HistoricX racing club feedback and suggestions

[Yves Larose]

Hi guy's

in this thread we'll be talking about suggestions for events, in the next few weeks we'll be trying different things and you are welcome to make suggestions after all its everybody club i will only ask that when you suggest an event that you also think about the less skilled driver so it won't be too hard and not enjoyable for them.

let's start talking

 

[Denis Betty]

Suggested tracks:
Mid-Ohio - @Allan Ramsbottom
Kanebitten - @Allan Ramsbottom
Philip Island - Allan
Assen - @Peter Stokman
Limerock Park - Peter
Zandvoort - Hans
Putnam Park - @Quas
Essington Park - @Quas
Charade - @Tim Ling & @Luca Bernacchini
Anglesea - @Tim Ling
Leinz FoS (GP Short) - @Roland
Halle-Saale Schleife - @Roland@Stig Bidstrup (great track to drive but trees & solid objects trackside - not sure it's suitable.... carnage may ensue).
Goldenport - Roland
East London, Prince George - @Ole Marius Myrvold
Nords - we did this a while ago (I think too long for the xmas break)
Cadwell - @Luca Bernacchini (coming soon)
Oulton - done that this year
Magione - Luca
Knockhill -Ross
Snetterton,
Silverstone national - Ross:- We did this in a sprint/feature the other week
Road Atlanta
Ingliston -Ross
Nivelles - @Rupe Wilson
Kielce Poland - @Steven Walker

 

[Rupe Wilson]

I have a question regarding the qualifying.

It is stated in our rules that we should leave a gap to the car in front on exiting the pits.

So why do we have drivers trying to overtake on the out lap.
and we have the guys trying to slip stream each other in qually, why else would you try to be so close to the car in front..
And again we have guys cutting the track trying to gain a few extra tenths...

I read the rules and to me it says that the above is not what we are looking for... Maybe i have understood it wrong..

 

[Allan Ramsbottom]

Theres guys who overtake in the pit lane to get out ahead,can you not overtake on the out lap or indeed on your qualli lap??

 

[Allan Ramsbottom]

This is in the Racing Rules & Conduct..
A further point is this one from the GPL article - "Stay out of the way of drivers who are on flying laps when you're on an out lap, or any other non-useful qualifying lap for that matter. It can be hard to find the space to complete a clean flying lap sometimes. Its all the worse if people who are on an out lap try to ‘race’ those who are trying to complete a clean flying lap. Be a sport. Let others complete their flying laps as cleanly as possible". So, if you make a mistake and ruin your own lap, please don't hamper any other driver and cause them to lose time on their lap.

 

[Stuart Thomson]

Theres guys who overtake in the pit lane to get out ahead,can you not overtake on the out lap or indeed on your qualli lap??

No, imo.

Once you're on track during quali there shouldnt be any overtaking, unless someone goes off track. None of the tracks is either so long or so short that 10 minutes won't allow you to put up a timed lap if you dont happen to get out of the pits first.

Rather than trying to overtake, slow down. Leave more room, not close gaps.

 

[Rupe Wilson]

Correct Allan there should be no overtaking in the pit lane to get out first. and pit speed limit should be observed at all times..
When the light goes green you can enter the track ( which is what ive seen ) and in the out lap the drivers should be leaving a gap to the car in front, not overtaking as many as as you can. which is why i asked the question.

Are you asking for the right for a faster driver to overtake a slower driver on the outlap.. .. that don't seem right to me and is not in the spirit of the club.. saying the slower drivers must wait or get out of the way of the faster guys..

We all pay a membership to race and drive and should all be given the same opportunity to drive their laps regardless of speed or experience.
If a driver gains on a slower driver whilst out on a qually lap and slower driver is driving as fast as he can doing his qually laps. the faster driver is not supposed to hamper them. They can always back off find some space and again and try on the next lap.

If i have this wrong im sorry, but why then say leave a gap on you outlap..

 

[Allan Ramsbottom]

well if we are going to have mixed cars that can be 1-2 secs diff in pace,and on track depending who,s driving can make that a 5 sec gap, times that with 13+ guys that we now are getting on track,cars will start stacking up surely..

 

[Luca Bernacchini]

@Rupe Wilson , I have to admit that I'm one of those that sometimes overtake during the launch lap. I agree to let a gap to the car in front and to not use its slipstream, but if the car in front of me is proceeding very slowly and I know (from practice session) that I'm faster I overtake it without any doubt.
It would be worst to have to overtake it during flying laps.
I'm use to not practice before the race and, during quali, I'm still setting up the car so it could be a pity to waste time behind a slow car and even the launch lap is useful to understand if the modified setup is better or worse.

About cutting the track I'm fully with you but I have given up to complain. I did it, but I've understood that it's useless.
Since the fun is in the battles and not in victories... just have fun and enjoy the battles!
Anyway, here is the replay with all quali best laps overlapped so everybody can see and judge himself. Even if I don't do on purpose, sometimes I find myself in cutting too.
http://www.sparapaunz.com/_RD/RD_Vitus_QualiBest.zip

 

[Allan Ramsbottom]

Also if we are debating issues,entering during quali needs to be looked at.Ok if you get a disco or another reason if you have at least been in practise session,but to just join out of the blue,i,ve always been lead to believe it was a no-no..

 

[Stuart Thomson]

Driver stacking is up to drivers to manage. 5 sec gaps on a 90 sec lap is 18 individual windows. It is honestly not that tricky.

Think of it like this: you wouldn't like someone spoiling your lap for any reason, so don't spoil anyone elses. Peoples relative pace has absolutely no bearing and grants absolutely no boons to any driver over any other.

 

[Luca Bernacchini]

@Stuart Thomson 5s/lap gap means 20s or more in a quali session.

So, as you wrote "you wouldn't like someone spoiling your lap for any reason, so don't spoil anyone elses" it could be good if slower drivers wait a little before exiting pits. I always do it where I find myself slower than others.

IMO to overtake a slower driver during his launch lap it's not a problem for him (nothing is or will be ruined) and let me to avoid problems in the next laps.

Anyway I did not know this rule and I've understand why @Sven-Arne Andersson flashed lights to me when I overtaked him during launch lap. Sorry Sven.

 

[Stuart Thomson]

@Stuart Thomson 5s/lap gap means 20s or more in a quali session.

No, a 5 second gap is just that - a gap. I never said 5 sec per lap. With someone approx the same speed as you, the gap will still be ~ 5 sec after 5 laps.

And theoretically, it would be just as good for the faster drivers to wait, as their laps will be shorter and therefore need less aggregate time.

 

[Allan Ramsbottom]

No, thats not fair wanting slower drivers to wait.Everyone has the same right to leave when they wish..

 

[Denis Betty]

Rupe and Stu are correct, there is no overtaking in qualli unless (IMO) the driver in front calls a quicker driver through. If you are not on Teamspeak, it is difficult to safely call you through.

In my case, I sometimes see a quicker driver behind me in the pit exit, or just after leaving the pits. I may choose to pull off the track and allow the guy through in this instance, but that is up to me.

If you leave a 5 second gap, but you catch the guy in front, the onus is on you to slow down and pull back. Do not crowd the guy or try to overtake. If a slower driver is on a bad lap or an out lap, he may pull off line and let you through if he wishes. I don't wanna spoil your lap, so if I've blown mine, I will try to find a safe place to get out of the way. The problem with this, is that you may have another quick driver close behind and it can be difficult to get up to speed in time to stay out of the way. Please try to bear this in mind.

Luca you are correct about the order we should leave the pits. If we know that we are slow, leaving the pits first is going to lead to our buddies getting backed up behind us. I believe that it's common courtesy, gentleman racer driving and just makes sense, for a slower driver to wait a short while at the beginning of qualli, to allow quicker drivers a chance to leave the pits. That said, it is a courtesy and not a rule. I would hope and expect people to do this off their own back.

 

[Allan Ramsbottom]

The thing is,this racing club is changing,its getting faster.When we moved over to HistorX we had roughly 3-4 quick drivers,now we are averaging double that and when Rupe gets up to speed that will be another,jarek when he joins thats another, so maybe a re-think on quali might have to be made...just a suggestion..

 

[Denis Betty]

We will be going over to Superpole for short tracks. Starting with the next WST I believe.

 

[Luca Bernacchini]

Last Vitus Q1 saw 3.5s between Allan and the slower driver, this means more than 10s on three laps. If we all have to let 10s of gap. There is not enough space for 15 drivers.
I think it's should be a gentlemen behaviour if people that know to be slower let faster cars to pass during the outlap, they also will be not in the need to let a gap to them.

I agree that people must leave pits when they want, but I also think that is stupid to start a flying lap with a faster car close to you and when it happen to me I always give way before the last corner so I, and he, could both have a clean next lap.
I can't see where is the problem if a faster driver overtakes a slower one during the outlap (for both). It's the best thing for both!
I said I agree to let a reasonable gap to the car in front but what if after 3 laps a faster car reach a slower one? When I'm the slower I give way (I also receive a blue flag from rF), When I'm the faster I hope to have a free pass.

 

[Luca Bernacchini]

@Denis Betty , superpole is a good solution. Quali in private mode is another one.

 

[Allan Ramsbottom]

Is any1 going on for a few laps......Chaps.

 

[Denis Betty]

I think we qualli as a group. It's a social event, first and foremost.
I'm sorry, but if you come out of the pits behind a driver who you know is slower, you leave a gap. If 5s is not enough, leave a little more. If you still catch the guy, be prepared to lose a lap while you back off and then go again the next lap.
If you come up behind me and I'm not on a good lap, I will try to find a place to let you through. Check your replays, I do it often. I hope others will do this too. We should always remember though, this is for fun. So please guys, do something nice for another driver as often as you can. Whether that is back off and don't crowd him (in qualli), or let someone through (in qualli). If we all do these things, we can have so much more fun in a really nice spirit.