DTM and Super GT Confirm Two Joint Race Events in 2019.

DTM Super GT Crossover Race.jpg

2019 will see two crossover race events for the DTM and Japanese Super GT series it has been confirmed.

Long expected to be the ultimate goal of both series following the deal to bring together ‘Class One’ regulations for the start of the 2019 season, it has now been confirmed that these two spectacular categories will run two crossover races during the coming season.

Both the German DTM touring car series and the Japanese Super GT category have a number of common regulations governing the build of these spectacular cars (although with minor differences), and the intention was always to eventually open up the door for interested manufacturers to participate in either category. In fact, demonstration events involving both sets of car already having run towards the back end of 2018 over in Japan, with the aim to see the categories perform competitive racing in the near future.

That future is closer than expected so it seems, with confirmation that both series will host cars from each category in a competitive round this year.

The DTM will host one Super GT car each from Honda, Toyota and Nissan at the season closing Hockenheim weekend, while Super GT set to take on select DTM cars at the Fuji Speedway following the end of the traditional DTM season.

"I’m delighted that we’ve taken a major step in regards to the planned joint event of SUPER GT and DTM,” said ITR Chairman Gerhard Berger.​

"This is another milestone in the partnership of both series promoters GTA and ITR. I would like to thank GTA Chairman Masaaki Bandoh as well as the organization of the Fuji Speedway for their work so far. Fuji is a world-famous, modern racetrack – a worthy venue for a spectacle with racecars from SUPER GT and DTM."

GTA boss Masaaki Bandoh added: "The joint race meeting of DTM and SUPER GT finally can be realised. I’d love to thank ITR and its Chairman Gerhard Berger for the good collaboration. Furthermore, I thank the Fuji Speedway officials who were actively involved in the realisation of our plan. I’m really delighted that we are going to jointly organise this event."

No doubt great news for DTM and Super GT fans alike – this could well pave the way to further collaboration between the series and manufacturers in future years.

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Otune

SpeedyMite Racing
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May 11, 2015
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Wonder how much they're going to cripple the GT500s for these. Wonder who's tyre regs they're going to use, too.
It's going to be the Hankook spec tyre from DTM. I suppose that's a bit of a disadvantage for the GT500 teams but I suppose that tyre makes more sense than them all running one of the bespoke SuperGT tyre compounds.
 
Nov 3, 2015
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It's going to be the Hankook spec tyre from DTM. I suppose that's a bit of a disadvantage for the GT500 teams but I suppose that tyre makes more sense than them all running one of the bespoke SuperGT tyre compounds.
Like wearing ill-fitting shoes & trying to run a competitive marathon... on the other hand DTM have tyre warmers, iirc?
 

Otune

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Like wearing ill-fitting shoes & trying to run a competitive marathon... on the other hand DTM have tyre warmers, iirc?
Not sure what the better solution would be though. If they picked Bridgestones for instance, then Michelin or Yokohama runners would still be screwed, along with the DTM cars. They could leave the tyre choice open but then the DTM cars would be really disadvantaged. As much as Iove the tyre war, it wouldn’t be much of a race if the DTM cars were left behind.

I don’t think DTM has tyre warmers, at least not last season. I saw one of the Brands races and cars were squirming around on their first lap out the pits so the pit stops played out quite like GT500 pit stops do which was nice
 
Mar 4, 2016
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Not sure what the better solution would be though. If they picked Bridgestones for instance, then Michelin or Yokohama runners would still be screwed, along with the DTM cars. They could leave the tyre choice open but then the DTM cars would be really disadvantaged. As much as Iove the tyre war, it wouldn’t be much of a race if the DTM cars were left behind.

I don’t think DTM has tyre warmers, at least not last season. I saw one of the Brands races and cars were squirming around on their first lap out the pits so the pit stops played out quite like GT500 pit stops do which was nice
You're correct, DTM didn't have tire warmers last year.
 
Nov 3, 2015
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Not sure what the better solution would be though. If they picked Bridgestones for instance, then Michelin or Yokohama runners would still be screwed, along with the DTM cars. They could leave the tyre choice open but then the DTM cars would be really disadvantaged. As much as Iove the tyre war, it wouldn’t be much of a race if the DTM cars were left behind.
Then they really should just leave the GT500s alone - it's not SuperGT's fault if DTM are holding their own cars back :p anyone who just turns up for the show won't care, and actual DTM fans are going to know the SGT cars have been got at & it's not representative.

If only DTM could combine with a GT series & turn into european SGT...
 

Mitja Bonca

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The first joint event between SuperGT and DTM will happen at Fuji Speedway on 23-24 November. DTM will send 12 cars of all 3 manufacturers to Japan. There'll be 2 races without driver change using DTM's Hankook spec tyre.

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Ahead of Special Battle at Fuji on 23-24 November, the GTA will send tree GT500 cars, one from each manufacturer (Honda, Lexus, Nissan) to the DTM season finale at Hockenheim on October 4-6. All 3 cars will join the double-header weekend as wild card entries.
 
Feb 25, 2019
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I do not like the format subordinate to DTM.
A number of postponements and rules were changed at the convenience of ITR.
The DTM engine was V8 until 2018, and Mercedes has gone away.
One reason is the German diesel gate case.

The collaboration is good, but I am disgusted by Bando, who is trying to get along with German egoism.
Even in a collaboration race, the annoying ITR should follow the GTA.

Even if it's called Galapagos, Honestly, SuperGT was good in its own originality category.
 
Nov 3, 2015
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Both have been moving to shared Class 1 regs. Don't know how that constitutes to "crippling" GT500.
SuperGT uses Class-1 Alpha, not quite the same. Some things GT500 does are not legal in DTM, like the tyre war, mid-placed engines, etc. I'm still not sure if they're going to run the same engine output either, I'd heared somewhere GT500 were getting a bit more but I can't verify that either way.

Didn't we already had something like that at the end of the 90s? And I recall it didn't end well for none of the involved parts...
Performance-wise it'd not really be much different to ELMS, GT500 are roughly LMP2 equivalent. I guess that is a reason not to do it, mind you - unless we can manage another combined prototype/GT series ( ELMS is one of the few places to run a GTE rather than the myriad of GT3 series ). I'm trying to think of an existing GT3 series that has room on the grid!
 

Otune

SpeedyMite Racing
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SuperGT uses Class-1 Alpha, not quite the same. Some things GT500 does are not legal in DTM, like the tyre war, mid-placed engines, etc. I'm still not sure if they're going to run the same engine output either, I'd heared somewhere GT500 were getting a bit more but I can't verify that either way.
Things like this can vary still though. For example, the tyre war is a sporting regulation, not something that necessarily needs to be the same between the two series. Same with DRS, there's no need for SuperGT to adopt it if they don't want to. I don't see why variation like this can't still happen, it's just that the basic regs that the cars are originally built are the same, meaning you could run the cars in either series. So if a European team wants to buy a GT-R and run it in DTM with Hankook tyres and DRS, they can! :)

Also I believe Honda actually have a weight penalty for running a mid-engine car. So it's kinda illegal there too, but they make the exception. DTM could reject a Honda entry if they really wanted, but I bet they'd also make an exception because there's no way they'd turn down a new manufacturer after the Mercedes exit :roflmao:
 

AyrtJ97

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Nov 24, 2016
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Perforrmance-wise it'd not really be much different to ELMS, GT500 are roughly LMP2 equivalent. I guess that is a reason not to do it, mind you - unless we can manage another combined prototype/GT series ( ELMS is one of the few places to run a GTE rather than the myriad of GT3 series ). I'm trying to think of an existing GT3 series that has room on the grid!
They should run (imho) as multi class championship if that was going to happen, for that reason you stated (cars being somehow a LMP2), and if we look at it, well, the GT300 class host (or it did) GT3, so it wouldn't be crazy. If not, I'm looking at another ITC case, with just one marque on its last season (which is what my first post pointed at).


PS: As I usually say, sorry if I messed some words or expressions, I try my best, honestly.
 
Nov 3, 2015
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Things like this can vary still though. For example, the tyre war is a sporting regulation, not something that necessarily needs to be the same between the two series. Same with DRS, there's no need for SuperGT to adopt it if they don't want to. I don't see why variation like this can't still happen, it's just that the basic regs that the cars are originally built are the same, meaning you could run the cars in either series. So if a European team wants to buy a GT-R and run it in DTM with Hankook tyres and DRS, they can! :)

Also I believe Honda actually have a weight penalty for running a mid-engine car. So it's kinda illegal there too, but they make the exception. DTM could reject a Honda entry if they really wanted, but I bet they'd also make an exception because there's no way they'd turn down a new manufacturer after the Mercedes exit :roflmao:
Yeah, Honda have a bit of ballast ( quite a lot of ballast, iirc ) - it's just a balancing move, it's not *actually* illegal. Thing about the tyre war is the cars are designed for the tyres, you can't necessarily swap tyre brands & expect it to still work - prime recent example, Mclaren 650s GT3 which turned from a front-runner to undriveable when the SRO switched tyre brands, took a season and a half to get back to remotely competitive. Aero-wise it might not be a great idea to just install a DTM wing on a GT500, it might have some odd interactions when you flip DRS on. And so on.

They should run (imho) as multi class championship if that was going to happen, for that reason you stated (cars being somehow a LMP2), and if we look at it, well, the GT300 class host (or it did) GT3, so it wouldn't be crazy. If not, I'm looking at another ITC case, with just one marque on its last season (which is what my first post pointed at)..
The idea would be multiclass exactly like SuperGT - there the Class-1 cars are GT500, GT3s run in GT300 along with the baby silhouette cars. What is nice about SuperGT is the prototypes have a strong resemblance to the pukka GT cars, unlike LMP2s. GT500s cost a bit more than P2s though... it's not going to happen with ELMS around, it's just a pleasant idea :)
 

Otune

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Yeah, Honda have a bit of ballast ( quite a lot of ballast, iirc ) - it's just a balancing move, it's not *actually* illegal. Thing about the tyre war is the cars are designed for the tyres, you can't necessarily swap tyre brands & expect it to still work - prime recent example, Mclaren 650s GT3 which turned from a front-runner to undriveable when the SRO switched tyre brands, took a season and a half to get back to remotely competitive. Aero-wise it might not be a great idea to just install a DTM wing on a GT500, it might have some odd interactions when you flip DRS on. And so on.
Totally agree on both points but neither is a major obstacle. The GT500s already have custom suspension for each tyre brand anyway, so Hankook is just one more brand. Rear wing would have to be different for sure. This article doesn't mention if the Fuji crossover race will have DRS, but Hockenheim will, so I assume all three Japanese manufactuers will be testing/developing DRS rear wings for that anyway :thumbsup:

I'm just pretty excited for this, it seems like a good way to allow the manufacturers to race in both series, while still allowing the two series to run things differently as they have been. Time will tell whether these crosssover races work well or if any manufacturer actually decides to enter the other series, but it seems like a decent foundation to me!
 
Nov 3, 2015
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Yeah, the tyres aren't insurmountable, just expensive & you can't just swap important parts of the car & expect to be fast without testing ( which they're not going to get much of ), so I'm not holding out any hope of representative performance. Sticking DRS on a GT500 not designed for it is something I'm a bit uncomfortable with though.

BMW in SuperGT would be nice - they seem to have the idea that Class-1 is a solution to prototype racing everywhere at the moment, it's not *totally* unlikely.