Banned from AC forums, anyone have experienced this?

[Rui Santos]

< Mod Edit: Please be advised that it is in breach of RD ToS to use insulting or derogatory terms. Post cleaned.>

Hello all, i'm banned from AC forum for more than one month now. As an active member since the beggining and with more than 1000 messages i feel shocked with that kind of attitude from them. <snip>

Has this happened to anyone? I agree maybe that they should permanently ban you if you were kind of disrespectful or insult anyone, which was not the case. I got banned until now just because people were asking on forum for MP improvements (more than acceptable) and all i've done was quote a message <snip> and used a funny ironic image related to what he was saying THAT WAS CLEARLY A LIE!! From that moment on, as it was admitted by Lord Kunos himself, he went on a ban strike and several people were banned... until now.

Well, maybe i would accept a week suspension because now i know AC forums staff can't accept critics anymore (they're rich now) and became a dictatorial regime that can only be populated by fanboys or "yes" sheeps...

The image was this...

 

[Niki Đaković]

Sorry, but IMO that's rubbish. If they don't want it to be the ultimately realistic racing sim, then why is this on their website?

"NEXT GENERATION RACING SIMULATOR
Assetto Corsa features an advanced DirectX 11 graphics engine that recreates an immersive environment, dynamic lighthing and realistic materials and surfaces. The advanced physics engine is being designed to provide a very realistic driving experience, including features and aspects of real cars, never seen on any other racing simulator such as tyre flat spots, heat cycles including graining and blistering, very advanced aerodynamic simulation with active movable aerodynamics parts controlled in real time by telemetry input channels, hybrid systems with kers and energy recovery simulation. Extremely detailed with single player and multiplayer options, exclusive licensed cars reproduced with the best accuracy possible, thanks to the official cooperation of Car Manufacturers."

They toot their own horns about how realistic their tire model is, how accurate the physics/cars/tracks are, complain that people aren't appreciating the intricacies of hot lapping on the fancy tire model and laser scanned tracks, and label it as "your racing simulator", then they can be damn sure people are going to expect their product to be a fairly realistic sim, and justifiably so. If some people want an "easy time" with a racing game there are many, many, many options for that, AC does not need to become another one of those. In fact, it needs to be the opposite, it needs to be the one that finally brings a proper racing sim to the console masses, and they have the ability to do it if they don't water down their product.

I think you should find the answers to your own question mate.

 

[Golanv]

 

[Brandon Wright]

I think you should find the answers to your own question mate.

I don't have any questions mate. I have an opinion that if they advertise it as an ultra-realistic simulator than they should provide it as such and not make it an "easy sim" as you suggested. They themselves recently said they would not be dumbing down AC for console release and I support that decision. I have a few issues with AC but don't really have any problems with it and I play it regularly. But after seeing them decide to be heavy-handed with the ban-hammer because a few people hurt their feelings, I certainly have lost a lot of respect for them. I certainly won't be posting on their forums anymore.

 

[Radu Oros]

But after seeing them decide to be heavy-handed with the ban-hammer because a few people hurt their feelings, I certainly have lost a lot of respect for them. I certainly won't be posting on their forums anymore.

Maybe they don't see fitting such attitudes for a support forum. Doesn't mean I agree with all their bans, but some people also think they are guilt-free and want to pass the innocent image. But things that get too personal or obsessive, negatively, either related to the game, devs, or other users, they don't want that in their forum.
But for what's worth, AC forum is the only one (I assume the rf2 forum as well) that didn't ban the Pretend Race Cars website link. All others, virtualr, bsimracing, racedepartment, iracing forum, pcars forum, reddit simracing, have banned their website. It must also mean something. Which doesn't guarantee they may or may not ban it in the future. And AC has been the most targeted to criticism from them, where the main writer of that website used to post articles for RD some years ago. But that's already past water, only mentioned it as a small reference.

 

[Amir Vodokotlic]

I honestly think they are starting to cut corners.

They want to get maximum amount of cars/tracks before console version.

If you compare 12c gt3 and 650s gt3 and open the dev apps they are 99.999% identical. I could bet you the physics are one to one copy if there was way to look under the hood like in rfactor 1.
Only change you can feel is FFB Multi on 650gt3 is higher than 12c GT3.

You can't tell me real life 650s gt3 is carbon copy of 12c gt3 with different body kit on outside.

The same thing with the sls gt3 and amg gt3. Open dev apps exact same specs.


1.1 version with 458 gt2 around Spa was really hard to keep tires from overheating in 10 lap race now with 1.4 you can do 20 laps around Spa with Softs no problem.



As for the banning on ac forum.

Tbh they should also start banning users that do nothing but post meaningless crap (spam) that adds nothing to the game.

Prime example is Michael Hornbuckle ten of thousands of posts 99% are spam.

 

[Michael Hornbuckle]

LOL
/thread

 

[Brandon Wright]

Maybe they don't see fitting such attitudes for a support forum. Doesn't mean I agree with all their bans, but some people also think they are guilt-free and want to pass the innocent image. But things that get too personal or obsessive, negatively, either related to the game, devs, or other users, they don't want that in their forum.
But for what's worth, AC forum is the only one (I assume the rf2 forum as well) that didn't ban the Pretend Race Cars website link. All others, virtualr, bsimracing, racedepartment, iracing forum, pcars forum, reddit simracing, have banned their website. It must also mean something. Which doesn't guarantee they may or may not ban it in the future. And AC has been the most targeted to criticism from them, where the main writer of that website used to post articles for RD some years ago. But that's already past water, only mentioned it as a small reference.

Unfortunately, the internet is always going to have trolls, best to just ignore them and let it roll off your back IMO. I agree that such attitudes aren't fitting for a support forum, but I also think that banning a few bad fish is only going to alienate hundreds or thousands of good fish, and that doesn't solve any problems. The banhammer has a place, for sure, but I believe it should only be used in the most severe cases. Just my opinion of course, I don't really have anything against them, but I don't think very highly of them either based on some of their words/actions over the last six months.

 

[Radu Oros]

1.1 version with 458 gt2 around Spa was really hard to keep tires from overheating in 10 lap race now with 1.4 you can do 20 laps around Spa with Softs no problem.

The heating model is mostly different since 1.3, now it improved with 1.4.
Before there was 'simply' heating of the core of the tyre. Now there's also surface temperatures and a different core temps behavior. And is also related to wheel alignment, and physical properties of the tires. Things I can't speak more of because I didn't study this stuff.

But on what basis and data are you comparing that in 1.1 was more realistic than now in 1.4? I think you'll really need to open a thread in the AC forum and discuss this, and possibly you'll receive insight and explanations from Aris.

May sound cliche at this point, but you don't have to be afraid of talking in the AC forum, unless you're really not open to change your ideas or become too personal with accusations that the game is this and that and devs don't know nothing.

Today there was a thread talking about Tyre Wear, and Aris (physics dev) talked openly about questions from users. So I really advise you to create your own thread with your subject. Why I'm telling you this? So that you don't remain with closed and preconceived ideas, without at least giving the opportunity for devs to express themselves about your doubts of the game.
http://www.assettocorsa.net/forum/index.php?threads/tyre-wear-vs-driving-style.29367/

 

[Radu Oros]

@Amir Vodokotlic
This is how my Soft tyres were after finishing a 10 lap race at Allog server, at Spa with the bmw m3 gt2. Default setup, only changed aero to 1-3, and fuel to 40l.

Pretty beat up. They held well for ~5-6 laps, on 5th lap rear tyres were at 99.01, and front tyres at ~98.8. After that it went downhill, faster than the wear while the Softs were still good during the initial laps.
I think this app only reports Core temps. For surface, I need the Telemetry app or maybe the Suspension app.

Do you spot any wrong behavior? Apart from my average understanding of racing and setups.

ps. I don't race at 30fps, but I had to quickly alt+tab and print screen it before it sent me to pits.

 

[Austin Ogonoski]

Vroom Vroom, that's the sound of the Print Screen button warming up!

 

[Queequeg]

When I stopped posting over there (A few months ago, my own choice ) the chit chat section in the AC forum was a cesspool of trolls, fanboys and haters. Almost every second thread was either:
a) My sim is better than yours. RF2/iRacing/RRRE is **** and AC is soooo much better.
b) Herp derp what's ETA for night racing?
c) I found this funny meme on the internet.
d) My biggest wish is that [insert Chris Harris car of the week] will come to AC. Let's fund the license for Kunos.
e) other, similar stupidity

I opened the chit chat forum just now to see how it's going over there at the moment (Can't open threads because I disassociated my Steam account.). I mostly saw threads aimed at discussing the new cars, driving style, information on real life car physics and popular servers. Seems like the banning worked tbh. To be clear, I am NOT saying that anyone who was banned is or was repsonsible for the low quality of discussion I experienced the last weeks I had still participated over there, but I do believe knowing that the ban hammer is there makes people think twice before posting stupid comments, insulting comments, nonsense or just plain spam.

I also think there could have been a nicer, more constructive way to go about this for the Kunos team. Banning people unexpectedly for behavior that just prior was considered normal on the forum is a pretty harsh move, and the neccessity of a change of tone and content should probably have been communicated clearer and earlier since some people seem to have been surprised quite a bit.

Just my two cents. Maybe I'll get to trying the new patch in depth on Sunday because I'm still on the fence with DP3 (lame name btw). Since I don't have any interest in DP2 (The content doesn't do it for me.), I probably won't be playing online much because of Kunos' nonsensical way of handling DLC online and last time I fired it up (1.3) I was surprised by how much better I had liked the physics in earlier versions.

 

[Chris]

I also think there could have been a nicer, more constructive way to go about this for the Kunos team. Banning people unexpectedly for behavior that just prior was considered normal on the forum is a pretty harsh move, and the neccessity of a change of tone and content should probably have been communicated clearer and earlier since some people seem to have been surprised quite a bit.

Again, this is what happens when you have game developers put in charge of community management of a forum.

They don't actually have any set in stone rules, simply saying that you should "behave how you would behave in society" is open to an incredible amount of interpretation, which is why when people get banned (sometimes wrongfully, sometime rightfully) they're often left wondering why they've been banned. If someone is banned here on RD then they're pointed to the exact rule that they broke so there is no confusion.

Additionally, if you're going to have a forum where people are allowed to post opinions etc, then don't expect everyone to have something good to say about your game. This is just forum-101 stuff. And if they can't accept people posting their genuine opinions about the game on their forum, then I say again, simply remove that section all together and return the forum to its original purpose of bug reporting.

 

[Amir Vodokotlic]

@Amir Vodokotlic
This is how my Soft tyres were after finishing a 10 lap race at Allog server, at Spa with the bmw m3 gt2. Default setup, only changed aero to 1-3, and fuel to 40l.

Pretty beat up. They held well for ~5-6 laps, on 5th lap rear tyres were at 99.01, and front tyres at ~98.8. After that it went downhill, faster than the wear while the Softs were still good during the initial laps.
I think this app only reports Core temps. For surface, I need the Telemetry app or maybe the Suspension app.

Do you spot any wrong behavior? Apart from my average understanding of racing and setups.

ps. I don't race at 30fps, but I had to quickly alt+tab and print screen it before it sent me to pits.

I race on the same server on weekends.
Driving style is different from everyone, I can do 10 lap race with softs 458 gt2 now and that wasn't the case before. Will screenshot you race since you are using screenshot to prove your point.


As for your post above no where did I claim 1.1 is more realistic than 1.4. I said it was more challenging.

You seem to ignore the fact that they are using same physics for gt3 cars. So what is realistic on that basis?

 

[Tim Lundy]

When I stopped posting over there (A few months ago, my own choice ) the chit chat section in the AC forum was a cesspool of trolls, fanboys and haters. Almost every second thread was either:
a) My sim is better than yours. RF2/iRacing/RRRE is **** and AC is soooo much better.
b) Herp derp what's ETA for night racing?
c) I found this funny meme on the internet.
d) My biggest wish is that [insert Chris Harris car of the week] will come to AC. Let's fund the license for Kunos.
e) other, similar stupidity

I opened the chit chat forum just now to see how it's going over there at the moment (Can't open threads because I disassociated my Steam account.). I mostly saw threads aimed at discussing the new cars, driving style, information on real life car physics and popular servers. Seems like the banning worked tbh. To be clear, I am NOT saying that anyone who was banned is or was repsonsible for the low quality of discussion I experienced the last weeks I had still participated over there, but I do believe knowing that the ban hammer is there makes people think twice before posting stupid comments, insulting comments, nonsense or just plain spam.

I also think there could have been a nicer, more constructive way to go about this for the Kunos team. Banning people unexpectedly for behavior that just prior was considered normal on the forum is a pretty harsh move, and the neccessity of a change of tone and content should probably have been communicated clearer and earlier since some people seem to have been surprised quite a bit.

Just my two cents. Maybe I'll get to trying the new patch in depth on Sunday because I'm still on the fence with DP3 (lame name btw). Since I don't have any interest in DP2 (The content doesn't do it for me.), I probably won't be playing online much because of Kunos' nonsensical way of handling DLC online and last time I fired it up (1.3) I was surprised by how much better I had liked the physics in earlier versions.

Can't agree more. When I put myself in their place and try to imagine it was me running my business and talking with my customers over the internet I'm not sure I'd do it any differently. We have to remember that these guys are real people at Kunos, not robots, and wasting time dealing with trolls, spammers and just generally rude and disrespectful people, takes time away from their main job and time away from their personal lives and families. I know it's the internet and all that and it's supposed to go with the territory...blah blah blah...but I can't honestly say I'd do anything much different. I don't suffer fools gladly in my personal life and it would be no different if I were running a forum either.

 

[Rui Santos]

Again, this is what happens when you have game developers put in charge of community management of a forum.

They don't actually have any set in stone rules, simply saying that you should "behave how you would behave in society" is open to an incredible amount of interpretation, which is why when people get banned (sometimes wrongfully, sometime rightfully) they're often left wondering why they've been banned. If someone is banned here on RD then they're pointed to the exact rule that they broke so there is no confusion.

Additionally, if you're going to have a forum where people are allowed to post opinions etc, then don't expect everyone to have something good to say about your game. This is just forum-101 stuff. And if they can't accept people posting their genuine opinions about the game on their forum, then I say again, simply remove that section all together and return the forum to its original purpose of bug reporting.

Chris Stacey said it all... in addition i'll say that i feel like i was caught in the wrong day, wrong time with wrong mood, after around 1000 posts on AC forum seeing lots of people trolling everyday during last years, it was an unlucky time for me to be on that forum at that time. But, if they say they'll only banned 30 people in a universe of 160.000 i'll guess those 30 deserve a second chance. Like i said i'm not interested anymore in helping or talking about the game anymore, far from that, but at least i want to have freedom to be supported for something i bought if i have problems with it.

Cheers!

 

[Will Mazeo]

Sorry, but IMO that's rubbish. If they don't want it to be the ultimately realistic racing sim, then why is this on their website?

"NEXT GENERATION RACING SIMULATOR
Assetto Corsa features an advanced DirectX 11 graphics engine that recreates an immersive environment, dynamic lighthing and realistic materials and surfaces. The advanced physics engine is being designed to provide a very realistic driving experience, including features and aspects of real cars, never seen on any other racing simulator such as tyre flat spots, heat cycles including graining and blistering, very advanced aerodynamic simulation with active movable aerodynamics parts controlled in real time by telemetry input channels, hybrid systems with kers and energy recovery simulation. Extremely detailed with single player and multiplayer options, exclusive licensed cars reproduced with the best accuracy possible, thanks to the official cooperation of Car Manufacturers."

They toot their own horns about how realistic their tire model is, how accurate the physics/cars/tracks are, complain that people aren't appreciating the intricacies of hot lapping on the fancy tire model and laser scanned tracks, and label it as "your racing simulator", then they can be damn sure people are going to expect their product to be a fairly realistic sim, and justifiably so. If some people want an "easy time" with a racing game there are many, many, many options for that, AC does not need to become another one of those. In fact, it needs to be the opposite, it needs to be the one that finally brings a proper racing sim to the console masses, and they have the ability to do it if they don't water down their product.

They say all this but in some interviews he is like "let's not add this or that because it's for hardcore simracers".
If they had a office here in Brazil I'd sue them for false advertising lol

 

[Radu Oros]

They say all this but in some interviews he is like "let's not add this or that because it's for hardcore simracers".
If they had a office here in Brazil I'd sue them for false advertising lol

What did they advertise and didn't release or do? Some examples would be cool.

 

[Niki Đaković]

@Radu Oros AC has everything they advertise and it all works. But, that also suits my point. It's easy and accessable. Tire wear doesnt have much influence. Tire heat neither. Compared to old patches, real life cars and other sims, never overheats tires. In fact it's an issue on most cars front tires are stone cold. But hey, there's graining and blistering and it all works. But on which level.

Marco is a superstar in sim-community. Never has a game's promoter been this famous before. Half of the success and riches AC has accomplished is thanks to him and clever promoting. It's all very nicely wrapped.

You really do need to find time and spend it in the other simulations. If you really want this and care about next level realism. Try to read some books about driving and car engineering. To have some base at least if you don't have access to real life cars or race cars and race tracks. Books are great source from wise people who went thru the thick of it in real life. Speed secrets series and Carroll Smiths "to Win" books are absolute classics. Then you can recognize things as you test several simulations. Also, you need to have methods to your tests. Just like Marco has to his promotion. You need areas that are important and each area might take several days of testing (read months if you really want to get past half of it in some of the simulations) to get deep enough to see what is there.

And then you can finally put all that in one giant puzzle for yourself and see where AC scales for you on your personal rank of level of realism. But, it requires so much time 99.9% who never give any critic to AC don't even consider doing such test and comparisons. And when there are guys like Empty Box who get paid to make such reviews state their opinions I believe they're not even 1/3rd of the way where they could be.

Also consider quote from Senna : "On a given day, a given circumstance, you think you have a limit. And you then go for this limit and you touch this limit, and you think, 'Okay, this is the limit'. And so you touch this limit, something happens and you suddenly can go little bit further. With your mind power, your determination, your instinct, and the experience as well, you can fly very high."
Those are the words from real life champion who found a way to go deeper every time he gets there. And much to confirm this so do things work in Live for Speed where you can pretty much improve your laptimes indefinetly, eventually hunderdth by hunderdth. Much the same is in rFactor 2 as well. But in AC with many different setups you end up with same laptime and you end up always few hunderths of that laptime. This suggests to me obvious lack of depth. That was also there in old patches too, but back then you could at least go three times deeper then you can now.

But, really you'll never believe me until you experience it. And trust me if you start exploring things in a method i request you to, then you will be on a path of becoming better driver. For me I always want to be better driver and sorry but AC is not helping me do that. I really hope you accept anything from my post useful for yourself. Writing me a reply to make an argument won't help you become better driver my friend. You want to consider that. We all think we're great drivers. No matter of our pace or past results. Or else why would we be spending so much time here. But rarely do drivers who race me on track for victories ever spend their time to write on forum in discussions. So I try to give little help and guidance you know without coming accross blunt. We have to put our egos aside if we're to see the truth and the truth will set you free no matter who spoke the truth.

 

[PuffTheMagicBelgian]

Good thing this guy isn't very active on the forum..

 

[Austin Ogonoski]

And when there are guys like Empty Box who get paid to make such reviews state their opinions I believe they're not even 1/3rd of the way where they could be.

Matt ain't paid, but pretty much every notable publication and/or personality receives free "review copies" of either a sim or piece of content. Obviously, it's in an editor's best interest to give a favorable review to ensure the stream of free stuff doesn't stop.

There's ONE sim racing dev who continues to supply me with press access despite repeatedly pooping on their game for various reasons, and they deserve a lot of credit for that. I think that's why I take such an extreme stance as the one I do on PRC. While Kunos is crying that people on the forums hurt their feelings, the boys over in [REDACTED] literally don't care that I'm handing out glitch setups or criticizing their ridiculous pricing model.