PC1 False advertising

[Björn Spindel]

I've seen many evangelists and perhaps even the developers themselves refer to Project C.A.R.S. as a "sim" or "simulator". Normally this term is used to describe software that tries to mimic reality. There is nothing wrong with arcade racers so why not just call the game by its real name and stop trying to advertise it as something it's not? There's no shame in admitting that Project C.A.R.S. doesn't try to be realistic. There's a big market for this type of game, even bigger so than for the niche sims, so please stop trying to fool people and aim for your target audience instead.

 

[Mapu]

It's a matter of blurring the lines between the one and the other genre. Best example? Adding a "hardcore" mode to a game pretending it is the ultimate sim experience beside the other "less sophisticated" game modes. This hardcore mode has become so popular it is even used among sim racing games and some passionate sim racers, what is a shame because a sim racing games goal should be simulating real environments. There's nothing hardcore to it.

 

[Stefan Mizzi]

I've seen many evangelists and perhaps even the developers themselves refer to Project C.A.R.S. as a "sim" or "simulator". Normally this term is used to describe software that tries to mimic reality. There is nothing wrong with arcade racers so why not just call the game by its real name and stop trying to advertise it as something it's not? There's no shame in admitting that Project C.A.R.S. doesn't try to be realistic. There's a big market for this type of game, even bigger so than for the niche sims, so please stop trying to fool people and aim for your target audience instead.

I'm not sure if you are a WMD member, but if you are, you can follow the discussions and it's very obvious that they are working hard to make the physics as realistic as possible, that is making pCARS a proper sim.

Yes, it's not a complete sim yet, but it's a sim in progress and you can only judge when it's ready. If when ready it won't be a sim, then your post would be true, but at this stage it does not hold.

Cheers

 

[Nathan Robinson]

I've seen many evangelists and perhaps even the developers themselves refer to Project C.A.R.S. as a "sim" or "simulator". Normally this term is used to describe software that tries to mimic reality. There is nothing wrong with arcade racers so why not just call the game by its real name and stop trying to advertise it as something it's not? There's no shame in admitting that Project C.A.R.S. doesn't try to be realistic. There's a big market for this type of game, even bigger so than for the niche sims, so please stop trying to fool people and aim for your target audience instead.

You are stretching a bit here. Of course its trying to be realistic, they are even working on a new tire model. It may have some arcade elements right now but its not like its grid or anything.

 

[Tom]

Yes, it's not a complete sim yet, but it's a sim in progress and you can only judge when it's ready. If when ready it won't be a sim, then your post would be true, but at this stage it does not hold.

This. Most people can happily live with either type of game - we're not forced to play one game and one game only, after all.

 

[Alejandro Riveiro]

I've seen many evangelists and perhaps even the developers themselves refer to Project C.A.R.S. as a "sim" or "simulator". Normally this term is used to describe software that tries to mimic reality. There is nothing wrong with arcade racers so why not just call the game by its real name and stop trying to advertise it as something it's not? There's no shame in admitting that Project C.A.R.S. doesn't try to be realistic. There's a big market for this type of game, even bigger so than for the niche sims, so please stop trying to fool people and aim for your target audience instead.

I'm SO thankful, and SO glad you have decided to bestow upon us all your factual, uncontestable opinion. I'm SO thankful we have people like you, willing to show others the wrong of their ways.

I'm SO happy at your post that I may literally explode in joy. Not.

No, seriously, get real, Arcade racing died in 199... Any game that tries to simulate driving physics, reality, and all those things is a simulator. How close to reality? That's up for everyone to decide. Everytime someone on the internet posts screaming ARCADE! at a game that is not God drives over a kitten. (hint: Trackmania is arcade, Most of the Need for Speed series centered around police chases are arcade)

 

[Xosé Estrada]

I think discussions with PCARS are about if it is "simcade" like GT5 or Forza, or more sim like GTR2, rFactor, etc

I have high hopes for the console market regarding PCARS. What if ends up being the most similar you can make to a sim in a console, more than GT5, that would be awesome even if it would not be considered a full sim. That will discover the simracer inside many gamers, and then we will be more, and the companies will find easier to sell full Sims.


P.S.- I really love you guys with thread titles, have to be all of them on the limit?

 

[BigSilverHotdog]

P.S.- I really love you guys with thread titles, have to be all of them on the limit?

Hahah, when I saw the other thread "pCARS developers suing gamers" that was my first thought as well.

 

[Nathan Robinson]

I think discussions with PCARS are about if it is "simcade" like GT5 or Forza, or more sim like GTR2, rFactor, etc

I have high hopes for the console market regarding PCARS. What if ends up being the most similar you can make to a sim in a console, more than GT5, that would be awesome even if it would not be considered a full sim. That will discover the simracer inside many gamers, and then we will be more, and the companies will find easier to sell full Sims.


P.S.- I really love you guys with thread titles, have to be all of them on the limit?

Lol at title comment. I used to only run console games. I played the hell out of the first burnout on my xbox and loved the multiplayer action. Then i downloaded a forza 2 demo and was amazed at the realness of it all. With real tracks and cars, i would spend the next few months competing onlinea great assortment of cars. I got tired of the wreckers so i sought out some kind of gentlemans forza2 league and got signed up. Just before the start of this league i got the red ring of death, forcing me to shitcan my 360 and my league racing hopes. After feeling empty in late 08, i decided to try and find a realistic game for my PC. A trip to gamestop and i was on my way home with a box copy of gtr evolution. Who knew the world i was about to open up. After a month of racing with a keyboard i decided i needed a wheel. I searched the web and found a logitech g25, man did this thing look cool. I told my wife if she bought me this wheel id buy her an engagement ring and it worked, a month later i had a shiny new g25. In the box came an rfactor demo which i fell in love with. Then i set about finding a league and havent looked back. Now i have a full 3 screen setup with fanatec hardware and its all because of a simcade called forza 2

 

[Kazumi]

I think discussions with PCARS are about if it is "simcade" like GT5 or Forza, or more sim like GTR2, rFactor, etc

What happened to the term semi-sim? IMHO GT and Forza (as Shift, Race Driver, maybe others) does a few things like offline career which should be in all sims (if they focus on offline content as well) . Simply because that simulates part of what a real race driver does. So while they do simulate something the focus isn't solely on vehicle handling. "pure" sim on the other hand can be a boring driving simulator with just one car and an empty holodeck environment.

Arcade always makes me think of something as the good old Daytona USA which is fun but for me it's no "real" racing / driving game. It even works that good with wheel that the console ports don't play as good with pads.

I agree a racing game like Forza / GT - considering it's multiplatform - is an honourable goal and I think the hardcore PC racers would accept that (the goal, maybe not the game) if it's communicated sufficiently

I've seen many evangelists and perhaps even the developers themselves refer to Project C.A.R.S. as a "sim" or "simulator". Normally this term is used to describe software that tries to mimic reality. There is nothing wrong with arcade racers so why not just call the game by its real name and stop trying to advertise it as something it's not? There's no shame in admitting that Project C.A.R.S. doesn't try to be realistic. There's a big market for this type of game, even bigger so than for the niche sims, so please stop trying to fool people and aim for your target audience instead.

I can't answer the questions. According to one of the SMS people, Ian Bell, their aim really is that high though. IMHO that is communicable. At the same time they want to attact more people which might make compromises and/or sacrifices inevitable.

 

[BigSilverHotdog]

Lol at title comment. I used to only run console games. I played the hell out of the first burnout on my xbox and loved the multiplayer action. Then i downloaded a forza 2 demo and was amazed at the realness of it all. With real tracks and cars, i would spend the next few months competing onlinea great assortment of cars. I got tired of the wreckers so i sought out some kind of gentlemans forza2 league and got signed up. Just before the start of this league i got the red ring of death, forcing me to shitcan my 360 and my league racing hopes. After feeling empty in late 08, i decided to try and find a realistic game for my PC. A trip to gamestop and i was on my way home with a box copy of gtr evolution. Who knew the world i was about to open up. After a month of racing with a keyboard i decided i needed a wheel. I searched the web and found a logitech g25, man did this thing look cool. I told my wife if she bought me this wheel id buy her an engagement ring and it worked, a month later i had a shiny new g25. In the box came an rfactor demo which i fell in love with. Then i set about finding a league and havent looked back. Now i have a full 3 screen setup with fanatec hardware and its all because of a simcade called forza 2

I didn't start on Forza 2 but I sure had some fun times with it. Just because it isn't a hardcore sim doesn't mean it can't be fun. I spent so much time making custom cars and doing endurance races with my 360 Wireless Racing Wheel... still got two of them in storage, apparently they're getting rare.

Do I play Forza-type games today? Of course not. Why should I when I've got hardcore sims? I don't want halfway if I can have all the way. But that's just me, and apparently I'm a niche audience.

 

[Christopher Vrettos]

I don't mind too much if it is a full sim or "just" a simcade. What we have needed for years is a game similar to GT5 and Forza on the PC. I see pCars as being PC's best bet.

 

[Peter]

I don't mind too much if it is a full sim or "just" a simcade. What we have needed for years is a game similar to GT5 and Forza on the PC. I see pCars as being PC's best bet.

I don't know Forza or GT5, the first one was nfs underground 4 years ago.

 

[David Wright]

A wise man recently said "If the community stops the religion wars of “my sim is better than yours” and embraces the small number of simulations that exist in the market, then the same market will grow and become healthier."

Now if you believe your sim of choice is the best (and indeed it might be) and another sim developer says their aim is to make a sim which is as good if not better than your sim, then you are quite possibly going to feel threatened. And what does an element of the sim-racing communty do when they feel a sim might be threatening "their" sim. They accuse it of being arcade.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

A wise man recently said "If the community stops the religion wars of “my sim is better than yours” and embraces the small number of simulations that exist in the market, then the same market will grow and become healthier."
.

Better to have less sim makers but bigger sims IMO.
It'll be interesting to see what next gen consoles bring wrt racing games, as with their extra performance, we might see more realism, but then again, we might just see 1000 cockpits at launch.

 

[t.o.]

Funny how Forza gets the title of "simcade" when it's the only game I know right now where you can damage your gear box with bad shifting. You know, like what happens in real life, and I should know. Unless I'm missing something in the rFactors, Race 07s etc. none of them punish you for that.

Back to topic I tried this game yesterday for the first time and I think pCars has a load of potential. I plan to make my voice heard to make sure the game turns out as a game for all. There's no reason why the ultra hardcore sim player and the casual guy can't live side by side in this game, yet in their own reality. It's a very visually appealing game and I would love to have it in our groups rotation. Just hoping the finished product can make it across the finish line. Just add a level above PRO like "Kiss your moms for the last time" ultra-sim mode and it's a winner.

I feel like the game is riiiight there. Just so close and to be honest it'll be an enjoyable title as-is. Eager to see how this thing develops from this point on.

 

[Senad Subasic]

Funny how Forza gets the title of "simcade" when it's the only game I know right now where you can damage your gear box with bad shifting. You know, like what happens in real life, and I should know. Unless I'm missing something in the rFactors, Race 07s etc. none of them punish you for that.

Richard Burns Rally.

 

[t.o.]

Richard Burns Rally.

Never played that game as I'm not too big into rally action. So that makes two.

 

[BigSilverHotdog]

Of course you can damage with bad shifting in rFactor. You can even add Grinding Tranny if you truly want some pain, a turn of phrase I'm too tired to even make a joke about.

 

[t.o.]

Of course you can damage with bad shifting in rFactor. You can even add Grinding Tranny if you truly want some pain, a turn of phrase I'm too tired to even make a joke about.

I never was able to damage transmission in rFactor. I'll check again but it would just shift regardless for me.