PC1 Empty Box not longer covering a game

[David Ignjatovic]

edit: videos go here http://www.racedepartment.com/media/

No more pcars video's from Empty.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

Imagine if you went up to Louis Hamilton and told him you could beat him, do you think he would be impressed when you told him it was in a video game?

I really think you people need to get out more.

MOD-Edit: Mutual respect between the people using the RaceDepartment.com website(s) and forums. Malicious behavior and bullying will not be tolerated.

 

[CCL71]

@HypoToad I hear what you're saying man but I think you might be taking it too literal. Yes, I'm sure there is some kid out there who thinks he's a driving God because he's fast in a video game but I think the rest of us reasonably intelligent people accept that we are simulating the act of driving, not driving a vehicle itself. But with that being the case, I strongly believe that there are lessons to be learned from sim racing, i.e., braking points, threshold braking, turn in, hitting your apexes and track out. Most people who participate in novice level track days don't know those terms, let alone how to negotiate them correctly. If given the choice of being on track with a person who has never driven a real car or a sim on track vs one who has some experience in Iracing, I'd jump in the car with the Iracing person.

I also believe that some credit should be given to developers who take actual data from manufacturers and attempt to create a virtual replica of the real car in an attempt to duplicate the cars' behavior in certain situations. For me, that is the main difference between a sub par racing game and one that is above average. I suppose any game developer can create an image that will turn, stop and go. But having one that does it in a manner based on factual data and a sound physics engine is what sets one apart from the other.

To someone's point earlier about pilot simulators....keep in mind that those simulators are still stationary; they aren't flying across country. The purpose of any simulator is simply to familiarize the user with the machinery to better help them manipulate it in real world scenario's. But to your point, nothing replaces the real thing.

Yours Truly,
A Guy Who Gets Out.

 

[DayGlow]

HypoToad I think you area hitting the nail on the head. For some reason some people are so wrapped up in their identity based on their playing games they need and want to define themselves and showing they are superior to others based on the games they play.

Is not enough to think it, they need others to acknowledge it. Their self worth is tied up in it and somehow by playing a 'true sim' in their minds separate them.

I saw this in the flightsim world in the 90's. The online wars between Airwarrior vs Warbirds was down right nasty. Then you had the lesser 'sim light' players that flew 1942 or Il-2 were laughed at.

In the end is grown people playing video games and is not worth hanging your self identity up in it.

 

[Andy_J]

I saw this in the flightsim world in the 90's. The online wars between Airwarrior vs Warbirds was down right nasty.

Jesus H. Neither of those two are or were classed as serious flight sims in the flight sim communities that I used to (and still do) frequent.

 

[DayGlow]

lol, sure thing. Constant bickering on Usenet back and forth between the 2. Agreed there were people like you that disagree if they were 'serious' or not.

Kinda familiar.

 

[Andy_J]

Kinda familiar.

Glad you think so. I bet your a Pcars fan too?
There are similar comparisons I suppose.

 

[DayGlow]

I enjoy pCars. Also enjoy AC and RRE. Each have their strengths and weaknesses. No single sim nailed it. Haven't tried RF2 or GSCE yet as I can't buy every game out there.

I don't get hung up on if it's the most realistic experience ever. No sim is. Driving is very grounded in the feel of motion. No amount of FFB makes up for the seat of the pants feeling, so I find all sims lacking.

I enjoy the SP of pCars, minus the occasional wonky AI dive bombing the corners. My friends play AC so I use it for MP. I find the SP very stale. Just getting into RRE and I have to say the audio is so far ahead of any other game.

As far as physics, no sim has any real feel. For the most part the cars in all 3 react the way I expect them to act for the most part.

I enjoy it so I play it. I don't get hung up on labelling the game or the people driving them.

As for the 90s flight sims I have no opinion add I was a starving student at the time and my rig could only run SWOTL. Just followed the Usenet at the time and dreamed of having a Pentium 60 that could run them.

 

[James Robertson]

A wee comment on physics realism. I met Gordon Shedden (this years British Touring Car Champion) back in September as he was on a stand at The Offshore Europe exhibition in Aberdeen. I asked him how driving a real touring car compared to sim racing and he said that the major problem with all sims he has played was that none of them give you any feedback at all about what the rear of the car is doing.

 

[CCL71]

The 2 area's I struggle with the most with in all driving games are, sense of speed and handling. Unless I'm driving an open wheeled car, most cars feel slow to me. So that means that I don't slow down enough for turns or don't adjust my speed for grip. The speed doesn't register until I look at the replay and see how fast I was going. Today, I was playing with the Ruf rt12-awd in A/C and was having a hard time with my braking points. The car seems as fast as a GT3 car but of course with street tires and brakes, things are going to be a lot different. Driving GT3 cars all the time has made me reliant on sticky tires and downforce.
As for rear movement or just understanding the car in general, for me, every game is different. In PCars, I can't feel anything from the front tires but thanks to the tweaker files, I can manage because of the feedback I get from the rear. PCars still feels numb to me though, like I'm driving on butter. In Iracing, most times I"m just lost. I have no idea the rear is stepping out until it's gone, especially in the GT3 cars. rF2, A/C and RaceRoom seem to be the most communicative on my wheel. When the rear is going, I get a tug or lightness in my wheel that lets me know I need to correct. I still crash, but my chances of saving myself are better in those games.
Short of having a full motion rig, I don't know how you can really mimic a seat of the pants experience sitting in a stationary chair at home. The best I can hope for is some communication in my wheel that aligns with what I see on my screen to help assist in keeping the car on track. For me, some games do that better than others.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

he said that the major problem with all sims he has played was that none of them give you any feedback at all about what the rear of the car is doing.

Maybe so, but as you know, you can still snap save slides, so it's not like once the ass goes it's a 100% spin{like it was to some degree in GTR 2005}...

 

[xnorb]

the major problem with all sims he has played was that none of them give you any feedback at all about what the rear of the car is doing.

Aren't all sims basically just modeling the front tires in their FFB?

But ya, as the most important informations are missing from the simulation (the feel of the car) it's laughable talking about realism in simracing.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

""As part of the WMD I had the privilege to see the game's development. The SMS and the WMD did their best, I can assure this.""

Funny comment from VirtualR...Pcars advertising depot.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

Aren't all sims basically just modeling the front tires in their FFB?

But ya, as the most important informations are missing from the simulation (the feel of the car) it's laughable talking about realism in simracing.

So you can't tell the diff between a very detailed sim car like RACE07's F3000 and any random arcadey car in Dirt3 for example?
Do you drive cars/know anything about them?

 

[xnorb]

So you can't tell the diff between a very detailed sim car like RACE07's F3000 and any random arcadey car in Dirt3 for example?
Do you drive cars/know anything about them?

I can tell the FFB is different, but i can't tell you if wheel of the SLS GT3 feels the same in AC as it feels in real life and 99.99999% of sim racers can't

 

[DayGlow]

He probably drives cars enough to know that 'detailed FFB' has nothing to do with what you feel through the steering column in real life.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

You guys are making excuses for your simcade games, ignoring the realities of requiring very good racing cars skills vs pedal mashing for simcade jobs.

 

[DayGlow]

Pcars must be your dirty little simcade secret since you post here so much.

Deep down you enjoy the game and it disgusts you.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

No, I'm onto them....

 

[Dyrgl]

I think Empty Box is right and be honest PCars will never be a "sim"

No ****. A game that allows for you to beat the real car by several seconds in the same car is just that, a game.

It´s hard to feel sympathy for them, they insisted they were releasing the ultimate sim and costumers got another average simcade, that on top of that didn´t work until around 3 months past release time.

 

[HypoToad]

No ****. A game that allows for you to beat the real car by several seconds in the same car is just that, a game.

It´s hard to feel sympathy for them, they insisted they were releasing the ultimate sim and costumers got another average simcade, that on top of that didn´t work until around 3 months past release time.

So if they made the cars slower would it help? I know when I got and update for AC all the cars were several seconds slower, sure they handled better, slower around corners means better handling.

And I hate to break it to you there all games. It's horses for courses, you just select the one that you like best, if you don't like one don't play it, it's that simple. If you think one feels more like a real car and that's what your looking for go with that.

You don't believe that Red Bull actually gives you wings, all companies use advertising hype don't they?

"Advanced physics deliver the ultimate realistic driving experience never seen on any other racing simulator" That's what Kunos said about AC.

"creates a dynamic racing environment that for the first time puts you the driver into a racing simulator" That's what Image Space Incorporated said about rF2.

Who's lying?