Buttkicker Setup/advice

SOLO59 · Feb 22, 2017

Hey guys,
I'm looking to further upgrade my sim cockpit. I'm currently looking into something that will further immerse me into my race sims.

I'm hoping the buttkicker can fulfill my needs.

I can only find them available on Richmotech site. They have the Buttkicker Gamer 2 and the Buttkicker Simulation Kit in stock.

So here's what I need some help with;

1. Buttkicker Gamer 2 or the Buttkicker Simulation Kit? I've read that the simulation kit is better. I don't use an office chair so, maybe the simulation kit?

2. What exactly is "extension mode" and "chassis mode" for? Cannot find a "straight" answer online? I'm only getting one buttkicker for now so which option will be best?

3. Isolators. Do these need to be mounted directly under my wooden base and wheel stand? My rig is on carpet. Are there any alternatives? Using the isolators under my rig would probably make my seating position higher! I have a perfectly good fixed seating position and don't want it any higher/lower.

3. Do I really need another sound card? I don't even use my current sound card. I plug in my headphones (both aux and USB turtle Beach headphones) or my speakers via aux into the available aux port on the top/front of my pc. So I guess I'm using the on board sound from my pc? And the sound card untouched? Or the other way around? Idk lol... Either way, on board sound or sound card is free/open! So another sound card is really necessary?

4. I'm using the Next level wheel stand for my wheel, shifter and pedals. I've mounted a car seat to a wooden base (I made myself), the wooden base and wheel stand are bolted together. With this setup (both wood and metal constructed), how should I mount the buttkicker? Does it have to be mounted right under my seat? Can I mount it anywhere on the wooden base (I'm thinking on the back of the wooden base). I've read that metal is a lot better for the buttkicker 's response. But wood should be fine?

After watching the Inside Sim Racing review on YouTube, they REALLY have me sold on this thing! Any advice to my questions above would be greatly appreciated. Thank you

Mr Latte · Mar 12, 2017

Hey @whaletail, come back and share how you get on. Steel plate around 4-5mm can work quite well with the units attached to this with then isolators below on a supported upright. You may even want to use a thin layer of rubber material between the unit and the steel plate. People in the past I helped with 80/20 found good results with something like this:

Steel Plate with Rubber Layer / Tactile Attached / Isolators / Support Upright / Main Cockpit Frame / Isolators / Floor

Isolators can greatly improve how the tactile will feel and help maintain it in the frame, no question about that. Having the tactile pass into the pedals/seat regions prior to it being able to travel in various directions could also make a difference too. Various things are worth trying especially with 80/20 being easily altered.

Im keen to learn more of the BST-1 abilities if you get around sometime to testing or giving your views on it.

@SOLO59 and further updates?

SOLO59 · Mar 13, 2017

@whaletail thank you for the advice regarding the wiring of the shakers/amp. Mr. Latte helped me with that one already.

@Mr Latte sorry for the late update. The ADX bass shakers came in the mail last week Tuesday. I spent that afternoon rearranging my racing cockpit to accommodate the new bass shakers. It was a pain and very time consuming!
I also had work that day and worked until Friday morning.

I didn't get to really test the bass shakers until the next day and only spent 5 minutes with it. One word describes my experience with just the stock settings, "WOOOOOOOOOOOOW!" It feels very accurate and immersive! Over the weekend, I spent some valuable time with the simvibe software. I am beginning to familiarize myself with it. Its easy to use after exploring and using it a few times.

You were right about the SMSL amp being small. It was so small (hidding under a piece of foam) I thought they forgot to pack it with the power adapter upon delivery.

I'll tell you how it is currently mounted. (My pictures on my phone are too big to post here, but I can make them smaller size on my computer when I'm home. For now, I'll try to explain the best I can).
I have the ADX shakers mounted (left and right; using 8 #8 wood screws) onto one piece of wood.
Then, I drilled a hole in each corner of the piece of wood (4 holes).
I threaded a zip tie through each of the holes (each 4 corners).
Under my racing seat, is nothing but a steel frame and foam. So I'm basically using the zip ties to mount the piece of wood onto the steel frame of the racing seat. Now I can feel the shakers right from under my seat, which worked out great!
I found some very strong rubber laying around, cut them into pieces about as long as my index finger. They are about a centimeter thick (I think, will have to double check). I put these under the wooden base (my racing rig) for isolation.
However, small vibrations can still be heard downstairs though. I'm thinking of doubling or trippling the rubber. Simply stack 2 or 3 on top of each other and mount them to my wooden rig base. This way, my rig will sit a bit higher from the floor, and the isolation will work better? Gonna try that out on Wednesday when I'm off.
My isolation is so far; one long piece of wood, that goes on the floor. Two flat rubber mats mounted onto said wood. Then mounted the pieces of rubbers on the sides/corners of the board. Then I put my wooden base rig and wheel stand right on top of the rubbers. But like I said, small vibrations can be heard downstairs. I don't really feel like I'm losing and vibrations from my seat though. But I know it can be improved with better isolation. Maybe isolate the racing seat from my entire rig with rubber? That would be difficult for my setup though.

But so far, so good! Perfect addition to the sim racing experience.

Now, I'm only running my amp's volume at maybe 25-30%. But Whaletail said he using his amp (same brand as mine) at 50-70%. I'm using two shakers/one amp. He's using one shaker/one amp x2. I'm scared of overheating anything! But would you recommend 50/60% amp volume usage?

Mr Latte · Mar 13, 2017

Look forward to any images in future but good to hear things are up and running for you.
Even professional isolation/soundproofing solutions typically use more than one application or type of layer. Depends on the rubber you use as some may have better absorption than others. Cheap solution and application that can work quite well is isolator/wood/isolator.

This has worked for others I've helped in the past. Using typical BK or T100 rubber isolators and 10mm MDF or similar wood. I've even suggested/had people cut up a wood chopping board and wrap it in rubber matting to make suitable supports/feet. Then screw this to a wooden base platform. So certainly possible options to try that may be affordable or ideal for you?

Neoprene rubber is good and can be bought in rolls/strips or in isolators.

You can use a phone/tablet vibration app to show any vibrations going into the floor or base. They are not scientific but can be useful for these purposes. Also if you can using two, place one on the cockpit during vibrations and one on the floor as this lets you get an instant comparison to how much vibration is still going into the floor.

Option Examples:
Rubber
Isolator Pads
Floor Tiles

Mr Latte · Mar 18, 2017

Hey just wondering if things are still going okay for you?

SOLO59 · Mar 18, 2017

Yes sir! I continue to further understand what the simvibe software can do. No regrets! I just can't believe I went all these years sim racing and have not experienced using bass shakers. Oh how much doesit add to immersion. I did a AMS club race the other day. Even though I wasn't fast as the other 26 drivers, I was minding my own business, feeling immersed with the ADX shakers. I can't thank you enough Mr. Latte for all your help to get me started.

I'll save the rest of my thoughts on this topic for the review that is almost ready. My first review of anything, so I hope everyone enjoys it.

Mr Latte · Mar 18, 2017

Thats you on your way now then with 2 units it seems eh.
Are you tempted now to go for more?

Whats your favorite effects?

SOLO59 · Mar 19, 2017

Ha you got me bro! I DO want more! Thinking of going full CM! Gonna save for that. For now the two very pleasant shakers I have will keep me occupied.

The engine vibration effect blended in with the engine vibration with harmonics load. It really brings more dept into the feel of the engine.
I also really like feeling the engine going through slow corners and then the feeling of going faster. Wow that engine feeling..... coming out of the corner, picking up speed and flying up the gears!

dave kirk · Mar 19, 2017

Hi, is there anyone UK based on this thread, most of these websites do not ship to the UK
I hope someone can help. I am really wanting to set something up, only want to spend about $300 as I live in an apartment and too much vibration won't go down well with the neighbours, does anyone have links to what I need to get? I have searched for stuff on ebay etc but I am never sure whether it is the correct/suitable AMP.

Any help would be greatly appreciated

Thanks

Mr Latte · Mar 20, 2017

Hi @dave kirk
I've left some links below for you, the items that SOLO59 choose in this thread are available in the UK.

ADX Transducer
SMSL SA-98E AMP
16 Gauge Speaker Wire (recommended for these units)

Both are good choice for entry into tactile immersion and without spending too much.

dave kirk · Mar 20, 2017

Mr Latte said:
Hi @dave kirk
I've left some links below for you, the items that SOLO59 choose in this thread are available in the UK.

ADX Transducer
SMSL SA-98E AMP
16 Gauge Speaker Wire (recommended for these units)

Both are good choice for entry into tactile immersion and without spending too much.

Awesome, I really appreciate it

I will order those now, just one more question if you wouldn't mind, do I need any other cables?

Mr Latte · Mar 20, 2017

Hey, no probs, maybe a thumbs up if you want?

I don't think you need any other connections for these as they accept the bare wire in both amp/transducer ends, @SOLO59 can confirm. You may need a 3.5mm-RCA/PHONO cable for the stereo output of the soundcard if you don't already have one.

SOLO59 · Mar 20, 2017

I'll add to what Mr. Latte suggested. If you only have an on board sound card, then you'll need another sound card or a usb sound card to play your audio through your headphones/speakers. also, be sure to get a 3 pin/prong power cable for the amp above, and toss the original power cable. the original is only 2 pin/prong. As for cables/cords needed, you should be good to go now

DM77 · Oct 18, 2017

Sorry if this may be considered a necro, however I just want to say the information in this thread has been great. I've had to read everything and some other related threads a number of times to actually understand everything, specially regarding the Behringer DSP amps and the bottoming out issues with some of the Buttkicker gear.

I purchased a GT Omega ART racing cockpit last week and love it so far with my Logitech G920 wheel and pedals, Oculus Rift and TM TH8A shifter.

After initially thinking of the BK Gamer 2 I've decided to go with the hardware recommended to Dave Kirk as I'm also based in the UK. I should be receiving the amp from Amazon tomorrow with the speaker cables and splitter. I just need to save a little more to buy 2x ADX Maximus units and Simvibe. This will be my first experience with transducers, and I can't wait to get everything together and mounted up!

asteroulis · Oct 19, 2017

Waiting to hear how it goes!

SOLO59 · Oct 19, 2017

I can recommend simvibe . its really great in extension mode with my 3 shakers (x1 adx under pedals. X1 adx under seat. X1 aura pro back/seat).
You should check out ssw too if you want to save some money.
Ssw provides more road bump feeling according to testing by Mr. Latte.
But i suppose you can achieve similar results with simvibe as simvibe provides additional options/sliders to further increase the feeling of effects like bumps. But for me and most users, the default setup is just fine. All you need to do is adust the strength/volume of the effects. AND simvibe is comming out with Engine Harmonics effect to Extension Mode in a upcoming update!!! Currently only available in Chassis Mode. When I was in Chassis Mode with only 2 shakers, i used and really miss engine harmonics effect! Makes the engine feel so alive, so in dept its crazy! Can't wait for that!!!

DM77 · Oct 19, 2017

SOLO59 said:
I can recommend simvibe . its really great in extension mode with my 3 shakers (x1 adx under pedals. X1 adx under seat. X1 aura pro back/seat).
You should check out ssw too if you want to save some money.
Ssw provides more road bump feeling according to testing by Mr. Latte.
But i suppose you can achieve similar results with simvibe as simvibe provides additional options/sliders to further increase the feeling of effects like bumps. But for me and most users, the default setup is just fine. All you need to do is adust the strength/volume of the effects. AND simvibe is comming out with Engine Harmonics effect to Extension Mode in a upcoming update!!! Currently only available in Chassis Mode. When I was in Chassis Mode with only 2 shakers, i used and really miss engine harmonics effect! Makes the engine feel so alive, so in dept its crazy! Can't wait for that!!!

Sounds good, thanks for the heads up!

Also, I just realised I've ordered 14 guage speaker cable rather than the 16 guage recommended earlier in the thread. Does anyone know if this will this make much of a difference to the operation and performance of the amp and transducers?

Thanks

asteroulis · Oct 19, 2017

DM77 said:
Sounds good, thanks for the heads up!

Also, I just realised I've ordered 14 guage speaker cable rather than the 16 guage recommended earlier in the thread. Does anyone know if this will this make much of a difference to the operation and performance of the amp and transducers?

Thanks

Should be better. In metric , cables are in mm's and the higher number the thicker the cable. gauge cables are the opposite. So the thicker rhe cable the better...

DM77 · Oct 19, 2017

asteroulis said:
Should be better. In metric , cables are in mm's and the higher number the thicker the cable. gauge cables are the opposite. So the thicker rhe cable the better...

Thanks!

DM77 · Oct 19, 2017

The SMSL SA-98E amp arrived today, I've tested it out hooked up to my phone and one of my Wharfedale Jade 2 speakers and it works fine, it has surprisingly decent output compared to my Denon AVR for such a small thing, and I'm slightly tempted to order a few more in the future to bolster our home cinema setup.

I've got a pair of ADX Maximus transducers on order now (funded by selling my spare Xbox 1 last night) and they should be arriving either tomorrow, or most likely next Monday. I've got a replacement mains lead on order for the amp after hearing bad reviews and I don't want to take any avoidable risks, and I've got 14 guage cable with some banana plug terminations ready to go.

I should be using my Sound Blaster ZX sound card to output to either Simvibe or SSW via the 3.5mm to RCA splitter cable, as I have my main audio through my wireless Astro A50 headset, Oculus CV1 or via my GPU HDMI to my Denon AVR - so I'm confident the audio side of things is covered off (fingers crossed X).

I'm currently planning on mounting the ADX Maximus units side by side, bolted to the underside of my seat. I'm just wondering if that is the "best" way to make this work though? I've mainly based my decision on seeing some other users' write-ups on here and basically copying what they did knowing my budget is roughly the same and it seems a good starting point. Part of me wishes I had just got the BK Gamer 2 and not investigated further, and been happy with the basics, however I always seem to end up digging into the technical stuff and aim higher than I maybe should, so I sort of feel a bit in-over-my-head.

Ideally I would maybe have gone for a DSP1000 and a BK LFE as a starting point after having read up for a few more hours today, but I might just set my sights on that in the future.

This is a link to an image of my current setup: (sorry I'm not sure how to embed images)

https://1drv.ms/i/s!Aq2cjosUU_nDr3KUVPKzjr6Mj3Ys

I had to bolt my Vertagear SL4000 racing chair to a wooden board, and bolt the board to the chasis because the screw threads on the bottom of the chair didn't align with the "universal" fixing on the GT Omega ART

but this does give the opportunity to mount both ADX units under the chair now.

Is my current plan with both ADX bolted under the chair the best option for now, or should I think about 1 under the chair and one on the pedals instead?

Also, is it possible to run SWW and Simvibe at the same time, or do you have to choose either one or the other and the sole way to manipulate the transducers?

Thanks!
Dale