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gtr2 vs ams1

Discussion in 'Automobilista' started by mucho, Jun 29, 2019.

  1. mucho

    mucho

    Messages:
    61
    Ratings:
    +6
    could somebody point me out the major features of AMS1 in compare of rf1gtl//gtr2/r07
    i dont want to start a flame war, just thinking of migrating to another platform

    things which i already found out is
    GFX:
    more shaders
    dirt build up

    physics:
    Turbo
    flatespots
    limited tire sets
    better blue flags
    live track (track usage)
    FFB (enchanced)
    upscaled physics


    does not have :
    rain ?
    night ?
    wipers
    movable parts?
     
  2. Stingraymx

    Stingraymx

    Messages:
    156
    Ratings:
    +32
    Has day/night. No rain (thus no wipers). Not sure what movable parts are, am sure someone else can answer that bit
     
  3. Kenny Paton

    Kenny Paton
    Premium

    Messages:
    12,097
    Ratings:
    +5,534
    With the steam sale on why not have both.
    I keep 3 GTR2 installs for my favourite mods Race 07, GTL and AMS1 as, best of all worlds.
    If you're into open wheelers then AMS is superb, in fact all their cars are really well done and are great to drive.
    The AI is very good, better than the others even with the AI mods, and online is stable.
    Of course I can't resist mentioning that GTR2 had no wipers:)
    Unless storage is a problem no need to ditch old favourites. (I also tell my wife that:D)
     
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  4. Marc Collins

    Marc Collins

    Messages:
    1,290
    Ratings:
    +389
    AMS is simply the latest and best refinement of the original rF engine that all of the titles are based upon. Well worth the price, even if not on sale...if you want the latest evolution in that family of sims.
     
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  5. Salvatore Sirignano

    Salvatore Sirignano
    Premium

    Messages:
    191
    Ratings:
    +100
    It has AI that can actually slipstream and overtake, I wasted ages trying to get them to do it in GTR2..
     
  6. mucho

    mucho

    Messages:
    61
    Ratings:
    +6
    @Kenny Paton
    i must admit driving open wheeler in AMS really good, i think it have something to do with the superb FFB (T500), but even the Lancer is fun to drive

    @Marc Collins
    yes, i own all games for sim racing (except PC2), but the cars i use, are only made for GTR2 / R07
    so, the question for me is, is it worth, converting them to AMS


    @Salvatore Sirignano
    yes, overtaking/slipstream is a big point (have to check this)



    to add some further points i found:

    spotter (better this one then none)
    safety car (vs R07)

    added more audio occurrences
     
  7. Niels_at_home

    Niels_at_home
    Reiza Studios

    Messages:
    268
    Ratings:
    +419
    There might be differences between the core physics in GTR2 and later SimBin titles, I don't know if they added things themselves or got a later version from ISI at some point.

    Versus GTR2 we have a few more things:
    - separate lateral / longitudinal load sensitivity (added in rF1)
    - better tire combined force model (added in GSC)
    - far better self alligning torque physics (added in AMS)
    - engine torque demand maps (added in AMS)
    - unsprung inertia bug fixed (added in GSC)
    - up to 6 controllers instead of 3 (added in AMS)
    - all the ones I forgot about..
     
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  8. mucho

    mucho

    Messages:
    61
    Ratings:
    +6
    big thanks for the detailed info
     
  9. LMSim

    LMSim

    Messages:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    Somebody can expand on the unsprung inertia bug in the rfactor1?
     
  10. Niels_at_home

    Niels_at_home
    Reiza Studios

    Messages:
    268
    Ratings:
    +419
    This is both not so complicated but also quite confusing..

    The weight and inertia values you enter in the HDV file are for the entire car. However there is more than one mass, because we have the main car body and 4 corners worth of unsprung mass (tire, wheel,spindle).
    If you enter the total values and the individual unsprung mass and inertia values, you can find the mass and inertia of the main car body by subtracting the unsprung from the total.

    They do this by figuring out what the inertia of the tire/wheel/spindle is relative to the center of gravity of the main car body. If the front left tire in a top view is 2 meters away from the car CG and one corner worth of unsprung weight is 35kg, then the yaw inertia this one wheel has around the car CG is 35 * 2^2 = 140. Do this for all wheels and spindles and you a value of 560. Say you entered a mass of 1000kg and a yaw inertia of 1500 in the HDV. Now the game knows 560 inertia is from the unsprung bits and that means 940 is from the car body. The main car body mass becomes 1000 - (35*4) = 860. There, each body is defined, physics will make sense!

    In, probably, all rFactor derived sims, most likely up to the Superleague game which came out in ummm 200x, this 'working back the inertias' code has an error in it. It calculates the unsprung inertias by doing mass * distance, instead of mass * distance * distance.

    Lets do it the old (pre Superleague way) and new (post Superleague game) way:
    RF1: Car body yaw inertia = 1500 - (35*2*4 corners) = 1220
    AMS: Car yaw body inertia = 1500 - (35 * 2^2 * 4 corners) = 940

    I.e. in rF1 and other older versions of the code, the effective total yaw inertia of the car is too great, and the car will turn a bit more sluggishly than it should, provided the distance from the main body CG to the unsprung masses is greater than 1.

    This also means in roll, where if your track widths are typically 1.5 meters, the distance to the CG is 0.75 meters and the error goes the other way. Say roll inertia in the HDV is 100
    RF1: Car body roll inertia = 100 - (35*0.75*4) = -5
    AMS: Car body roll inetia = 100 - (35 * 0.75^2 *4) = 21

    RF1 will crash as it will try to apply 100 - 105 = -5 worth of inertia to the main car body
    AMS will work as expected and there is 100 - 79 = 21 left for the main car body.

    This is quite important when making karts or worse, scale model cars as this incorrect compensation error can lead to the game crashing or behaving oddly.

    HOpe that makes some sense, I spent way too long trying to explain it! :)
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2019
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  11. Emery

    Emery

    Messages:
    1,916
    Ratings:
    +642
    "Superleague Formula 2009: The Game", released 31 October 2009. Gosh, I'd forgotten about that one (and understandably so).
     
  12. Domagoj Lovrić

    Domagoj Lovrić
    Reiza Studios

    Messages:
    124
    Ratings:
    +63
    OT:
    Never paid attention to Superleague formula, even in it's heyday. Thought it was silly idea. Looked it up today after Niels mentioned it.

    Fits the current moment of "Bring back v12s"
     
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