FSR 2013 - Rfactor 2 or Assetto Corsa?
- Thread starter Mo Selvarajah
- Start date
Hahahaha
Just did a good 30mins of driving in rf2 formula masters. Oh god i hope we're using rf2 next year instead of rf. 
The p
The main problem for me is that rF2 isn't finished and rF1 might get updates such as weather plug in and new cars next year, we will see..Just did a good 30mins of driving in rf2 formula masters. Oh god i hope we're using rf2 next year instead of rf.
Even if its still on beta its already better then rf. Rf wont get any updates anymore, its just a weather plugin thats a possibility. Im sure that by the time FSR season would start rf2 is already much better then what it is now, atleast its getting constantly updated.
rf2 is good, i think there is still much to improve, but there is still much time until the new season begins.
Mo Selvarajah
aliensimracer
Just did a good 30mins of driving in rf2 formula masters. Oh god i hope we're using rf2 next year instead of rf.
why, its absolutely awful.
same physics as rf1.
Zero ffb feel, its basically rf1 with realfeel plugin (zero ffb weight transfer feel)
still got the same low speed grip issues as rf1.
Breaks all logitech g25/g27's.
Graphics, menu interface, all below standard.
i'd rather use rf1 next year and go straight to AC for 2014.
you have to drive rf2 even more with visuals than rf1!
I dont know which rf2 u have been playing but ffb in it is great and yes i have g27. Graphics wise its still not in its potential since its in beta. In the end i couldnt give two shits about graphics as long as the driving is good and fun. I cant say anything about asetto corsa because i havent played it.
Its very funny to see that graphics are so importent for much people.
If i play simulators i am looking more for the driving feel and physics etc. and not for the graphics.
At the point with your fbb issue i just can agree with Ville, i have a G27 too and all works fine for me and as Ville said, rf2 is still beta ...
If i play simulators i am looking more for the driving feel and physics etc. and not for the graphics.
At the point with your fbb issue i just can agree with Ville, i have a G27 too and all works fine for me and as Ville said, rf2 is still beta ...
rf2 is awesome already. Some small annoying stuff like crazy rattling steering wheel but maybe they'll fix it. Just try that F2 mod. It's just so much fun to drive it online. It's even fun to drive it alone. Which I normally find to be boring.
Mikko Suokas
Mikko Suokas
Just increase ffb smoothing and it should help with the rattling on g25/27.
I personally don't like at all any modern open wheeler from rF2, the Clio or the Megane are much better, in comparison, even the old F1s or the Skip Barber (from the Dev Mode).
use GSC, their oficial F1 car, somehow put the tracks needed, is always rfactor, i dont know how it work is straight forward but shouldn't be hard, and it has nice stuff, bit better shaders and stuff, Niels physics are great, no need to work on those ones, and thats it... rF2 clearly wont be ready, AC is not even out, Project Cars for now is not even a simulator, and iRacing is out of question obviously, so.. Either GSC or rFactor again... and maybe if rFactor, see if is possible to use the weather plugin.
GSC might a bit of a hassle becuase like you said putting the tracks might be a bit tricky and its the cars that might chosen for the 2013 season as the FR cars are based on the f1 cars from 2011 and we be staying with 2009 or go to 2012, so i would recommend staying with rfactor 1
Mo Selvarajah
aliensimracer
This is for the people who think RF2 is remotely good physics/handling wise (regarding specifically the F1 car and the F2 car, but all the cars are affected to a lesser extent - and i agree with Dominguez that the 60's F1 car is actually driveable in Rf2, probably the only car that has any depth to it)
This is an extract from the Project CARS forum, and its Ben Collins (i.e. original Stig off Top Gear) giving his input to the PCARS development team. This was posted by Ian Bell, the head of the studio.
It describes almost 100% PERFECTLY my problems with Rfactor 2, Rfactor 1, almost all simracing games (apart from Kunos physics, which even though it still has a degree of issues, it at least allows you to drive it like a real car).
Handling – I am struggling with the lack of forgiveness in the slip angles of the tyre model. On entry to corners the understeer is quite severe, followed often by equally severe oversteer. The longitudinal slip angles for braking have more forgiveness and I wondered if there was a way to engineer in some more horizontal slip to allow you to apply the throttle and feel the rear tyres break traction more gradually. If we could perfect the ability of the car to hold a drift and to modulate the throttle accordingly it would be fantastic. This is generally the aspect of driving sims that I find the most challenging and it’s difficult to explain in print what I mean.
In real life we are hammering every kerb in sight at Imola! Even at the very slow chicane (Variante Alta) we smash them in an LMP. The LMP1 cars even more so than LMP2 - it's unreal and you see the wheels coming off the ground.
Because this is the less loaded wheel it doesn't destabilise the platform too much and allows you to carry more speed by cutting the corner, and it effectively forces more weight onto the driving wheel (ie in a left hander onto the rear right). It is a rough ride, and snappy, but the grip is there.
Oddly enough on the Formula One simulator we used this year, the Sim reacted very quickly to the bumps and had the balance twitching between understeer / oversteer several times per second - which is how the car should feel on the limit in a smooth corner. I realise that sounds bizarre
Obvious Points:
1. The cars fly around too much when they crash – temporary glitch?
2. When the cars make contact with eachother the reaction is over the top, you can get away with quite a lot more.
3. Le Mans racing is a rolling (not standing) start
4. Bathurst – great track flow but the surroundings I assume are still being built? It looks like the gobi desert when there should be trees / grandstands etc.
5. AI – is it me or do the AI drivers all have a death wish? They are wild man.
Handling
Please excuse my lack of understanding for the programming here but..
The rear tyres lose too much grip when the rear breaks away into yaw – the friction level of a tyre doesn’t drop off nearly as sharply in real life which is why we are able to hold these cars on a slip angle, or slightly sideways on corner entry. You should be able to lose it, and hold the slide with the slide acting almost like a brake when you shut off the throttle – which it effectively is as the friction scrubs speed.
Friction graph below – the sim is behaving like the theoretical tyre, rather than lines A and B which more reflect reality. Did the graph come through??
That is my biggest feeling and really the most crucial one in terms of reality. The car should be floating and drifting all the time.
Watching your footage I can see where you gain time on me is corner entry by maxing entry speed until AFTER the apex almost, then turning and blatting the throttle so the sim doesn’t recognize the combined effects of rolling speed and acceleration, or rather, the level of understeer you are taking in. But it wouldn’t work that way in real life.
I’ve tried lowering front ride height, adding front wing which gave a better front end and better stopping power on the LMP. But as for traction it is still very much all or nothing. Can this be improved or is it a permanent problem with the functionality of the program? I don’t want to become a bore on this point.
Braking
The braking power and feel of the LMP is really good. At the end of the braking area when the downforce comes off the sim correctly identifies this and starts to lock wheels a touch and it’s very good. If there could be slightly faster release from locking as you modulate the pedal it would be mega.
Also I really like the sense of weight transfer as you hit the brakes – this give you a really true sense of what is going on dynamically and makes me feel at home. It’s very, very realistic, especially as you cross over bumps. Added benefit is a better look at the track ahead too.
Where braking suffers is when you combine braking with any steering. This seems to really overload the front tyres. I tried using more rear brake and you can imagine what happened. I booked my virtual self into A&E.
The tyre should bleed off turn in power / retardation power more gradually. The beauty of the traction circle of a tyre is that you can combine braking and turning forces to exceed the static friction coefficient of the tyre – ie you can have the best of both worlds. With the Sim I have to brake in a straight line only, then get off the brakes early to carry in speed rather than trail brake in.
This is gold. Its exactly what I've been saying on the Rf2 forums, and people just dont seem to get it or understand it (possibly because its the ISI forums which will be full of fanboys, but still).
And of course, because i'm not a professional racing driver, my input was dismissed from the start. But I finally have some backup in the form of Ben Collins lol.
i know that hes talking about project cars, but what he describes is 100% the problem with rfactor. Its probably even worse with rfactor physics.
You'll find that in all the best mods in rfactor, and Game Stock Car, the programmers have done their best to limit the fundamental and inherent flaws in the ISI engine, by trying to make the cars a bit easier to control in a slide and on the limit, to try and hold the cars in some kind of balance. Ultimately though its still not good enough.
From what I've experienced with Netkar pro, and from the way Kunos approaches tyre modelling, AC sounds like a real Win.
Netkar pro has been the only simgame i've played which allows you to balance a car round a corner on the edge of grip, using all inputs + allowing you to go over the limit whilst still being in control, just like you can in real life.
We've got to consider GSC next year, or stick with Rf1. RF2 is atrocious on every level, and should be boycotted.
This is an extract from the Project CARS forum, and its Ben Collins (i.e. original Stig off Top Gear) giving his input to the PCARS development team. This was posted by Ian Bell, the head of the studio.
It describes almost 100% PERFECTLY my problems with Rfactor 2, Rfactor 1, almost all simracing games (apart from Kunos physics, which even though it still has a degree of issues, it at least allows you to drive it like a real car).
Handling – I am struggling with the lack of forgiveness in the slip angles of the tyre model. On entry to corners the understeer is quite severe, followed often by equally severe oversteer. The longitudinal slip angles for braking have more forgiveness and I wondered if there was a way to engineer in some more horizontal slip to allow you to apply the throttle and feel the rear tyres break traction more gradually. If we could perfect the ability of the car to hold a drift and to modulate the throttle accordingly it would be fantastic. This is generally the aspect of driving sims that I find the most challenging and it’s difficult to explain in print what I mean.
In real life we are hammering every kerb in sight at Imola! Even at the very slow chicane (Variante Alta) we smash them in an LMP. The LMP1 cars even more so than LMP2 - it's unreal and you see the wheels coming off the ground.
Because this is the less loaded wheel it doesn't destabilise the platform too much and allows you to carry more speed by cutting the corner, and it effectively forces more weight onto the driving wheel (ie in a left hander onto the rear right). It is a rough ride, and snappy, but the grip is there.
Oddly enough on the Formula One simulator we used this year, the Sim reacted very quickly to the bumps and had the balance twitching between understeer / oversteer several times per second - which is how the car should feel on the limit in a smooth corner. I realise that sounds bizarre
Obvious Points:
1. The cars fly around too much when they crash – temporary glitch?
2. When the cars make contact with eachother the reaction is over the top, you can get away with quite a lot more.
3. Le Mans racing is a rolling (not standing) start
4. Bathurst – great track flow but the surroundings I assume are still being built? It looks like the gobi desert when there should be trees / grandstands etc.
5. AI – is it me or do the AI drivers all have a death wish? They are wild man.
Handling
Please excuse my lack of understanding for the programming here but..
The rear tyres lose too much grip when the rear breaks away into yaw – the friction level of a tyre doesn’t drop off nearly as sharply in real life which is why we are able to hold these cars on a slip angle, or slightly sideways on corner entry. You should be able to lose it, and hold the slide with the slide acting almost like a brake when you shut off the throttle – which it effectively is as the friction scrubs speed.
Friction graph below – the sim is behaving like the theoretical tyre, rather than lines A and B which more reflect reality. Did the graph come through??
That is my biggest feeling and really the most crucial one in terms of reality. The car should be floating and drifting all the time.
Watching your footage I can see where you gain time on me is corner entry by maxing entry speed until AFTER the apex almost, then turning and blatting the throttle so the sim doesn’t recognize the combined effects of rolling speed and acceleration, or rather, the level of understeer you are taking in. But it wouldn’t work that way in real life.
I’ve tried lowering front ride height, adding front wing which gave a better front end and better stopping power on the LMP. But as for traction it is still very much all or nothing. Can this be improved or is it a permanent problem with the functionality of the program? I don’t want to become a bore on this point.
Braking
The braking power and feel of the LMP is really good. At the end of the braking area when the downforce comes off the sim correctly identifies this and starts to lock wheels a touch and it’s very good. If there could be slightly faster release from locking as you modulate the pedal it would be mega.
Also I really like the sense of weight transfer as you hit the brakes – this give you a really true sense of what is going on dynamically and makes me feel at home. It’s very, very realistic, especially as you cross over bumps. Added benefit is a better look at the track ahead too.
Where braking suffers is when you combine braking with any steering. This seems to really overload the front tyres. I tried using more rear brake and you can imagine what happened. I booked my virtual self into A&E.
The tyre should bleed off turn in power / retardation power more gradually. The beauty of the traction circle of a tyre is that you can combine braking and turning forces to exceed the static friction coefficient of the tyre – ie you can have the best of both worlds. With the Sim I have to brake in a straight line only, then get off the brakes early to carry in speed rather than trail brake in.
This is gold. Its exactly what I've been saying on the Rf2 forums, and people just dont seem to get it or understand it (possibly because its the ISI forums which will be full of fanboys, but still).
And of course, because i'm not a professional racing driver, my input was dismissed from the start. But I finally have some backup in the form of Ben Collins lol.
i know that hes talking about project cars, but what he describes is 100% the problem with rfactor. Its probably even worse with rfactor physics.
You'll find that in all the best mods in rfactor, and Game Stock Car, the programmers have done their best to limit the fundamental and inherent flaws in the ISI engine, by trying to make the cars a bit easier to control in a slide and on the limit, to try and hold the cars in some kind of balance. Ultimately though its still not good enough.
From what I've experienced with Netkar pro, and from the way Kunos approaches tyre modelling, AC sounds like a real Win.
Netkar pro has been the only simgame i've played which allows you to balance a car round a corner on the edge of grip, using all inputs + allowing you to go over the limit whilst still being in control, just like you can in real life.
We've got to consider GSC next year, or stick with Rf1. RF2 is atrocious on every level, and should be boycotted.
No rF2 please. It's not a proper sim simply because G27 support is non-existent.
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