R3E R3E Racing Club

[paulbee058]

@Kennett Ylitalo I'm not sure I'd like locked set ups. I'd prefer to learn how to use the tuning options. That said, there a one or two car types that would naturally lend themselves to fun default settings. The NSU and Formula RaceRoom Junior spring to mind.

 

[Calvyn White]

@balage06 I'm sure we all understand where you're coming from but at the end of the day the club is for all levels whether you're fast or slow, young or old and male or female.
How much practice is done for any event is totally up to the individual. If you don't want to do the practice that is also entirely up to the individual.
I myself do plenty of practice and I kinda don't like being put in a position to be made feel guilty for it.
I am not an alien. I have to practice a hell of a lot to get anywhere near a acceptable speed and I'm still not fast as an alien. But there's no harm in trying right.
Because of all that practice I'm willing to share everything I learnt, setups and advice whether it's asked for or not. And for me that's a big part of the clubs community spirit. I do know some of the people here at this club just have not got the time for one reason or another. Job, family, kids etc. And for these reasons most will help because of it.
Even though I do this practice it's not about the win to me it is about taking part with a very nice atmosphere most of the time.
I cannot see anybody not taking anything they enjoy seriously. I've always personally taking everything I enjoy and have fun doing seriously I've often said I take my fun seriously. So much so I like to share my fun so others can have fun.

We are all here to have fun whether you take it seriously or not that is up to the individual.
And if some don't take it seriously that is not the problem of those that do.

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

It is never a sin to do your best. But the effects of one trying more than others will push others to do the same and while in a league settings that is exactly what should happen, club is a bit more casual. Everyone is free to drive at the pace they want to drive and don't let anyone tell you any different. I'm personally going to take it easy, my days to trying to be fast are way, way over... So when others are also pushing, i have to start pushing too and that is way less fun.

It is dilemma, there are always to kind of people; those who are in this to improve themselves, which i very much was in the early days of RD. Now i'm on the casual train and don't give a rats ass about improving myself, i found my limits and they are embarrassingly low.. But i did learn something over the years, i've put in the thousands of hours needed and like to now get my fun out of it. I can warn those who are trying: it can suck all the fun out of this. Once you are starting to think about diet and exercise so you can drive better, it is time to seriously think why you are doing this and stop dreaming too far.. and my dream was just to get to top5, at least once.. Did never happen, not even when putting serious hours in it.. there is a healthy limit on how much one should really try in a video game before it becomes something else. Having fun should be #1, even when you have self improvement reasons (simracing can be a meditative tool too, reaching that flow is.. more than fun.. but it gets too serious way too fast.)

Trying to fit both ends in the same grid is tough, it has always been. With low numbers it just gets exaggerated, with larger grids it is not a problem.

 

[DND]

Was high as first, low as last and finished 5th...I think. This race was one the most enjoyable one's yet.
Not sure I'm understanding the complaint, is it because it's a club event you shouldn't try your best?

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

Was high as first, low as last and finished 5th...I think. This race was one the most enjoyable one's yet.
Not sure I'm understanding the complaint, is it because it's a club event you shouldn't try your best?

It is the old problem as the grid gets thinner and the gaps to the front gets larger.. It can get too lonely to some and then the grid thins even more until there is no midpack anymore. It is a problem that has no solutions as no one can say you have to drive slower in a race. At some point, it also becomes pandering if faster drivers start to driver slower; you know their real pace.

Mentoring is one good approach to this, realizing why the fast drivers are fast can be done on track but only when you can spend more time in close quarters But that won't happen in a regular race much. I say everyone just driver at the pace they want, it'll sort out in the end but to also remember that it isn't actually important race and that people have not practiced that much...

It is a bit like going out with your mates to play some football in the backyard and then one of the dudes shows up in cleats and shinguards..

It is not just simracing that has the same "problem" of people having different motivation levels and reasons for playing. In FPS games "tryhards" are more a problems since they literally prevent you from playing. At least in simracing you ALWAYS have one opponent: lap time.

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

Talented driver should be able to create new challenges for themselves: pick the slowest car, put more fuel in the tank, wrong tires, make the setup hard, simulate some condition or problem etc..

 

[DND]

I see your point. I do practice on Friday and Saturday for Sunday's event. Typically I stay away from setups as I really don't have a clue, unless I pick up a point or two from others during teamspeak.
Sunday's are the only time my schedule fits as I am a few time zones away, I feel I can say my pace and race acumen has improved since doing the club races and I owe it to everyone that participates so I hope you continue to come out and play on Sundays

 

[UMC 22]

I think most would agree that Oschersleben can be a little bugger of a track, but it certainly didn't disappoint when it came to the racing! That was the most fun I've had in a GTR 3 for some time. The early pit strategy worked a treat initially as I made up loads of time and was in 2nd at one point, but unfortunately it left too much of the race remaining. I changed my rears so by the last 10-15 mins my fronts were trashed and my car was refusing to go around corners. It didn't detract from the fun though, really great racing guys!

____________________​

Now to address what people are saying about the club. RD's racing clubs have always been and always will be open to everybody, regardless of skill level, available practice time, setup experience, equipment type, or whatever other ways people care to differentiate between drivers. They are not about winning and competition, they are about relaxed, friendly fun. I can't speak for all of the clubs, but relaxed, friendly fun it exactly what we have in the R3E club so I would disagree with anybody who says people are treating the races as if they were part of a league. But even if they were, so what? As long as they follow our simple rules and respect other drivers, there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. People are free to race as they please.

Another big aspect of the clubs is that they serve as a learning experience. Less experienced drivers (including complete rookies) can jump in and start learning from the more experienced, not to mention that it is impossible to learn proper race craft unless you are actually racing real people. This learning experience includes setups, as again there is no better place to learn than a non-competitive race, and no better people to learn from than those who already know what you want to learn. There is literally always setup discussion during every practice session so all can benefit if they choose to. It's really not something I am interested in removing from the clubs by fixing setups or restricting the classes used. (For reference, I am useless with setups yet still do ok. Proof that they are the key to the last 0.5 secs of lap time, not to whether you are competitive or not.)

As for the rest, not being funny but there will always be people that can devote more time to a hobby than others. There's nothing RD can do about that, nor should it. It's up to each individual to find the time to practice and enjoy their hobbies, and if they can't then I'm sorry but that's life! It's time to accept it or to rearrange their priorities if possible. (For reference, I get about 30-60 minutes practice before each club race and I do ok, so there's no reason others can't.)

Long story short, the clubs are just for fun and open to all, and that's not going to change anytime soon.

 

[paulbee058]

Silverstone I think I know roughly which way to turn, without the aid of a sat nav, so I'm in please

 

[paulbee058]

In please

 

[FeltHat]

Talented driver should be able to create new challenges for themselves: pick the slowest car, put more fuel in the tank, wrong tires, make the setup hard, simulate some condition or problem etc..

you want hard working people to artificially slow down themselves, but you cannot be bothered to practice little longer or pick car and setup thats suits you?

"talented"(sounds like excuse for slower pace any lack of will to improve it) drivers dont need additional challenge- they race each other

There's no point in locking setup, most drivers will share their setup if you ask about it (or even without asking )

 

[Case_]

But every time I joined a race in the last few months I ended up in no man's land, because the serious guys were much faster obviously and others were just a touch too slow.

This is a major reason why I'm far less active in Raceroom as well lately, even though I wouldn't exactly call the people I used to be able to race "the serious guys", I would just call them "faster".

 

[UMC 22]

Interesting. People aren't as fast others, so they stop taking part. I'm not entirely sure how that is ever going to even things up, to be honest.

 

[Case_]

Well, they might also stop taking part due to comments like this one, to be honest. Because if what you took away from it was "people are not as fast as others, so they stop taking part", then I don't think you understand the actual reasons for them "stopping taking part", you're just kind of saying they're (well, we're) quitters who give up for no real reason.

BTW, here's the rest of what I originally posted above. I edited it out, because I didn't want to sound like a whiner (and annoy everyone with yet another of my lengthy posts that probably didn't need to be posted in the first place), but maybe I shouldn't have, as it might (or might not...) help to explain things a bit better (because I really don't think it's that hard to understand, nor it is as simple as to just shrug it off with "well they are not as fast, so they don't join". So just append this to my previous comment:

But the simple matter of the fact is that whether I am slower than I was or the people I used to be able to have a race with have become faster, way too many of my Raceroom races lately consist of me watching the front pack disappear into the distance with each lap, and if there happen to be cars behind me, they are in turn either just a touch too slow for me, as you said (or simply make more mistakes), so I pull away from them as well, or they are just fast guys that got caught up in the back and quickly catch up and disappear into the distance as well (and if I'm lucky, I even manage to not crash myself as they pass by).

It can get a bit frustrating if your races are regularly like that, because there's always that tiny voice in your head that keeps telling you "come on, what are you even doing here, you could spend your time doing something better than this" (especially if you have ten other things you might rather be doing as I tend to). Because while I certainly enjoy the company and the TS banter (which are the major reason why i *do* join the races), the racing...not so much. And then all it may take is one stupid mistake and you just can't continue anymore, no matter how hard you try to convince yourself to go on (and I would still like to think that I do not give up *that* easily). Especially if there are factors involved outside of the race (as in physically around you). And that obviously happens to others as well, so a lot of time, I see people around me disappear from the race and the "no man's land" grow larger. (I'm not trying to guilt-trip anyone about giving up, BTW, I really want to stress that out - see above, I absolutely get it. And for the record, yesterday's race for me was more of the "factors outside of the race" kind of thing, I certainly could've had a race there if I kept at it.)

Meanwhile I am still quite slow in rF2, but I lately tend to have races that are way more fun there, because there seems to either be more people close to my pace, or there are generally more people, so getting stuck in said "no man's land" is nearly not as frequent for me there, and the Thursday races (that make me miss Raceroom events) also often feature really interesting and fun combos, thanks to various mods. And I don't mean to say I'm bored of Raceroom content, but when you get to choose between a race where just by looking at the list of people involved you know you will quite probably just spend the whole race lapping on your own and watching your gap grow larger with each lap (pretty much the case with yesterday's race and with many other races), and a race with a unique car and track combination you are likely to have fun with even if you might still be slow, the choice can be quite easy, really. Sundays are easier, because there's no alternative, so I usually sign up just to add one more car to the diminishing grid (and, again, obviously to have fun on TS, that goes without saying), even if I fully expect to mostly spend the race on my own.

(BTW please note that I'm absolutely not complaining about being slow, even though I usually feel like that's exactly what I'm doing and that everyone must be absolutely fed up with it, especially since I think I can still be reasonably fast or at least consistent at times, so I really don't have much to complain about. I'm absolutely content with being slow, as long as it is still fun.)

 

[RasmusP]

It's about having the "virtual" company (ts, chat etc) and the "physical" company (seeing others on track) for me. And it's okay if some races/events only consist of one of these parts but it's hugely preferred by me to have both.
Getting stuck on no man's land is okay as long as you have a challenge there. Like seeing the field behind you slowly catching up so while you're lapping on your own you're pressured to keep your pace.
But if the gap in front increases no matter how much you beat your pb and/or the gap behind increases although you screw up every second lap then it's pretty lonely.

One point every casual club racer needs to get right in their heads though is that the position doesn't matter at all if you decide that for yourself. I still didn't win a single race yet. That's probably because I happen to always race the same races where the aliens sign up for too

But a few times now I just couldn't practice at all so I enjoyed doing insecure laps and little love tabs with a few back markers and it was fun.

Summary: I think it's not about being slow or fast or whatever. It's only about not ending up in said no man's land. It's difficult though since more people end up there the lower the signup numbers become and vice versa.
But should I take part in races when I 99% sure will end up alone just to hope that I motivate others to join in with me again?

I sadly have no general idea how to "flush in enough people to ignite the chain reaction" but I do feel that it's exactly what's needed.

Sorry for stumbling in here. I just configured raceroom again and lurk a little before signing up in the next weeks

 

[Case_]

Summary: I think it's not about being slow or fast or whatever. It's only about not ending up in said no man's land. It's difficult though since more people end up there the lower the signup numbers become and vice versa.
But should I take part in races when I 99% sure will end up alone just to hope that I motivate others to join in with me again?

Exactly what I tried to say, and in much less words And yes, it can absolutely turn into a downward spiral where the "no man's land" happens more and more often as less people sign up, and that in turn makes even less people sign up (or at least make them more reluctant to do so) because they're simply not having enough fun to justify the time investment. It's a complicated issue.

Also it should probably be worth pointing out I really don't know what the solution is (except to try and fight it by repeatedly signing up again as much as one is able to), nor am I pointing fingers at anyone, and certainly not at staff for, I don't know, running the club wrong or anything. Absolutely not. It's just something that tends to happen.

 

[DND]

Perhaps a special Sunday event once or twice a year where an open invite to all regardless of membership. Maybe get some new members once they see how cool we are.

 

[Piotr Dul]

From my point of you I don't have a problem being slower, driving somewhere closer to the back of the pack as long as I'm close to others or at least close to one car. But because our grids becomes smaller and smaller so the problem of driving alone becomes bigger.
I love RD club, the atmosphere is great, I had so much fun many times and learned a lot when it comes to sim driving/racing due to friendly and helpful people. And I was extremely SLOW. When I joined RD I was so slow that everyone on the grid was overtaking me with top drivers several times a race. Even static, track side object used to be faster then me But I improved a lot due to RD.
I always recommend RD to newcomers because it's great place to start and to stay of course but seeing diminishing grids is so depressing

 

[Calvyn White]

In please.

 

[Piotr Dul]

I'm not sure about tonight yet. I might need to do long distance deliveries today from work and I'm not sure what time will finish. Will let know later today but I hope I can make it.