Assetto Corsa Competizione: The Porsche 911 GT3 R Blog

Paul Jeffrey

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ACC Porsche 911 GT3 R Blog.jpg

Aris has been away from the internet for a while but fear not, he's back - and he's posting blogs about cool cars in Assetto Corsa Competizione once again!


Assetto Corsa Competizione has been out at V1 release status for a little while now, and if you've not yet had the change to try the Porsche 911 GT3 R in game yet, I highly recommend you do.

Seemingly @Aristotelis likes the car too, as he publishes another one of his very interesting and insightful developer blogs about this awesome GT3 machine..

The Porsche 911 has always been a top competitor through the years. The unorthodox architecture with the engine hanging at the rear giving heavy rear weight distribution combined with the short wheelbase, has always been judged as extremely unstable for street use. Yet, in the hands of an experienced professional driver, the extremely fast turn in, the agility in changing direction and the best in class traction, always delivered top performance. Sure everybody would complain of instability at turn in and terminal power on understeer at corner exit. Still professional drivers knew how to deal with such characteristics and adjust their driving style to make good use of the advantages. In a class where the cars were heavy and grip was generally lacking, being able to put the power down and change direction quickly was always an important advantage.

The choice of the word “was” is not casual though. Modern GT racing have brought to the grid cars with big aerodynamic improvements, electronic systems for traction control and ABS are adjusting traction and grip circles and modern tyres provide more grip. Speaking of which, because GT3 racing is “client racing”, in order to keep costs low, the tyres are identical for all cars with tiny dimension changes.

The end result is that the Porsche ended up without being able to make a difference with its architectural advantages, while it become even more unbalanced from the tyre dimension availability that often keeps the front tyres out of the operation range.

Aerodynamic advancements are also limited by the architecture. Much of the aerodynamic downforce gains are made from a big rear diffuser that has to be wide and deep enough. Unfortunately for the Porsche, that’s exactly where the engine sits, so the actual diffuser is very shallow and short. That means the engineers have to work a lot on the front splitter and the rear wing. They manage to create substantial downforce, but it is still not enough. It also generates a lot of drag as it needs the rear wing to work in high angles and most importantly, the resulting aero platform has a very narrow window of operation and a very non linear downforce production that creates unpredictable results. In the paddock, you can often hear the drivers complain that the car works strangely whatever the try to do and the engineers complain that they can make the car “work” in a given circuit or condition. As if things couldn’t get worse, most of the cars have their fuel tank near to their Centre of Gravity, so that the fuel load only affects the weight of the car but not the overall balance and handling. Not the Porsche; 120 litres of fuel hanging under the front bonnet. Which means that even if you manage to make the car work with a good setup, the whole balance is going to change when the fuel load will change. The car needs quite different setups for race and qualifying sessions. Often teams will add more fuel during qualifying, to help the drivers with a more predictable handling. During the race, the car will change handling characteristics and the drivers must be ready for it. It’s not uncommon to see the car being competitive during one part of a stint, and then get slower for the rest of the same stint as the fuel load changes, or vice versa, depending on the setup compromise the team opted for.

Another limiting factor is the engine. This amazing powertrain screams up to 9000 rpm and it is one of the most praised engines in the road car. So how this can be a problem?

Even though the BoP is not very restrictive, it still has to limit the power to around 500bhp, similar value to the other small frontal area cars. Incidentally this is the same outcome of the street engine. Surely race engines could go higher, but when you start analysing the engine capacity, you realise that there’s not much margin available. The flat 6 engine is normally aspirated and has “only” 4 litres capacity. The smallest engine of the grid is the one of the Honda NSX, 3.5lt but twin turbo. All the other normal aspirated engines vary from 5.2lt V10 of the Lamborghini and Audi, up to the massive 6.0lt V12 of the Aston Martin and the gargantuan 6.2lt V8 Mercedes. Which means that those cars can generate similar amount of power but also massive torque from very low revs. The Porsche engine has to climb up to 9000rpm to achieve the same power and obviously the power band is more peaky. Surely the gearbox ratios can cover the problem, but then again the GT3 series demands a single gearbox ratios homologation that then is used on all the circuits. Some serious compromises must be taken.

Seems like the Porsche has serious disadvantages and predictably the performance of the car was not adequate of the name in 2018, with the occasional spark under wet conditions where the traction can make a difference and the top speed is not so important. Porsche focused its efforts on the WEC GTE 991 RSR car which was highly modified with the engine rotated by 180° and practically transformed in a mid engine architecture. The car performed much better and surely the engineers learned a lot from that experience. The 2019 Porsche GT3 R car already won the Monza race and is looking good for the rest of the season. So if you want to win with the Porsche, you need to be a bit patient until we release the 2019 version of the car.

Still, all said and done, when you get to drive the Porsche, the shortest wheelbase of the grid, the scream of the flat 6 at over 9000rpm, the amazing turn in, while the rear starts to rotate, the fast and constant workout needed with the steering wheel to keep the car from over-rotating and the sublime lightness of the front end when you put all the power down and the front raises up, makes you forget the shortcomings in performance. The car keeps you alive and alerted at any moment. Brings back memories of vintage racing cars when the driver could make all the difference. When finally you manage to drive it properly the level of self reward reaches new heights.

Forget about top speed, you know you’ll be the slowest anyway. Add rear wing to get downforce, stiffen the rear end to make it rotate, play with the brake bias that can be set way to the rear and start working that steering wheel. The Porsche won’t forgive lazy drivers, it won’t make it easy for you. It demands your total dedication, yes even if you have to race it for 24 hours and doesn’t care if you’re tired. Show the respect it asks for, and you’ll get a different kind of reward that only special cars can give; and if it rains… you might even have a chance for something special.


Full post can be found HERE.

Screenshot from Kunos forum user Tino66


For more from the world of ACC, why not head over to our Assetto Corsa Competizione sub forum and get yourself into the thick of the action? We have a great and knowledgeable community, plus some pretty epic League and Club Racing events, if I do say so myself. Go on, treat yourself!

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Thank you Paul for highlighting this blog and Aris for your passion and for bringing those amazing car simulation to us. Aris, I hope you will ignore all the senseless comments, they unfortunately come with the territory.
A lot of us are enjoying driving the wonderful SIM ACC is, appreciate the details that are present in the physics of the car. With the proper gear and up to date PC, ACC bring racing car simulation to a new high level, and represent the state of the art of where SIM are at in 2019. Please keep pushing the limits and infuse your knowledge and expertise in those simulated cars.
 
The game is not complete, I love the graphics,
well everything is said with that. the ffb is weird, just like the old Aserto corsa,

With a small touch on the curb and you have lost the car. This makes it difficult to find the limit.
after 15 minutes I give up.
Rfactor and AMS I can drive all day and all night long with a smile on my face, same as Gtr2 yesterday
I have now reinstalled.

for me the most important thing in simracing is to feel the car when it loses grip
and the force feedback that gives you all that response/information.
 
The game is not complete, I love the graphics,
well everything is said with that. the ffb is weird, just like the old Aserto corsa,

With a small touch on the curb and you have lost the car. This makes it difficult to find the limit.
after 15 minutes I give up.
Rfactor and AMS I can drive all day and all night long with a smile on my face, same as Gtr2 yesterday
I have now reinstalled.

for me the most important thing in simracing is to feel the car when it loses grip
and the force feedback that gives you all that response/information.

I have had a similar suspicion when ACC was released with v1.0 and I took the Porsche for the first time to Spa. I know the Porsche very well from Assetto Corsa (pretty much the exclusive car choice in the GT3 field, just as it will be for me in ACC - I ONLY drive the Porsche).

The very first lap I had a Nicki Thiim initial video moment.The car went at a 90º angle sideways through Eau Rouge, magically (I don't know how) I saved it and it did feel truly unreal how the car straightened itself (all caused by just kissing the right hand curb just a bit).
I then collected myself going down Kemmel straight and for the first time COMPLETELY lost it by running the right hand kerb as I always do. The car spun so quickly that I simply did not know what happened - I was perplexed.

I went back to the pits, made sure I switched to the save setup to begin with and went out again.
I struggled HEAVILY over the course of days trying to understand what happened at Spa with the Porsche (worst areas being Eau Rouge / Radillion, riding curbs at certain corners and of course Blanchimont - it took me about a felt eternity to wrap my head around Blanchimont.

Now I have no problems whatsoever to lap Spa in the ACC Porsche reliably without spinning or loosing control - I do consistent laps - none of them at Alien speed but consistent (faster than I ever did in Assetto Corsa to my surprise).

In ACC it all comes down to these intricacies:
tire temperature
- although tire warmers are used in Blancpain (and drivers such as Nicki Thiim have commented critically on this behavior in ACC), tires are initially NOT IN OPTIMAL WORKING CONDITION and they also are NOT on working condition quickly as drivers such as David Perel have commented they actually should be but in ACC tires take about 2 - 3 laps to normalize. You may start to drive more aggressively after a minimum of 1-2 laps (and still not be on peak tire performance just then).
DON'T EVER ATTACK CURBS on your OUTLAP in current ACC. It is a guaranteed recipe for disaster.
Once tires are on temp they actually work beautifully on curbs (with notable exceptions)

curb bug
- some curb behavior is known to be incorrect and Kunos devs are working on a solution
In very distinct situations (difficult to reproduce in actual fast, consistent race laps but more likely to happen in "freak incident situations" where certain factors align) a tire can "hook" into the outer (offtrack) side of a curb and can cause a violent lateral force, spinning the car - this can be very confusing as no apparent cause of this behavior can be easily understood when it happens. It is a bug in the game.

It may occur to some people who have a certain distinct driving style or certain racing line more often than to others. To me it never happened in a normal racing situation or during a clean lap but only when I goofed around or deliberately tried to trigger the issue (you could drive along parallel to a curb and slowly "drop" the outer wheel beyond the edge of the curb and the behavior could be triggered - not always and not on all curbs.
To me this never once happened in a race, even when "attacking" curbs or pushing wide.
The behavior is known and a long thread on the Kunos forum with Kunos devs having acknowledged this issue and signaling that an effort is made to solve the issue.

surface conditions
- if the track is in any other condition than dry and properly rubbered in curbs should be taken with care
- on a even just slightly damp track some curbs can be treacherous - be aware of that

aero and suspension
- some curbs that we can ride aggressively in less advanced (read: less complex aero + suspension simulation) racing sims can be surprisingly … surprising ;-)
This has been a topic on the Kunos forum and after a rather logical explanation by Aris and many, many hours with testing with telemetry data on the points Aris made it is very clear that those curbs are in fact properly simulated.
Ie. right side curb at Eau Rouge with the Porsche (not so much with the 1st gen Bentley or the AMG GT3 as those cars simply EAT curbs for breakfast and ask for seconds).
You should not so much as look at this curb the wrong way in the Porsche as touching it or worse, riding high on it will result in upsetting the cars aero balance up to a complete diffusor stall at the rear, resulting in the car loosing substantial rear downforce in that high load, very fast corner - you WILL loose that rear end.

I know how all of this in a first quick 15 min session at Spa with the Porsche can result in a "This Arcade Game is nonsense" reaction, or in a my "insert racing sim xyz here" behaves so much more realistic and I have driven at this track with those kind of cars since Grand Prix Legends and ALWAYS have taken that curb or this corner just like that!

I was skeptical at my first experience at Spa with the Porsche as well but a lot of hard work (several weeks of consecutive setup sessions and endless hours of data analysis) have resulted in me finally understanding the causes of these behaviors and I LOVE IT !!!

I have now setups and understanding of racing lines around Spa or for example the Nurburgring GP track (both tracks where curbs are EXTENSIVELY utilized to produce a fast lap in real life racing) where I fully attack curbs and the behavior of the tires, suspension and aero of the Porsche through those corners is THE VERY BEST I have ever felt in ANY sim!!! It just feels alive!


Now don't take this as an account of a "Kunos fanboy" - I love racing sims that Kunos have produced since NetKar Namie. Equally so I do love aspects of any other racing sim - I loved GTR and GTR2 (and GTL and Race07 and even the Simbin GT mods for EA F1 games before Simbin incorporated) I loved GPL and Geoff Grammonds F1 series, I loved certain mods in rFactor, I loved Live for Speed, I loved even Gran Turismo and Forza on consoles and I certainly love the FFB feel in rFactor 2 with certain cars at certain tracks under specific conditions - all of these have some beautiful aspects to them.

Looking at all of these (Assetto Corsa included, which is up to now my preferred go to racing sim) ACC has substantially raised the bar in terms of vehicle dynamics, feel of tires, aero, suspension, brakes, FFB.
it is not perfect (like NONE of them are) and today with v1.0.5 beta available it certainly is not yet complete but it truly feels next generation racing sim to me and every time after a couple of sessions of exclusively driving ACC over the course of a week - going back to any of the others (including AC) feels like a step backwards and I need a moment to get accustomed.
 
So, is the 2019 GT3 R still rear-engined?
Niki Thiim said it wasn't but I believe it still is, although the engine was pushed a few cm forwards. I found no other source, and he may have mistaken it for the RSR.
The 991 II is still rear engined (engine position moved again a little forward to make space for more diffusor and improve balance - it is still a rear engined car though with it's transmission ahead of the engine.
 
To say GTR2 is better is hilarious.

Anyways after a few hours of playing the game I will say that it is ok, 7/10 for me. Career mode is lackluster but the driving is a lot of fun and a lot better than original assetto corsa which felt disconnected for me.

Hopefully they will continue to fix this game and maybe add US Blancpain/ex PWC series cars and tracks.
 
it was a great experience fantastic sounds/physics/graphics ...enjoyed it and will come back but not as often ... but i did everything all tracks all cars and it just got a little repetitive plus the online experience is wierd some take it some serious some dont and for that reason i spend most of my time on single player ...

i play ac more than acc so it says it all really theres more to do .. and the mods are what i enjoy about the game ..
 
The front and the rear have same tire width....OMG.
In the original AC I have been always struggling to keep the front temp, even if I set the front tire pressure to only 16psi..... GJ Kunos for simulating that. The default setup has almost no rake and it will be a pain to drive it one does not increase the rear height. I thought that car was undrivable when I first played AC, missed a lot of fun.

Also, the front wing is 5-way adjustable and the rear wing is 20-way adjustable in AC. I have to set the wing over 4 to have enough turn in for flugplatz corner on Nordschleife. The car becomes really hard to drive once the rear wing is dropped below certain point while it is still hard to hit 280kph on the long straight. (I have to have a higher rear wing like 18 or above to confidently drive consecutive laps because I suck.... the result is I only get around 278 V max on the straight). 911 GT3 R in AC requires a lot of skills to drive fast. I saw once someone beat the real-life record set by Manthey (8:09:105) and my jaw dropped onto the ground. I could never get near that.

Kunos really did a great job simulating the subtle characteristics of the cars. GT3 R becomes extremely fun when it comes to circuits that require a lot of trail braking, like Brands Hatch and Zanvoort. Especially in BH there are a lot of down hill braking corners, it is a lot easier to keep the front warm and throwing the car into corners is really really fun. GT3 R is also the first car I could drive BH in less than 1'26". Still cannot get the gold with the R8 LMS 2016 (below 1'25"). R8 does not tolerate trail braking as much as the 911.

I guess that is also why my friend prefers 718.. rear engine is not everyone's type. 718 is a great car no matter the trim and we should not view 718 owners as "people who want a Porsche but cannot afford a 911." Thanks Porsche for putting a 6 cylinder in the new Cayman. Amen:geek:
 
I have had a similar suspicion when ACC was released with v1.0 and I took the Porsche for the first time to Spa. I know the Porsche very well from Assetto Corsa (pretty much the exclusive car choice in the GT3 field, just as it will be for me in ACC - I ONLY drive the Porsche).

The very first lap I had a Nicki Thiim initial video moment.The car went at a 90º angle sideways through Eau Rouge, magically (I don't know how) I saved it and it did feel truly unreal how the car straightened itself (all caused by just kissing the right hand curb just a bit).
I then collected myself going down Kemmel straight and for the first time COMPLETELY lost it by running the right hand kerb as I always do. The car spun so quickly that I simply did not know what happened - I was perplexed.

I went back to the pits, made sure I switched to the save setup to begin with and went out again.
I struggled HEAVILY over the course of days trying to understand what happened at Spa with the Porsche (worst areas being Eau Rouge / Radillion, riding curbs at certain corners and of course Blanchimont - it took me about a felt eternity to wrap my head around Blanchimont.

Now I have no problems whatsoever to lap Spa in the ACC Porsche reliably without spinning or loosing control - I do consistent laps - none of them at Alien speed but consistent (faster than I ever did in Assetto Corsa to my surprise).

In ACC it all comes down to these intricacies:
tire temperature
- although tire warmers are used in Blancpain (and drivers such as Nicki Thiim have commented critically on this behavior in ACC), tires are initially NOT IN OPTIMAL WORKING CONDITION and they also are NOT on working condition quickly as drivers such as David Perel have commented they actually should be but in ACC tires take about 2 - 3 laps to normalize. You may start to drive more aggressively after a minimum of 1-2 laps (and still not be on peak tire performance just then).
DON'T EVER ATTACK CURBS on your OUTLAP in current ACC. It is a guaranteed recipe for disaster.
Once tires are on temp they actually work beautifully on curbs (with notable exceptions)

curb bug
- some curb behavior is known to be incorrect and Kunos devs are working on a solution
In very distinct situations (difficult to reproduce in actual fast, consistent race laps but more likely to happen in "freak incident situations" where certain factors align) a tire can "hook" into the outer (offtrack) side of a curb and can cause a violent lateral force, spinning the car - this can be very confusing as no apparent cause of this behavior can be easily understood when it happens. It is a bug in the game.

It may occur to some people who have a certain distinct driving style or certain racing line more often than to others. To me it never happened in a normal racing situation or during a clean lap but only when I goofed around or deliberately tried to trigger the issue (you could drive along parallel to a curb and slowly "drop" the outer wheel beyond the edge of the curb and the behavior could be triggered - not always and not on all curbs.
To me this never once happened in a race, even when "attacking" curbs or pushing wide.
The behavior is known and a long thread on the Kunos forum with Kunos devs having acknowledged this issue and signaling that an effort is made to solve the issue.

surface conditions
- if the track is in any other condition than dry and properly rubbered in curbs should be taken with care
- on a even just slightly damp track some curbs can be treacherous - be aware of that

aero and suspension
- some curbs that we can ride aggressively in less advanced (read: less complex aero + suspension simulation) racing sims can be surprisingly … surprising ;-)
This has been a topic on the Kunos forum and after a rather logical explanation by Aris and many, many hours with testing with telemetry data on the points Aris made it is very clear that those curbs are in fact properly simulated.
Ie. right side curb at Eau Rouge with the Porsche (not so much with the 1st gen Bentley or the AMG GT3 as those cars simply EAT curbs for breakfast and ask for seconds).
You should not so much as look at this curb the wrong way in the Porsche as touching it or worse, riding high on it will result in upsetting the cars aero balance up to a complete diffusor stall at the rear, resulting in the car loosing substantial rear downforce in that high load, very fast corner - you WILL loose that rear end.

I know how all of this in a first quick 15 min session at Spa with the Porsche can result in a "This Arcade Game is nonsense" reaction, or in a my "insert racing sim xyz here" behaves so much more realistic and I have driven at this track with those kind of cars since Grand Prix Legends and ALWAYS have taken that curb or this corner just like that!

I was skeptical at my first experience at Spa with the Porsche as well but a lot of hard work (several weeks of consecutive setup sessions and endless hours of data analysis) have resulted in me finally understanding the causes of these behaviors and I LOVE IT !!!

I have now setups and understanding of racing lines around Spa or for example the Nurburgring GP track (both tracks where curbs are EXTENSIVELY utilized to produce a fast lap in real life racing) where I fully attack curbs and the behavior of the tires, suspension and aero of the Porsche through those corners is THE VERY BEST I have ever felt in ANY sim!!! It just feels alive!


Now don't take this as an account of a "Kunos fanboy" - I love racing sims that Kunos have produced since NetKar Namie. Equally so I do love aspects of any other racing sim - I loved GTR and GTR2 (and GTL and Race07 and even the Simbin GT mods for EA F1 games before Simbin incorporated) I loved GPL and Geoff Grammonds F1 series, I loved certain mods in rFactor, I loved Live for Speed, I loved even Gran Turismo and Forza on consoles and I certainly love the FFB feel in rFactor 2 with certain cars at certain tracks under specific conditions - all of these have some beautiful aspects to them.

Looking at all of these (Assetto Corsa included, which is up to now my preferred go to racing sim) ACC has substantially raised the bar in terms of vehicle dynamics, feel of tires, aero, suspension, brakes, FFB.
it is not perfect (like NONE of them are) and today with v1.0.5 beta available it certainly is not yet complete but it truly feels next generation racing sim to me and every time after a couple of sessions of exclusively driving ACC over the course of a week - going back to any of the others (including AC) feels like a step backwards and I need a moment to get accustomed.

This is a good post to describe my initial driving efforts with the Porsche. My problem (and I think the problem many may have had) was that my first turn in the Porsche was at Spa in the hotstint event. I lost it in Radillion twice, entering Les Combs twice, Pouhon twice and Blainchimont twice. In two laps.

I then left the track and took it to Silverstone. I tried driving it in the manner I am used to and after a few laps of spinning in all the corners I expected to have trouble in: Copse, Maggets, Becketts, Stowe and Abbey plus a few more single spins in other slower corners, I adjusted my driving style in the car. Once I did that it took me about 15 minutes to get used to the car and then took it into some servers.

I immediately started doing very well with the car. I had to figure out what corners were going to make the car behave as they did at Spa and Silverstone and approach these corners the same way. The next time I went back to Spa I won going away. The car is a beast out of corners and the turn in is phenomenal if you know how to work it: Just a breath off the throttle at the right time will get the rear to rotate. It is a great momentum car.

Also: 54% brake bias to the front seems to work very well.
 
This is a good post to describe my initial driving efforts with the Porsche. My problem (and I think the problem many may have had) was that my first turn in the Porsche was at Spa in the hotstint event. I lost it in Radillion twice, entering Les Combs twice, Pouhon twice and Blainchimont twice. In two laps.

I then left the track and took it to Silverstone. I tried driving it in the manner I am used to and after a few laps of spinning in all the corners I expected to have trouble in: Copse, Maggets, Becketts, Stowe and Abbey plus a few more single spins in other slower corners, I adjusted my driving style in the car. Once I did that it took me about 15 minutes to get used to the car and then took it into some servers.

I immediately started doing very well with the car. I had to figure out what corners were going to make the car behave as they did at Spa and Silverstone and approach these corners the same way. The next time I went back to Spa I won going away. The car is a beast out of corners and the turn in is phenomenal if you know how to work it: Just a breath off the throttle at the right time will get the rear to rotate. It is a great momentum car.

Also: 54% brake bias to the front seems to work very well.
:O_o:wow 54% is a very aggressive setting. In AC I drive the Z4 on around 70% and I set the B Bias on the 911 around 62% because I am aware of the different structure, but I never thought about setting it to 54% as this is, in my impression, a F1-range B Bias. (F1 has more front bias than 54% on many stop-go circuits) I will definitely give it a try on Brands Hatch and see how my lap will improve. I am currently stuck on low 1'25". I hope I can get past the 1'25" wall.
 

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