HS6-GT – DIY H-Pattern Shifter

[Bitacaia]

Hi.
I have made a page on thingiverse site with the STL files from the shifter.

The first page is already updated with this info, but i will post again the link for the site:

HS6-GT - DIY H-Pattern Shifter - Simracing by Tiago_Viana

This is a DIY H pattern shifter made by me. All the construction information can be found on this forum: https://www.racedepartment.com/threads/hs6-gt-%E2%80%93-diy-h-pattern-shifter.176550/ Before printing, please check the latest version on this forum. I will not add more info on the...

www.thingiverse.com

Have fun with it!

 

[Jbixby]

nevermind...

 

[pandax]

Daaaamn boy !
I had the idea for a long time, but never took the time to actually design somehting decent / sturdy enough. Bored on youtube, i looked upon DIY solutions, to see if "somehting new came up in the last few months"; and BAM. Here is your work.
And,daaaaamn boy ! That's lit as **** !
I'm impressed, and will most likely end in building one too.
First, my wheel. Second, the shifter

Many thanks for the work / design, and free sharing, that's awesome.
Will get back to you when all the parts are my hands !

edit : I could have mentionned that i design a lot myself, and will gladly help improving the design !
May it be now or when i get all the parts, i'd gladly help. If you're interested, just PM me !

 

[Jbixby]

Cool, so I finished mine. I like it so far. It works pretty well. Only problem so far is going into 3 or 4 I get stuck on the bolts. My idea is I'll probably 3d print something or make an aluminum piece on my cnc that's rounded on the end so it slides into the microswitch easier instead of hitting the bolts and getting stuck.

The only other thing I want to try to change is the resistance. There are some die springs I found that should fit and are 4-5 times stronger than the ones I'm using now.

 

[Bitacaia]

Cool, so I finished mine. I like it so far. It works pretty well. Only problem so far is going into 3 or 4 I get stuck on the bolts. My idea is I'll probably 3d print something or make an aluminum piece on my cnc that's rounded on the end so it slides into the microswitch easier instead of hitting the bolts and getting stuck.

The only other thing I want to try to change is the resistance. There are some die springs I found that should fit and are 4-5 times stronger than the ones I'm using now.

Hi mate!
Nice to see other person with this shifter.

Regarding your shifter being stuck on 3rd and 4th, it's surprising. Probably you have some hardware tolerance problem. What I mean is, the m6 spacer, that is connected to the "offset lever" have a bigger dimension. Can you check if the outer diameter is 10mm? If it's bigger, then, my advise is to buy a bunch of them and measure them, and use the ones with a dimension closer to 10mm.
The space of the gate bolts is 10.3mm. So, theoretically there is a gap of 0.3mm. Probably 0.3 is too small tolerance between the gate bolts.
If the problem isn't this, then I don't have a clue...

The die spring will be stronger, but can have consequences on the printed parts. It will be interesting to see how long it will last. So, if you change, keep us informed about the reliability.

So far I have no report about long use reliability.

Can you share photos of your shifter? And video, if possible!

Tiago Viana

Edit: the first time i wrote this post, i said the Outer Diameter is 8mm. But after checking, the dimension is 10. so, i updated this mistake

 

[pandax]

Going all over your project again, and just came up with an idea to "improve" the feeling.
Not sure about the idea, but here iit is : how about different slopes for the engagement bearing ?
Like, instead of having the same ramps / the same effort for engaging and disengaging the speeed, you'd have to put more effort in the first move than the second.


I don't know if i made myself clear, but it could help to have a stronger but still realistic feeling ?

 

[Bitacaia]

Going all over your project again, and just came up with an idea to "improve" the feeling.
Not sure about the idea, but here iit is : how about different slopes for the engagement bearing ?
Like, instead of having the same ramps / the same effort for engaging and disengaging the speeed, you'd have to put more effort in the first move than the second.


I don't know if i made myself clear, but it could help to have a stronger but still realistic feeling ?

Because i'm getting older, i don't like to daily drive manual cars anymore. So, i don't have any manual gearbox car i can test the feeling of the engagement. But, at work i had a college is driving a new Mustang with manual gearbox. After playing around with the shifter, i notice the engagement movement is softer then the disengagement.
This is the only manual gearbox i played around... so i cannot tell more... I would love to try a manual gearbox engagement from a racing car, like the old 80's/90's DTM cars. (note: all my friends or drive automatic or city-car gearbox...)

Because this was the first official version of this shifter, i opted for making a symmetric engagement slopes. To avoid any possible problem, and to avoid any complaint about the different engagement feeling. As we all know, we like to drive simulated racing cars, and everybody have an opinion how they should behave although we never drove one or some of us are 14 year old...
So, changing the shape of the slopes is possible and feasible. But will be a subjective thing. And i encourage people to do it. But i will not replace the main "Offset Lever" with a non symmetric one.

If you make a "Offset Lever" asymmetric and you feel it gives a improved feeling, feel free to make the model available to others, using this Thread.

I hope you can change easily the shape of the slopes on Fusion 360. If you find some problem, just send me a DM.

Tiago Viana

 

[pandax]

Thanks for your answer !
My advice, don't try race car manual gearboxes
It's straight cut gearboxes, that's from another world. Not dog ring, all all arm power; and damn that's brutal.
But, in a way, that's what i'm looking for ! To have a bit of a fight with the gearbox.

First i'll try your design as it is, but for sure i'm gonna try and play with the slopes !
And if i get decent results (or if anyone wants to try), i'll share it here.

And, if anyone wants to tweak any part but doesn't handle fusion, i can give a hand, no problem.

Thanks again for all the work tiago !
Amazing job.

 

[Jbixby]

Hi mate!
Nice to see other person with this shifter.

Regarding your shifter being stuck on 3rd and 4th, it's surprising. Probably you have some hardware tolerance problem. What I mean is, the m6 spacer, that is connected to the "offset lever" have a bigger dimension. Can you check if the outer diameter is 10mm? If it's bigger, then, my advise is to buy a bunch of them and measure them, and use the ones with a dimension closer to 10mm.
The space of the gate bolts is 10.3mm. So, theoretically there is a gap of 0.3mm. Probably 0.3 is too small tolerance between the gate bolts.
If the problem isn't this, then I don't have a clue...

The die spring will be stronger, but can have consequences on the printed parts. It will be interesting to see how long it will last. So, if you change, keep us informed about the reliability.

So far I have no report about long use reliability.

Can you share photos of your shifter? And video, if possible!

Tiago Viana

Edit: the first time i wrote this post, i said the Outer Diameter is 8mm. But after checking, the dimension is 10. so, i updated this mistake

Thinking about this, I believe it's also a problem with my printer making the parts just a bit smaller than you designed them. It's likely the gate between the bolts is smaller than you designed on my print. Having a rounded or tapered end on the spacers would probably help anyway if you happen to hit one of the bolts while shifting. I'll have to take it apart and and check out the m6 spacers diameter after I get some stronger springs.

I'll get a video later on for you.

I do like how the shifter feels and sounds and that it does have some quirks when I'm shifting(likely due to my prints not being great). Anyway, I'm having a good time using it(and had a great time building it) and I think it's a great idea if you want an H shifter but don't want the toy like ones(logitech) or want to spend a ton of money on the expensive ones for something you don't use all the time(frex, prosim).

 

[Bitacaia]

Thanks for your answer !
My advice, don't try race car manual gearboxes
It's straight cut gearboxes, that's from another world. Not dog ring, all all arm power; and damn that's brutal.
But, in a way, that's what i'm looking for ! To have a bit of a fight with the gearbox.

First i'll try your design as it is, but for sure i'm gonna try and play with the slopes !
And if i get decent results (or if anyone wants to try), i'll share it here.

And, if anyone wants to tweak any part but doesn't handle fusion, i can give a hand, no problem.

Thanks again for all the work tiago !
Amazing job.

If you are looking for a stronger feeling, there are 2 options.
1.Stronger springs.
2.Make the ball bearing smaller diameter. Because of the sliding movement of the "Offset Lever" (10mm) plus the diameter of the bearing (16mm), there is so much contact you can make with the slope and the bearing. By reducing the diameter, the attacking surface of the slope can be lower in relation to the center of the bearing. This will generate more force being applied on the walls of the "Spring Retainer" part, but will be possible to compress more the spring.

This hypothesis wasn't test yet. But i'm sure it will make the engagement feeling better and stronger. When i have more time i will make some tests. I have at home a 12mm diameter ball bearing. Just need to redesign and print the required parts.

PS. i made a bad example with Powerpoint to explain the idea. Hope it helps to clarify.

 

[Bitacaia]

Thinking about this, I believe it's also a problem with my printer making the parts just a bit smaller than you designed them. It's likely the gate between the bolts is smaller than you designed on my print. Having a rounded or tapered end on the spacers would probably help anyway if you happen to hit one of the bolts while shifting. I'll have to take it apart and and check out the m6 spacers diameter after I get some stronger springs.

I'll get a video later on for you.

I do like how the shifter feels and sounds and that it does have some quirks when I'm shifting(likely due to my prints not being great). Anyway, I'm having a good time using it(and had a great time building it) and I think it's a great idea if you want an H shifter but don't want the toy like ones(logitech) or want to spend a ton of money on the expensive ones for something you don't use all the time(frex, prosim).

Making a chamfer on the end of the spacer would help to make the transition from 2nd to 3rd. like you have here in this example.

it was something i had on my mind. But i never notice the need for it, so far.
Nevertheless, it's something important to be talked about. So other builders can have this option.

If you test it, please tell us if the engagement was improved.

Tiago Viana

 

[Fatapoc]

Nice to see this shifter is getting the attention it deserves. I ordered nylon bearings a while ago, because I dont like the metal bearing on the plastic, they are a little bit bigger so you would need smaller springs. I will test this soon.

 

[pandax]

Bitacaia, Thanks for the answer.
You made it very clear, and i thought about it also, but i like the idea of playing with the slopes (me, stubborn ? naaah)
But if you try with smaller bearings, i'd gladly hear back from you to see how much it changes the feeling !

Fatapoc, It could be a very nice idea to help smoothen the feeling and reduce the noise.
However, as stated by Bitacaia just above, increasing the diameter will reduce the strenght needed.

I will probably try a few setups, and probably try to cover the plastic part with a softer material (electrical tape ? liquid rubber ? or even heat shrink sleeve on the bearing), to get the softer feeling /noise reduction intended with the nylon bearing, but keeping it small and harsh with a metal bearing. Not much hope in duration, but who knows !
Trial and error is the way to success !

 

[Fatapoc]

Bitacaia, Thanks for the answer.
You made it very clear, and i thought about it also, but i like the idea of playing with the slopes (me, stubborn ? naaah)
But if you try with smaller bearings, i'd gladly hear back from you to see how much it changes the feeling !

Fatapoc, It could be a very nice idea to help smoothen the feeling and reduce the noise.
However, as stated by Bitacaia just above, increasing the diameter will reduce the strenght needed.

I will probably try a few setups, and probably try to cover the plastic part with a softer material (electrical tape ? liquid rubber ? or even heat shrink sleeve on the bearing), to get the softer feeling /noise reduction intended with the nylon bearing, but keeping it small and harsh with a metal bearing. Not much hope in duration, but who knows !
Trial and error is the way to success !

That's the fun of a diy project. The diameter of the bearing will reduce the strength needed but you can counter that with stronger springs if I'm right?

 

[Bitacaia]

Nice to see this shifter is getting the attention it deserves. I ordered nylon bearings a while ago, because I dont like the metal bearing on the plastic, they are a little bit bigger so you would need smaller springs. I will test this soon.

View attachment 353249

Made a quick search, and found this v-slot wheel. Outer diameter is close to 16mm. So, the only variable being changed here would be the contact surface with the "Offset Lever".

Delrin Mini V Guide Wheel With Bearings : MAKERALOT, Maker Tools and Materials

Mini POM V Wheel, Linear Guide Wheel, for 2020 V slot aluminum extrusion Material: POM 2pcs of MR105 ball bearings included Inner diameter: 5mm Outer diameter: 15.23mm Thickness: 8.8mm Package List: 1 x Delrin Mini V Wheel With Bearings

www.makeralot.com

Other option. Make a printed sleave on a m8 bolt. Put allot of grease. And hope it rotates around the shaft. Would be easy to change diameter!

 

[pandax]

That's the fun of a diy project. The diameter of the bearing will reduce the strength needed but you can counter that with stronger springs if I'm right?

Totally right, but stronger springs would stress printed parts a lot more ... and this far it's hard to tell how far we can go.
But ofc, you're totally right, and it might be the solution !
I'm super excited about this, and having different peoples trying different solutions is the best way to get cool results fast !
Try these on, and get back to us, it would be super nice to hear your thoughts.
Do you by any luck order classic metal bearing ? To compare them both in the same setup ?

Bitacaia, this wheel looks awesome ! It might be puuuurfect !
But i don't believe in the M8 screw ...a 8mm rod might do the trick, but the friction caused by the thread of the screw will cause too much stress and wear, grease won't help much, and the printed sleeve wouldn't last long imo :/


[edit] Look who i found on aliexpress ...
Bad link, please look at the post below for the correct link to the POM wheel !

 

[Bitacaia]

Totally right, but stronger springs would stress printed parts a lot more ... and this far it's hard to tell how far we can go.
But ofc, you're totally right, and it might be the solution !
I'm super excited about this, and having different peoples trying different solutions is the best way to get cool results fast !
Try these on, and get back to us, it would be super nice to hear your thoughts.
Do you by any luck order classic metal bearing ? To compare them both in the same setup ?

Bitacaia, this wheel looks awesome ! It might be puuuurfect !
But i don't believe in the M8 screw ...a 8mm rod might do the trick, but the friction caused by the thread of the screw will cause too much stress and wear, grease won't help much, and the printed sleeve wouldn't last long imo :/


[edit] Look who i found on aliexpress ...
The almighty delrin wheel !

The link you shared don't have the ideal wheel. The ideal V-Slot wheel should have the outer diameter of 16mm or smaller.
The ball bearing should be the MR105zz with POM wheel.

this link is better:

0.95€ 82% OFF|5/10 Stuks Cnc Openbuilds Wielen Plastic Pom Katrol Wiel Passief Rond Wiel & V Type Voor V Slot C Beam 3d Printer Onderdelen|idler pulley|idler wheelidler pulley wheel - AliExpress

Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com

www.aliexpress.com

 

[pandax]

Indeed ! Didn't pay much attention; my bad.
So close yet so far
I remove my link, thanks for yours.

And I just ordered all the parts !

(including one bare 625 bearing, one 625 with POM , and one 105 with POM. I'll give them all a try, see if i feel any difference, and how it affects the feeling !)

So pumped up about this project !!

[edit]
A few questions, about the BOM / screws and nuts.
@3:10 in the video, you use a long nut which doesn't appear in the BOM. Am i missing something ?
And about the threaded inserts, could you be more specific about the length and outer diameter used ?
And where did you purchase them ?

And, i know it's a bit late to ask, if i get the chance i'll do it myself; it would be nice to have pictures of each part needed.
It would be a lot clearer and would avoid mistakes !

 

[Bitacaia]

Indeed ! Didn't pay much attention; my bad.
So close yet so far
I remove my link, thanks for yours.

And I just ordered all the parts !

(including one bare 625 bearing, one 625 with POM , and one 105 with POM. I'll give them all a try, see if i feel any difference, and how it affects the feeling !)

So pumped up about this project !!

[edit]
A few questions, about the BOM / screws and nuts.
@3:10 in the video, you use a long nut which doesn't appear in the BOM. Am i missing something ?
And about the threaded inserts, could you be more specific about the length and outer diameter used ?
And where did you purchase them ?

And, i know it's a bit late to ask, if i get the chance i'll do it myself; it would be nice to have pictures of each part needed.
It would be a lot clearer and would avoid mistakes !

OPS... you are right... I forgot to include the M8 Long nut!!! I will update this mistake later. Thanks for the tip

But, just search for "Long Nut M8x30".

Regarding the threaded inserts:

I used this type of insert, but I don't recommend them. They do the job, but they are not perfect!

Page Not Found - Aliexpress.com

I would probably try this type of threaded insert:

5.61€ |Messing Hot Melt Inzet Noten Verwarming Molding Koperen Draad Inserts Moer Sl Type Dubbele Twill Gekartelde Injectie Messing Moer m2M3 100Pcs|Noten| - AliExpress

Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com

www.aliexpress.com

Just for reference, you can watch this very good video of CNC Kitchen, taking about threaded inserts:

 

[pandax]

Ok thanks !
Perfect.

I was planning to go with the cheaper ones, hoping to get better bang for the buck ... until i saw the results.
I watched both video of CNC kitchen, and decided to go with the more expensive one.
But considering they're offered in various lenght and OD, i was curious on which one you used, and thus how the parts were designed !