Behringer NX3000D DSP Settings Starting Point

Hey guys,

New here, but have several hours into digging around here looking into tactile immersion, and must say there is a ton of really good looking info here. You guys definitely seem very knowledgeable on the topic. I however am a complete newb to all this audio/tactile stuff.

I have spent over an hour just today looking for a starting point for settings without luck... I understand every rig is different, and I expect to spend quite a bit of time learning & tuning my setup. However, right now I'm literally all hooked up, but scared to send power to anything without a baseline that I can be confident won't damage my equipment.

I have 4 used Buttkicker LFE's (full size) & 2 new Behringer NX3000D amps. I have downloaded the NXEdit software (I think is basically the same as the INuke Connect), and am extremely overwhelmed with the amount of options. I honestly don't know where to start at all, and haven't found much about the very basics of getting started on the forum. Everything I find seems to be focused around tuning for particular situations assuming you're already up & running.

Any help you can give me is very appreciated!


Thank you!
Brandon
 
That's quite a hefty invested entry into tactile to start with. So I am sure you are going to enjoy it, with some impressive results. Let's work towards helping you with this and making it easy for others also to follow.

Do you want to cover wiring/cabling for "source inputs" and "amp outputs" or just mainly the software features and controls?

Setup Elements To Consider:
  • Soundcard settings and output gain level (volume)
  • Tactile Software output levels for both general output level and also individual effects levels
  • Amplifier input/output levels and other features like DSP

NX Edit & iNuke DSP Software Screens
  1. Configuration
  2. Filter/Crossover
  3. Parametric EQ (PEQ)
  4. Dynamic EQ (DEQ)
  5. Setup
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
Thank you for all you do here Mr Latte! Below are screenshots of the unaltered screens in the NX Edit software. From Screen 1 to 5... I'm lost with every single option :)!

I'm confident that I have everything hooked up properly, and sound cards assigned properly based on the Simvibe setup guide. It's really just the software side of things. Where should we start?

I tend to get a little carried away in a big hurry with just about every hobby I get into. All of this sim racing stuff is a pretty new hobby for me, and tactile feedback seemed like a must. I have spent a good chunk of cash on all this, but it's scratching my racing itch without having to race real cars anymore to do so. In all, I'm sure I will be saving money vs my real car days!

I also have mounted 3 Clark TST209's for extension mode (seat, pedals, & shifter), but I'm still waiting for the 2 NX1000D amps.

0.PNG

1.PNG
2.PNG

3.PNG

4.PNG


I imagine at some point info about my rig will pertain, so here are a couple pics since I'm not sure what all will be of interest. I have a DD2 on preorder; and my next couple purchases will likely be 2 more screens, & some HPP pedals. I have parts being made to rack mount all 4 amps & my PC on the front of the rig with the mounts being isolated with 1/2" thick 40A rubber. I'll post more pics as that gets completed.
file-3 (1).jpg

file3.jpg
file2.jpg
file1-1.jpg
file5.jpg


Again, your help is much appreciated!
 
Upvote 0
Okay so lets begin, first here is a useful link to help understand some terms that will be shown and used.
Audio Terms Glossary

I also recommend people relate to the (PDF) Manual to help gain as much understanding of the amps operations and features.

Some quirks that affected the iNuke "Remote Connect" software which may differ/vary with this new "NX Edit" software.

Missing Ohm
When setting the amp to operate to a specific Ohm of resistance eg: (4ohm ) and saving settings as an amp profile. When reloading the profile the setting for the amp-resistance (ohm) would disappear. I believe it saves correctly but just does not show in the configuration screen. This may be to do with the amp having what Behringer call SmartSense which detects the ohm load being used.


Display Xover
This feature may only be highlighted in the onscreen menus when doing a Bi-amp configuration
(See Manual)

Loading/Saving Profiles
The amp enables a user to save (19) user profiles. These can be saved to each amps internal memory and then recalled. We can however also save/load profiles to a PC folder location. I recommend doing this to have a backup for profiles you may of created. It is very easy to overwrite a selected profile slot (2-19) by clicking "Store" instead of "Recall". What this would do is overwrite the amps current settings you have over the last used profile loaded. I seen me loose profiles I had spent some time on by doing this easy mistake.

Care WIth Profiles
Take note that the amp will always load with the last profile slot selected.
It is possible to save a profile to PC folder location and then load this into multiple amps, however, this can be tedious as each amp needs to be connected separately and the software re-loaded. It was very disappointing to see that Behringer had not improved the NX series to work via wifi/tablet in that multiple amps could of been instantly controlled.

Why / How To Use The DSP Features
My recommendations are that a user should use the DSP features to tune their tactile hardware and its operation on their own installations. This is not to tune "tactile effects" operations as we should concentrate on the "effects" within the tactile software used/preferred by the user. We can however create profiles that offer lowered-higher agressive output to suit certain moods/scenarios within the home or used environment. One approach is a mode for "Late Night" usage that can still produce nice tactile but control what Hz are less/more prominent to the users preference.


OTHER STUFF:

How To Best Tune - Learn About How Various Frequencies Feel
For general tuning, I recommend testing with "Audio Tactile" source and using test-tone generators or tone generation based software options. Do tests to determine how your own tactile feels with frequencies from 5Hz- over 100Hz. When you gain more understanding of how different frequencies feel. You will then discover what Hz range best suits your own hardware. Also your installation, if certain Hz are causing issues with materials like reverb/pinging or bad vibration noises etc.

Spend time doing this and you will then begin to find your preferences for what Hz give the most satisfaction with the hardware you have. Different tactile can have varations in their output characteristics. Some are stronger with certain Hz with different peaks. Some the detail falls off at specific Hz. Many of the common affordable units struggle to bring strong energy below 30Hz and this can be very limiting to the potential your rig can deliver compared to more upmarket or professional tactile hardware.

After these general factrors are experienced and understood. The user will begin to relate more with experimenting or testing "individual tactile effects". For instance with Hz they may use or seem to work best for their own representation/purposes. How this is achieved will vary depending on your preferred tactile software and eventually then tuning/determining what combinations of effects work best for the user.

It's important that a user considers doing the above to discover:
  • What Hz if any, with higher gain levels may cause issues with installation or comfort
  • Is the installation leaking a lot of tactile energy to other places
  • Have they tried more than one installation position or method
  • Should they consider improved isolation to increase performance
  • Find the best operating range of their tactile, to then use this range within effects settings
  • Help the user learn to determine how different Hz can be used for specific effects sensations
  • Discover how using EQ and other DSP features can alter the output character of your tactile more to your own preferences or that suit your installation

What Tactile Software?
For me having tried all the major tactile software options, I would say that Simhub Shakeit (Tactile) is currently the software that offers the best user interface, soundcard support, channel control, effects operation/creation and most promising software for future features/improvements and updates. I recommend you follow the developments of @Wotever and support him for his rather incredible software in ALL that it does. To his credit he "listens" to features the community wants and finds ways of bringing them. I find it now very hard to recommend someone pay $90 for Simvibe over what this offers.

Simvibe Issue
Please also take note, that it is advised NOT to rely on Simvibes "Channel Test" feature as a way to do "frequency tests" as it to my understanding has never been fixed and had serious flaws by not generating tones properly for both CM & EM modes. At this point, Simvibe is not using actual telemetry data but only trying to generate audio tones. It can be used to clarify a channel is working but that's about it.

Unfortunately it seems this part of Simvibe does not work so well (In fairness, I haven't re-checked in over a year). Yet it seems Simvibe has not really developed/improved that much in the last 9 years. This (issue) can be confirmed by anyone monitoring the channel output via FFT/Spectrum analyzers, yet it was something nobody or testers (to my knowledge) seemed to notice/mention. Over the years I had multiple people telling me this was how they tried to do frequency tests as a way to tune their tactile, so the issue needs to be highlighted.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
Setup



GREEN
Load & Save
These profile settings enable a PC location for safe backup.

YELLOW
Select & Name Profile
Use dot to select profile slot (2-20).

Slot 1 is for amps default settings.
Recall will load the "selected profile number"
Store will save the current amp settings to the "selected profile number"
ALWAYS be sure to select a blank or the correct profile slot you want to save/alter

CYAN
Meter Levels
Input meter level, this controlled via 3 possible options
(1) The front knobs on the amp
(2) The tactile software output gain settings and individual effects gain settings
(3) The soundcard settings

BLUE
Output meter level, this controlled by features of the amps DSP used.



Configuration



BLUE
Set Amp Mode
Select the amp mode desired. Pay attention to how the diagram varies with each mode. It shows the path for each channel. Bi-amp as shown above highlights how a Crossover is used on input channel "A" to separate low bass for a large speaker unit driver and then high bass frequencies to a tweeter based unit driver. We do not really need to use this feature with tactile but in some installation situations, it could be used.

The two most likely used modes are:
Stereo
Will route the DSP for both channels in the same way.
Dual
This enables independent DSP settings to be applied to "A" and "B" channels
I recommend this to give optimal control and tuning of each transducer.



RED

Channel Link
This links both channels that altering settings on one is applied to both


YELLOW
Peak Limiter
We use this to digitally limit the max wattage output, this will vary based on the "Load" selected and adjusting the "Peak Limiter" For example, a User may want to limit a channel to (4ohm 50watts) to ensure it does not get damaged by higher wattage.

Alternatively, they may want to let the amp output its max potential wattage for the suitable Ohm required.


GREEN
Ohm Resistance
Alter the resistance. Most tactile will use 4ohm, some are 2ohm, others may be 8ohm or even 16ohm. It is important to correctly set this to match the tactile specification of the unit being used.
You could cause potential damage if this is not correctly set.


CYAN
Phase
If a unit is installed hanging upside down then switch the "Phase" for that unit/channel to 180.
If it is installed upright keep it at 0. In some installations, users may have certain units inverted. It is important to have all the units work in tandem.


OTHER
Keep Hold/Release at 50 & 100ms
Delay does not have to be used with multichannel setups, it may cause issues.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
Filter Crossover

The Crossover feature can be very handy to help reduce the operational strain on a tactile unit. It also can be very good for testing of different frequency bands. So a user can determine what any individual or indeed all their effects are outputting for any given frequency range. Why have your tactile operating at 120Hz if it does very little worthwhile with effects you use on that unit/channel beyond 90Hz. Additionally, why have your tactile unit output low frequencies like under 20Hz if it struggles to bring much from them.

Depending on the configuration applied. A user may want a channel/unit that could have specific purpose for engine effects and this channel have a wider frequency range or different EQ applied. This would help boost RPM sensations but again we should test and take into account what the performance output for the used unit is, rather than just operate with no crossover control.

Sometimes, tactile can feel stronger on one unit than another, even with the same models and settings applied. You can use the gain here in Crossover to help balance the output level for a unit to match that of others.

Its always good to keep an eye on the INPUT & OUTPUT meters when making changes and to determine if your soundcard or indeed feedback felt from your units has an inbalance.



Keep in mind you have settings for channel "A" and channel "B"


RED
X-Over Link
This can show "Crossover Settings" overlaid in the grided frequency chart
We can determine from this "A" & "B" channels that can potentially be set with different settings.
Only Bi-Amp mode offers this.

The Grid in the chart helps to relate to the "Bass Energy" different frequencies have.


GREEN
High Pass
This determines the frequency value you want to start from.
Note, when set to "OFF" it will operate from below 20Hz. If set to 20Hz it will start from 20Hz

BLUE
Low Pass
This determines the frequency Hz value you want to use upto.
Keep in mind this does not mean frequencies over this are not felt at all.
Take note of what "Slope" is also used factors as to how the frequencies range falls off.


Type
Select the type of filter you may want to apply. You can have none if you want.
Pay attention to how the visual representation changes for the frequency chart

Slope
This determines how gradual or instant the slope falls off.
Pay attention to how the visual representation changes for the frequency chart



ORANGE

Gain
Alters how strong all the Hz within the set "Crossover" are output.
You can adust this in combination with your soundcard and software output gain settings.
Take care with adding too much gain adjustment. Different soundcards can output stronger signals than others. You may also discover some sims or variation between different tactile software and settings used.



Parametric EQ (PEQ)


Unlike traditional EQ with sliders at pre-defined frequencies.
A PEQ allows us to select individual frequencies and then adjust these how we please.
Do keep in mind that increased dB can add possible distortion. Some tactile units will not vary much the additional energy/detail they output with increased dB applied. Yet we can use EQ to trim over-excitable tactile units with select frequencies.

What we can term as "Peaks" as the peak characteristics of a unit will maybe determine what gain you use with it. Yet if we can reduce/trim the "Peak" we alter the characteristic of the output of the unit and then can find a more personal preference in their possible operation. Consider how different headphones can sound very different, some with booming or muddy bass or overbearing mid-range to being overbright with higher frequencies. Not all tactile are going to output frequencies the same, how the frequencies feel may vary with the users own installation placement, method and materials.

Good "EQ" when applied and combined with clever usage of the "Crossover" a user can restrict frequencies that go to their units to have them operate more efficiently. Basically no point frequencies going to a unit if the unit does not produce them well. This then frees up the unit to only operate with the Hz we determine to work well with it.

Benefits this may bring will vary but we can help a unit to run cooler, more efficiently, bring improved refinement and detail. Yet importantly be more personalised to the users own preferences with the materials/installation for the cockpit they have being used.

Users that have basic/budget tactile wont gain as much with this as with improved or higher end tactile may achieve. Although really users with basic/budget tactile and normal amps with no such controls we highlight here. What tactile immersion they possibly achieve is certainly not to the upper levels or an immersive experience to the true potential possible. The difference in performance can be quite large but notably, so can the investment needed be much greater too.




CYAN

Frequency Chart
Notice the chart shows the typical audio hearing range of 20-20KHz
The common discussed tactile used frequency range is usually from 20Hz - 100Hz+
Different models of transducers have varied specifications or usable frequency ranges.
(This is covered better below)

RED
X-Over Link

This can show "Crossover Settings" overlaid in the grided frequency chart along with the settings being applied via EQ. Only Bi-Amp mode offers this.


GREEN
Bypass
This disables "ALL EQ Filters" for quick comparisons to what your "EQ" settings are achieving with the audio. This can be useful when doing tone tests, to determine if you want to trim some midrange bass but perhaps boost below 30Hz and to also try to gain a bit more detail with higher frequencies.

Reset
Clears filters to default settings

Filters 1-8 (Channel A & B)
If in Stereo mode keep in mind you need to apply settings in both channel A/B. When the amp is in Dual Mono then the EQ is applied to both channels the same. Some users may have an amp powering different tactile. So in that case, "Stereo" operation would be best to enable individual EQ settings for the different tactile used on channel "A" and "B"

You can click the 1-8 Filters to disable/enable them individually.
This can be good to feel what individual filter settings are bringing when on/off

Gain
Setting the dB for the selected frequency "Center Value" being used.

Frequency
Determine the Hz "Center Value" that you want to alter.


YELLOW
Quality
Often referred to as the "Q"
This determines what "Surrounding Frequencies" are also being included for the selected "Center Value Frequency". Pay attention to the visual representation as it narrows/widens the "Q Factor".
This can be useful to cover a range of Hz for the desired slope without having to have multiple filters used. However, sometimes we can have more specific control by using additional filters, each with their own Hz values selected. Practice with these settings and it will become apparent easily what they do with feeling and seeing the visual representation graphics applied.


Type
Select the filter type to be used.
For tactile operation and the limited frequencies, we use with these, compared to full audio and speakers. We perhaps do not need so many options but included are Low Shelf (LS) / High Shelf (HS) & PEQ based filters.



Dynamic EQ (DEQ)

For tactile usage, tweakers may prefer to use the PEQ than this DEQ. Although we can see potential advantages for each but user preference from testing may determine if, what or indeed if both are used.

One main difference is that we have a threshold control with the DEQ
Like the PEQ we can have different settings for channels A/B if the user has the amp set to Stereo operation mode.

It is good to use the visual representation to see how/what settings are doing to the output.
Notice that with the DEQ the dB varies from 0 to -50dB. This gives us the ability to determine how the drop off operates within the dB range. Testing can be done by the user to help determine if they find this useful for their own tuning methods or indeed how deep they want to get into this.





GREEN
Gain
Setting the dB for the selected frequency "Center Value" being used.

Frequency
Determine the Hz "Center Value" that you want to alter.

Quality
This affects what surrounding frequencies are also altered with the frequency given as the center value and based on the controls being set.

Type
This offers Bandpass (BP) Low Pass (LP) and High Pass (HP) filters.
The user can look at the visual representation as to what each is applying and in accordance with the other settings.


RED
DEQ (Dynamic EQ)
Turn the EQ on/off for the channel

BLUE
Threshold
Alter how the gain is reduced over the dB range. This can be a wider/larger drop at the start to reduce the energy for this frequency to a dB level below 0dB. It can allow the user to help shape/target how a specific group of frequencies may be output/controlled on a tactile unit.

Attack & Release

I keep these at 50ms and 100ms
This feature may be more useful with subwoofers than tactile.

Ratio
I keep this at 1:5:0
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
Try these for testing and generating tones:
Use your "primary audio sound output" as the source for these tests.

Frequency Tone Generator
Another


With "Test Tone" based experiments via tone generators, you can determine what your tactile hardware achieves

The quality of tactile hardware you use can greatly limit or increase not only how good the various frequencies in tactile tones or effects may feel but the range of frequencies you really can make good use of or properly enjoy.

When users start with tactile software, be it Simvibe or others they generally have very little knowledge about frequencies. I prefer to tell people to go and learn better what Hz your tactile can actually use before even looking deeply into what Hz you should set for certain effects.

Different units will fall closely into the categories below.
A user can do their own tests to determine what category or how good the tactile they have aligns to others.



Here are potential examples:
I highlight how much of the frequency range, each option is missing

CLICK TO ENLARGE


  • High Energy / Low frequencies can bring unique felt sensations that the more basic tactile units cannot properly achieve with sufficient output or energy.
  • Tactile hardware that reduces the usable frequency range will have limited energy and detail potential. This becomes evident when we try to have multiple effects but have the effects using different frequencies.
  • If we have a much smaller window of frequencies our tactile units can use. Then the user has much less potential in the number of effects that can be used and these maintain their own detailing or have sensations that differ from other effects.
  • Without the ability to produce the very lowest frequencies then the user will also not be able to achieve additional depth and unique sensations only possible with 3Hz and above.


Doing Your Own Experimentation & Tests
I recommend users wanting to do "frequency tests" after sometime, jot down scores for each 10hz to help them determine how they class the operation of their own tactile with the various frequencies. For example score each 1-5 over these frequencies. 10/20/30/40/50/60/70/80/90/100Hz

Focus on learning what range your own units work best in.
A user with amps such as these or the iNuke DSP models can then use the various features to help alter the performance characteristics of their tactile. This can vary on the tactile used but it is possible to achieve greater performance and more refinement.

The user can apply the "Crossover" to set specific operating frequency ranges. Say you want to feel how your tactile handle effects between 60-80hz. Such is possible or with other from and to ranges. It may be good to do this with 20Hz ranges between frequencies. As the user can then attempt to apply EQ within these ranges to fine tune your tactile more to your own preference.

It is clear that some transducers/shaker units have peak outputs at different frequencies. This can be @ 35Hz or under as well as some that peak @40-50hz or have a peak output with 60-80Hz. Just keep in mind that sometimes a good tune, is reducing some frequencies to help level up others. It is not always about boosting frequencies that are already strong to make them stronger.

Dont be afraid to try settings and save to a profile for further comparing or self-learning. Take your time and get familiar with settings.


Effects Creation & For Later
Example of Harmonics & Octaves.
While this is not the place to get into effects creation with the various software options we have. Sometimes when building effects it may be good to have frequencies that harmonically match.
This is just something I have been playing around with in my own testing/effects but want to furter continue evaulating.

I want to spend more time doing this with Shakeit and monitoring the frequency output of effects via spectrum analysers to better see and understand what is happening with different settings/controls are used. I believe there is more to creating multiple effects for good operation than just picking random frequencies to use.

It would be good to have in a thread somewhere, owners of LFE or BK Concert units, discuss and share settings they feel deliver good effects.



Octave
A difference of pitch where one tone has a frequency that is double or one-half of the frequency of another tone.

Harmonic
Is a frequency that is a whole number multiple (2, 3, 4 etc) of some fundamental frequency, and an octave is double the fundamental. Octaves are important musically because the 2:1 ratio is so natural to the ear that the octave sounds like "the same note just higher".
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
Sorry for the delayed response; I've been traveling. I should be able to tear back into this tonight.

Holy smokes! Thank you for the very in depth response Mr. Latte! I look forward to diving into this!
 
Upvote 0
wow Mr. Latte... thanks for all this info! it's overwhelming...
I own a single buttkicker and just purchased this amp. is there a config file we can import to get everything right instead of trying to understand all this? LOL
 
Upvote 0
I have 2 bk concerts on my rig just for engine rmp and shift. what frequencies in sc4 do these use, ive been using hem for ages with a nu1000dsp and have no idea what i should change in the dsp software
 
Upvote 0
I have 2 bk concerts on my rig just for engine rmp and shift. what frequencies in sc4 do these use, ive been using hem for ages with a nu1000dsp and have no idea what i should change in the dsp software

This thread seem to of got lost and I missed replying at the time.
What are you currently using, still Simvibe or have you moved yet to Simhub?
 
Upvote 0
@Mr Latte Working my way through this.......... Whilst im sitting here testing I have 2 completely different units attached, should I be using Dual mode as this allows me to set the different Wattage outputs

( Ive got a 50W unit on A and a 400W unit on B whilst I play )
 

Attachments

  • Modes.JPG
    Modes.JPG
    75.1 KB · Views: 392
Upvote 0
Yes Dual Mono lets you have individual controls for all the steps/tabs (Conf/Cross/Para/Dyn/Settings)
Your settings seem correct, amp will not always show the Ohms when you save setting.

P.S always make a backup as it is easy to overwrite a saved profile.

BK Advance then?
What transducer units, please confirm...
 
Upvote 0
An easy way to learn what the DSP features is doing is to practice with actual audio.
So using music/video and then mess around with settings to learn yourself.

You can then also test frequency test tones or audio sweeps.
I'm sure you seen the websites in past posts in the main thread good for this.
 
Upvote 0

Latest News

Online or Offline racing?

  • 100% online racing

    Votes: 98 7.8%
  • 75% online 25% offline

    Votes: 130 10.4%
  • 50% online 50% offline

    Votes: 177 14.1%
  • 25% online 75% offline

    Votes: 353 28.1%
  • 100% offline racing

    Votes: 493 39.3%
  • Something else, explain in comment

    Votes: 5 0.4%
Back
Top