Agressive AI rams me off road

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Hi,
is there anything I can do against beeing piled off road from aggressive reckless AI cars all the time?
Or should I never race with AI cars?
Piled by AI cars 4 times in 2mins.

See:
My favorite:
Code:
https://youtu.be/ym3wadd_T0w?t=114

Btw. this forum system killed all my youtube link with time reference....great.
 
In all cases it's not my fault, there's no doubt.

I play since GP1 and i like normal races.

I recently played GTR2 (september 2006 - Simbin/Sector 3) and this game has “% AI agression”.

This is the solution, each ones play with the aggression they want.

I spend a lot of money in this game and i`m very dissapointed.

I found a lot of people who complained about the same topic since 2014.

The best description (three years ago and the problem was never solved)



Apr 25, 2015


Justin Davis



I don't want to sound like I'm over exaggerating, but the single player at the moment is unplayable for me. The way the AI shunts you just drains any semblance of fun out of it.

On top of that the collision system is bonkers. The SLIGHTEST tap will send me wildly out of control. Even if I GENTLY nudge an AI from behind, I spin out.

Everybody swears this AI is the greatest, but I just do not agree. Yes, they're FAST, which is good, but that's only half the battle. They make no attempt to avoid you, and if you have a bad corner the AI will ruin your race...
 
Yeeess....
That quote is almost 3 years old. And yes, the AI was pretty bad back then.
Just like the AC AI was equally horrendous three years ago.
The biggest R3E improvement came with the Dec '17 patch which did away with the Newtons Cradle physics. No longer does a single touch punt you off the field.
(Check the WTCC Mid-Ohio vid for confirmation on that)
Since then there have been 3 (IIRC) patches further improving the AIs spatial awareness.
So referencing a post that applies to an AI that no longer exists seems a little redundant.
It's like claiming the pCars2 AI is bad based on pCars1 footage.

As for there not being any doubt it's not you who is at fault.....
I can't help noticing that there are several people voicing exactly that, doubt.
Nor can I help noticing that the combos you claimed were un-raceable have been shown to be anything but.

Not that it really matters anyway.
I mean, if you want help with your racing, there are plenty of people at RD willing to help out.
If instead you feel the need to rant against the R3E AI, I'm cool with that too.
At the end of the day, I'm not the one having problems getting good racing.
 
Thanks Lars I really appreciate your interest in the subject.

I play many hours with AC, PC2, GTR2 (games that have the ability to configure Ai aggression), F1 2017, GTL etc and I never suffered this level of aggression.

The problem with AI I have only in this game. It`s a shame, the FFB is very good.
 
More aggression....and the solution




Solution: Implement % AI aggression as in:

AC, RF2, GTR, PC2 etc etc.

I am sure that Sector 3 will implement it in the future and achieve the best simulator in the market.
 
0:03
One cannot see how close the AI was behind you, I assume very close, because the aI in Raceroom indeed is tuned to set up a fight if it gets the chance, and you are too slow for their pace in this video anyway, so naturally they are close to you, since they want to overtake ou then. You breaked quite early - too early for my taste, I probably would have slammed into you as well if I were close behind you, but different to the AI I use to drive in echelon formation in such situations, at least in MP, to avoid this - and so you left the AI not sufficient reaction time. The first mild touch pushed you to the centre of the track while the AI still had a speed excess, so it had to pick one side left or right of you, with your car covering a good amount of the track width left and right of you chances were the AI needed to touch you again, and thats what happened.

0:39-0:40
You were far to the left when the AI saw the right lane being open and so went into the gap. You then turned in (to the right) while his nose already was in the breach. Reaction times were very short. No chance to avoid collision. Tehcnically, he had a clear speed advanatge, you should not have turned in - but: it all happened quite fast. Human imperfection.

1:30
You were out of control and had left the track on the right curb, way into the green, this manouver was not just cutting over the curb: the car was almost completely off the track. Technically to the AI it was "no obstacle on the line, no car on track", and so it took the line that you tried to keep on but had just lost. You then blitzed back on track, and voila. And no, you did not take that right turn the way it should be taken. ;) You had temporarily lost control there.

1:52
AI fault, clear and simple.

GT1 is a messy class in Raceroom, it is recommended to avoid it. The cars use hopeless physics, their AI has not been adapted. Most advanced and up-to-date is GT3.

Personally, I almost never have situations like in this video. I attribute 9 out of 10 reported AI incidents to player's driving. While raceroom uses a simplified physics engine for AI cars, comared to player'S car, the odated cars still obey the basics of natural laws, and if the palyer drives so aggressively or unpredictably that the aI cannot avoid him without breaking the laws of nature, crash happens. This difference in car physics is almost impossible to observe, normally. The only game where all AI cars use the full physics suite like player'S car, is AC. But you see the same complaints with AC's AI.

In the above video: as I see it, 3 times it was player'S fault, 1 time AI's fault.

P.S. There are videos by pro driver Jan Seyffarth, in one of them he complains about sim drivers often being too aggressive with the curbs, and beign too eager to go over them. His advise: "Guys, stay away from the curbs". Using them should be the exception from the rule - not the rule. In real life racing, the team would have a clear word with you if you would eat their dampers and springs at fast rate due to avoiding no curb where possible.
 
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The Flying Hun

A lot of players complains about the same subject.

Definitely the game has a serious problem.
And also a lot of players I see in public server MP slamming into each other at every opportunity and cannot keep their cars reliably on track. Now what? Correlation? :)

Just so that you know, I tend to think the AI in Raceroom is the best on the market currently. Also, I have many people agreeing with me on that, or at least saying it is a very good AI. Now what? Problems like you demonstrated in your video, I do not have often, the occasional AI mishap, yes, but it is rare. I chose my cars accordingly, avoid certain classes, and I drive differently than you do. I often fight with AI cars in packs of two, three, four cars, bumper to bumper, door to door, without even trading light scratches on the paint. AI at 96%, that way I flow with the crowd. I also see the AI battling it out amongs themselves, sometimes I cannot overtake because I have to wait for the two or three cars settling their dispute in front of me.

When I spin out or make contact with another car, I watch it in replay afterwards. In the overwhelming majority of cases I have to admit my own responsibility for the event, it almost always was my own fault. I breaked too early. I switched lane unappropriately. I was too enthusiastic about my chances for overtaking. I went too much over the curbs. In most cases, my own loss of situational awareness had something to do with it.

Many people in MP make two mistakes, and both are lethal. First, they think everbody around them is perfect, and only waits for giving him, the player, room: "Here I come, get out of my way". And Wham! Second, they think they themselves are perfect as well, and their way of driving the car around the track is the competent way of how to do it. And often, that is just overestimation by themselves.

If you drive inconsistently, unpredictably and leave other cars no margin of errors and no reaction time to aggressive moves you do yourself, or mistakes you make, then the lacking space for errors results in - suprise surprise - lacking space of errors: in other words - Wham!

In three of the four examples you illustrated, you have nobody else than yoursel to blame for, once it was indeed the AI. As I said: GT1 is a messy class in Raceroom anyway, its not updated. Take one of the more sophisticated classes. Even if they may be slower. I mean your video looks like an arcade game, doesn't it. and GTX in Raceroom indeed is that: almost arcade.

The AI in Raceroom is amongst the most capable on the market currently. The AI in AC is fast, and reliable, but less capable to indeed setting up a real fight and clinging to it. In Raceroom, so often I thought I had beaten an AI opponent, only to see him clinging to it and hanging in, fighting back, and taking back what I just took away from him. Some weeks ago, for one third over the Nordschleife, I had one stubborn BMW almost glued to my right door, he just stayed by my side, no matter what I tried, he even accepted to go wide over curbs where you usually should not, just so that he did not need to give up, and he never touched me, not once. Of course I also accepted that i had to leave his car's chassis the space it needed to stay material, the room to breathe. :) Moral of the story: just because you think you have won a fight, does not mean you indeed have already won the fight.

Playing racesims since over 20 years, I cannot say there is another title that has given me such hair-raising, but fair duels with AI cars, like Raceroom, and to lesser degree: AC. Nascar 2003 was intense, but had rubber-band-AI.
 
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Congrats, you got both AI strength and AI aggression there! Now adapt your driving so that you can benefit from them. And choose a better car class. GT3, the Audis or the M235i, DTM17, as just some examples. Formula Junior is great, it really teaches the basics and is fun. They provide the better, closer-to-reality driving experience. Really. GTX is crap. Fast crap, yes. But crap. Raceroom's to-go-to car class, is GT3.

If you can lap, without traffic, ten laps in a row with your lap time varying only by lets say half a second or less, and always keeping the ideal line without going over the curbs or the green, and without wagging your tail - then you are on the way to being a good and reliable driver. And then you can start dancing with the AI cars around you. Just mowing the lawn with Mach 2 does not mean somebody is a good driver. He is only good at abusing a sim's characteristic features and weaknesses. With Raceroom it is like with any simulator of any genre out there: what you put into it, is what you get out of it. Put crappy own behaviour and bad habits into it, unrealistic handling - and crap is what you will get out of it.

Consistency. Situational Awareness at all times. Anticipation of bad stuff unfolding in front of you and reacting to it in time. Leaving other cars the physical space they need to exist. Patience. Differing good chances from bad ones. Knowing the track. This is what good driving is about. Then speed and lower lap times come all by themselves.

Whether you have two sliders separated for strength and aggressiveness, or not, does not change these preconditions. ;) You opened this thread by claiming that there can be no doubt that what you were about to illustrate in your video, was not your fault. Your diriving was perfect. But you are wrong. It was a lot about your driving. And this is where you have to start.

Dont take it personal, please, its not meant to be that.
 
P.S. I stumbled over some of your short videos at youtube. In some of them you have better cases to demonstrate an issue with the AI, maybe a problem with spatial awareness, thats what it looks like to me. Difficult to decide in some examples. In some other examples however I again would attribute the contact to player's driving and leaving the AI no space to breathe or no time to react.

However I wonder why these things do not happen to me this often.
 
Nano,
in your opening you quote a complaint from 2015. Thats is three years ago. I came to Raceroom in March 2015. And since then the AI has not just seen some minor tweaks only, but dramatic, complete revamps. Especially in 2016 there was one major overhaul that to me looked and felt like a complete overhaul.Another major milestone was done just mon ths ago. And then severla chnages between now and then.

I find it a bit difficult to believe that there should be one and the same issue through all these quite dramatically different versions of the AI over the past three years. this is not the AI from 2015, and not the AI from 2016 anymore. And the GT3 class has had its especially tuned again due to the recent physics changes by Alex Hodgkinson.

Maybe many people complain about it, but that does not necessarily mean they all are right. They could instead have something else in common - likely the way they aproach the game, or the way they drive. You see, using your own logic I could say that a lot of peope would not agree with you and instead would say the AI is fine, thus the AI must be fine, because it is a lot of people saying so. Would you agree? Hardly, obviously.

---

GP1 on Amiga it was here. Good times that were, but a different era, a different life... My first racing game - if one dares to call it that LOL - was Ferrari Formula One by EOA from I think 1988 or 1989, even before GP1, followed by the very first ever Test Drive...
 
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Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results.

Which also goes along with trying to talk sense to you @Nano10. You obviously refuse to consider that what you are experiencing has anything to do with you. All's I will say is that I had an awesome GT3 race last night at Portimao. I was back and forth with the top P1 and P2 cars the whole race with P4 sometimes taking advantage of my screw up. Never got hit from behind once.
 
Very disappointed with the game

Very disappointed with your driving.
#10 = you have no awareness of the car behind you and you cut across the AI's path. Would probably be called a racing incident in real life with you & the AI having a fist fight in the pits.
#11 = you brake too soon, too much.
#12 = you are s-l-o-w, however I agree the AI shouldn't have hit you that time just because you are slow.
 
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