip and the motherboard's VRMs as well.

The i9 9900K seems to follow same trend.
We've entered a new era for high-end chips, where it seems the competicion forces the manufacturers to ensure they're already providing the most "balance" for most users.
On these, OC'ing delivers very small margins for super high costs (on top end parts investment and energy/heat), it no longer makes sense.

 

[BP]

If you have the money, go for it! I just hope that not many will support that price trend but you seem like you really want this sweetspot now.

My problem with this cpu is that you pay 150% of an 8700k for only 0-10% single thread boost in most games, especially Sims!
While you also pay 200% of a ryzen 2700x for again, only 10-15% multithread performance.

If the price doesn't hurt you it's still basically a combination of these two awesome CPUs and will last for a loooong time!

My only real concern was overclocking with restricted power limit but when I'm thinking about it I'm pretty sure you could overclock it to 5.1 GHz and restrict it at 90W so it will run single thread applications at the overclock and when something really uses everything you have it will not overheat

@johndough247 you will be absolutely fine. The hero is a great board with high end VRMs and it’ll last ages. Since you’re keeping it stock temps will be fine also for gaming. Just watch some YouTube videos on optimal fan replacement. That can make a decent difference.

You could maybe save Some money and get a 8700k or 8086k and move that money towards a 2080ti.

Thanks guys...yea I know it's costly, but I'm looking for longevity and that seems the most promising of the current offerings, plus I'm selling a few things (including my current computer) to finance it so I'm good.

@RobertR1 I already have the RTX 2080 here sitting in my room taunting me (everything on my list is already here or on its way...except the 9900K)...I'm almost tempted to try it in my current computer to see how it performs compared to my OC'd 980ti.

 

[BP]

Why not Z390 MB?

Had already started buying parts with the intention to get a 8700K, but decided to wait on the 9900K instead. Didn’t seem like there was any “must have” feature on the Z390 boards over a solid Z370 board like the Maximus X Hero to warrant returning it. No plans on overclocking either as mentioned before, so I’m guessing I’ll be okay.

 

[Andy_J]

This'll probably be controversial but, if just for gaming, then get the AMD R5 2600X (6c/12t), a good B450 motherboard and 3000+MHz DDR4 RAM. Value for money, nothing gets close atm.
And if it really needs to be top clocks for highest framerate "and so has to be Intel", the i7 8700K (6c/12t) on any decent Z370 mobo (or i7 9700K (8c/8t) on Z390) will still be good to get.
Spend the money on the graphics card instead (or hookers and cocaine, whatever).

Thanks DucFreak, I think you have done my research for me. I currently have an i5 4670k oc'd to 4.4 stable on air. I think this Ryzen 5 2600x and 32gb DDR4 ram with 470 mb will be a good upgrade. I already have a 1080 gpu. Do you think that will be a good upgrade performance wise?

 

[RasmusP]

Thanks DucFreak, I think you have done my research for me. I currently have an i5 4670k oc'd to 4.4 stable on air. I think this Ryzen 5 2600x and 32gb DDR4 ram with 470 mb will be a good upgrade. I already have a 1080 gpu. Do you think that will be a good upgrade performance wise?

Depends on the games you want to play (with better performance) and on what resolution you play.
I think a 1080 is strong enough for basically everything. If it can't maintain enough fps for your liking, just lower some settings.

With CPUs, as you know, that's not as easy...
So look at my chart for the 2700x which is a similar performance to your future 2600. The 2700x there is overclocked on all cores though!
Then look at the i7 4790k which afaik runs at 4.2 GHz at my friend's PC.

So if you play games with poor multi-threading like Assetto Corsa, rFactor 2, Raceroom, ACC then you will probably only see a fps increase of about 4-10 fps. Looking at 60 fps. Or in percentage: 6-16%.
That's really not worth any money! Only if you want to stream/render/mixing music too or have games that have really good multithreading support like Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty and other modern AAA games you will see a real difference with the Ryzen.

In comparison to the Ryzen, a 8700k would boost your 60 fps you'd get now to 70+! That's double the increase! With Intel's ridiculously high prices at the moment it's not recommended to even think about upgrading to it if you somehow care about your money and are not completely desperate to upgrade.

If I would have your CPU at the moment I would do two things:
- sell the CPU, get a i7 4790k used and enjoy the slight increase due to hyperthreading (selling + buying the used one shouldn't be above 100€!)

- wait for Ryzen 3!!!!!!!! (Which I'm doing btw)

I know you didn't ask me but maybe you like my input too