Are we ever going to see a fix for the "Centre" FFB issue?

[Msportdan]

Aggressive centre force.....

high oscillation around the center....

floaty/swaying ffb on centre.......

Words that describe what a lot of RRe players have reported about in the last year or so. S3 have also sent us many updates since then, but none hold the key to making this sim be among the greats.

When sector 3 are we gonna see this, ive spent money on this and my issue hasnt been fixed, so can you offer my money back then? I know ive banged on but seriously i am pissed about this problem now, its sooo frustrating. Youve added fanatec support but cant fix this. Also any answers just seem to be in the vain of "others don't have the problem so you shouldn't" or see the useless FFB thread.

This is not my emotions getting the better of me, this is the fact im

.....fed up of waiting for a fix in an update which never seems to come

..... frustrated i bought content in this game that doesnt want to fix issues that been throughout its life span

....... sick of coming on here and getting the same old crap answers from users that either a)dont recognise the problem b)ignore the issue c)just havent a clue.

Please s3 answer this thread please, are you going to fix this FFB issue, once and for all or let this game be forever known for its floaty awful ffb issue?

Regards Dan

(please mods dont lock this thread let s3 have a chance to answer)

 

[Nox]

I don't know why it is so hard to understand. "My wheel works, so who cares..." isn't a helpful answer. Many of us have tried those settings but we still get the oscillation, simple. Even on those settings, Georg said that the oscillation is "much less", not that it is completely gone. We're not asking for something unreasonable, we are simply pointing out a bug and wanting the devs to acknowledge it, and potentially fix it.

 

[James Cook]

Next time I have my wheel set up I will try and post a video of the oscillation. But it's the same thing as Dan already posted.

 

[James Cook]

Even on those settings, Georg said that the oscillation is "much less", not that it is completely gone.

A tacit acknowledgment that this oscillation is a 'thing'.

 

[theravenousbeast]

I'll try and record the centering force and post it on the S3 forums by the evening. Whether it is or isn't a big issue for me, it still is an issue and should be looked into.

 

[Msportdan]

i may try do a vid actually showing my wheel and the force of the wheel being applied throuugh my hands of i can.

Another thing, last nite i tried the same thing i did in my video in RF2. In the palatov, and it does the same thing with the wheel whipping from side to side, but it felt different, much less severe. RRe whipping can snap it out of your hands almost, where RF2 it feels more like my real car you hold the wheel and it will react to your hands. Basically if you let go of the wheel both sims result in the same whipping wheel. If you lightly hold both, rre rips out of your hands RF2 allows control without a strong grip.

But having discussed this for 3 pages, with 1 post intervention from a dev, are we just wasting our time?

 

[Andy_J]

@theravenousbeast
I'll ask again as I am confused. What does it mean by setting everything 1/1 in that setup? It says set splitter at 2 and rear wing at 16 and keep wings at 1/1. What does that mean?

 

[James Cook]

Last night I ran a couple of races with the ADAC 14 cars and even driving in a straight line I could feel the wheel wanting to fight itself left and right. Take your hands off and the car will spin out.

But having discussed this for 3 pages, with 1 post intervention from a dev, are we just wasting our time?

It seems that way. All we can do is keep discussing it in the hope that we are not being ignored.

 

[theravenousbeast]

@theravenousbeast
I'll ask again as I am confussed. What does it mean by setting everything 1/1 in that setup? It says set splitter at 2 and rear wing at 16 and keep wings at 1/1. What does that mean?

2 splitter 16 rear wing means just that -> for the cars that have front and rear aero adjustments. (modern DTM, GTs, Protos etc)
1/1 means 1 splitter 1 rear wing . He says for RWD Touring cars so that would also mean the BMW E90 which has adjustable rear wing, but I haven't tried it. The others (DTM 1992, Touring Classics, G5 I think) will always have front/rear aero at 1/1 = not adjustable.

Anyway, back on topic: I tried to do the same thing in R07 with the E90 WTCC car and only once did it spin out from the centering force in a similar situation like Dan's video. Every other time the centering force only went back to the center (duh) and slowed down with the oscillations, instead of multiplying them like in R3E. Tried with caster at 0.0 = same result. Dunno what to make of it.

Some of the ISI FFB/physics forum gurus might be able to tell us what could be the cause for this issue.

 

[Msportdan]

I will admit a bit or recklessness from my driving today. I tried this in my CooperS and if I got the same reaction I do in RRE I would of end up dead. In real life, the wheel just goes back to centre and the wheel carry on the motion of travel where I let go. If anything it feels sludgy the way it centre. No my tyres aren't flat lol

 

[theravenousbeast]

I will admit a bit or recklessness from my driving today. I tried this in my CooperS and if I got the same reaction I do in RRE I would of end up dead. In real life, the wheel just goes back to centre and the wheel carry on the motion of travel where I let go. If anything it feels sludgy the way it centre. No my tyres aren't flat lol

You're not exactly helping the issue by comparing pure bred racecars' designed for top drivers for maximum cornering to a Cooper S. Lets just stick to the difference in behaviour between sims.

 

[Msportdan]

ha

pot kettle!

 

[James Cook]

Who is/are the FFB guy/s at Sector3 just out of interest?

 

[Jay Ekkel]

its a mix of guys really, not just the one. Georg being one of the guys that works on it quite a bit and requests new stuff. Not really sure who support him on code side tbh.

 

[James Cook]

Thanks Jay. It would be great to have a discussion with the guys, either here or on your forum. Some of us feel like our voices aren't being heard on this issue.

 

[Jay Ekkel]

Please s3 answer this thread please, are you going to fix this FFB issue, once and for all or let this game be forever known for its floaty awful ffb issue?

Floaty center is a known problem with some wheels.
We have some ideas for a workaround, but haven´t had the time yet to work on them.

Thanks Jay. It would be great to have a discussion with the guys, either here or on your forum. Some of us feel like our voices aren't being heard on this issue.

Feel free to always ask questions, and give suggestions & feedback, here or over at our forum, we try to be all over the place. We will answer what we can and when we can.

As important as it is to ask questions and provide feedback, in my opinion it is equally important to accept the answers provided and circumstances given.

Is this or any FFB issue a priority, I can safely say its one of the many we have. Updating physics, updating tire models, implement proper fuel use, improving FFB, improving track performance, adding multi class and all its features, improve setups, implement save setups, improve damage, improve sounds, improve gearbox behaviour, implement flags, better pitstops, AI improvements and the list goes on and on of things we really want to do. And I bet each and everyone has their own personal top priority/must have feature.

But we have to accept the fact that with the amount of people we are in the studio this will take a decent amount time, we do not have a large team we do not have the option to "quickly" push this out in a month, but believe me when I tell everyone inside Sector3 will bust balls to get things done.

Sorry to go slightly o/t, but I thought it was needed to explain that even though its important, its one of many important tasks we have.

 

[Jim Liak]

Guys my feedback.

G27 user and I had the same oscillation problem and i managed to solve this by closing Logitech profiler!!!

Also try my settings, i have excellent feeling and also i cured my major issue with R3H which was the floating feeling.

I would like to hear you thoughts.

 

[James Cook]

Thanks again Jay.

There are two issues here. First, the floaty centre which we know has been acknowledged and is being looked into. The second issue is the centre force oscillations which has never been openly and clearly accepted as a problem by anyone at Sector3. I think I speak for everyone when I ask that this could be looked into and a solution provided for all brands of wheels. I appreciate the limited resources and huge 'to do' list at Sector3 but FFB is such a critical component for sim racers that it has to be a priority in order to do R3E justice. It's a great game otherwise.

 

[Msportdan]

Feel free to always ask questions, and give suggestions & feedback, here or over at our forum, we try to be all over the place. We will answer what we can and when we can.

As important as it is to ask questions and provide feedback, in my opinion it is equally important to accept the answers provided and circumstances given.

Is this or any FFB issue a priority, I can safely say its one of the many we have. Updating physics, updating tire models, implement proper fuel use, improving FFB, improving track performance, adding multi class and all its features, improve setups, implement save setups, improve damage, improve sounds, improve gearbox behaviour, implement flags, better pitstops, AI improvements and the list goes on and on of things we really want to do. And I bet each and everyone has their own personal top priority/must have feature.

But we have to accept the fact that with the amount of people we are in the studio this will take a decent amount time, we do not have a large team we do not have the option to "quickly" push this out in a month, but believe me when I tell everyone inside Sector3 will bust balls to get things done.

Sorry to go slightly o/t, but I thought it was needed to explain that even though its important, its one of many important tasks we have.

I really do appreciate you coming on here and clarifying something for us. We must seem like inpatient spoilt sim racers, but i think i speak for everyone here, and that is we all want RRe to succeed and "feel" good as it has such a good FFB system underneath. Cant wait to play rre again when you get round to looking at the FFB, i really can't.

Thanks Jay

Dan out...

 

[Jay Ekkel]

Yeah we are aware, but we also have to be realistic about what we can develop each month. Throwing all eggs in one basket for a few months, will disappoint people as well, so we do try to spread our attention an gradually lift the game up to a new level step by step. Its the " can't please everyone all the time" situation every developer find himself in.

I have no worries/issues with people being impatient, that is just the nature of the beast and the game development scene as such. Internally it is pretty much the same, every developer has their own preferences on where they think we should focus on. It keeps us focussed in the end, we have made great strides over the last few months and we will continue doing that. (lets not forget summer vacations are coming up, so things will be a bit slower during that time!)

 

[Kjell Eilertsen]

Guys my feedback.

G27 user and I had the same oscillation problem and i managed to solve this by closing Logitech profiler!!!

Also try my settings, i have excellent feeling and also i cured my major issue with R3H which was the floating feeling.

I would like to hear you thoughts.

I'm just quoting Jim here because noone seemed to respond to his post, I've seen others say the same thing, close the Logitech profiler (as in fully quit it) and you'll have less problems.