2019 Formula One Canadian Grand Prix

[SteveCac]

That's not Vettel's advantage. Hamilton had a chance to pass Vettel on the other side and even if Hamilton didn't pass, he was then right under Vettel's rear-wing instead of 1.0-1.5s back before the incident, and on top of that Vettel would have temperarily dirty tyres. All of that is advantage Hamilton. The gap between Vettel and Hamilton went from 1.0 or 1.5 seconds to basically 0.1 seconds, that's advantage Hamilton.

Yup. He was most definitely modulating or holding throttle, not even close to full throttle or he would have been spinning up the tyres like crazy along with his revs skyrocketing. He was just trying to manage and hold the car steady the entire time.

Vettel went across the track, how could Hamilton pass on the left? If the track was a 'normal' track, without walls then Hamilton was passed, or at least have the inside for the next corner - advantage Vettel. The reduction of the gap was due to Vettels mistake, its not an unfair advantage for Hamilton.

 

[SteveCac]

If Hamilton hadn't tried to ram his car into a rapidly disappearing space and instead backed off before he was under the Ferrari then he could go left and overtake. Vettel gained no advantage, as in the rulebook an advantage in this context is gaining time or position, Vettel did neither

This is just an idiotic comment, the gap disappeared because Vettel didn't have control of his car, nothing to do with Hamilton. Hamilton had the racing line which was closed by an out of control car and braked to stop an accident - advantage Vettel, he kept his position that he was clearly going to lose due to his own mistake.

 

[ram10]

What a ridiculous strategy by Renault.

Ricardo was on soft tyres going faster than Bottas on mediums, but they pitted Ricardo and he returned to the track with a hard tyre performing slower lap times than before the pit.

Then they did the same mistake to Hulk: he was on used softs going faster than Riccardo with hard tyres. With a couple more laps Hulk would be able to pit and return ahead of Riccardo, but they pitted Hulk to put the hard tyres too and he got stuck behind Riccardo.

Then latter with their old hard tyres they were unable to hold bottas who had a fresh new hard tyre.

 

[callumjtc]

This is just an idiotic comment, the gap disappeared because Vettel didn't have control of his car, nothing to do with Hamilton. Hamilton had the racing line which was closed by an out of control car and braked to stop an accident - advantage Vettel, he kept his position that he was clearly going to lose due to his own mistake.

Personal insults do not help your arguement. Clearly no one gained an advantage. Saying Vettel gained an advantage doesn't make sense, as the gap was closed between him and Hamilton, even if Hamilton didn't get past, which he could have easily if he went left.

 

[Fat-Alfie]

By rejoining the track unsafely and by blocking Hamilton, Vettel didn't lose first place - that was his advantage.

 

[callumjtc]

By rejoining the track unsafely and by blocking Hamilton, Vettel didn't lose first place - that was his advantage.

That's twisting the FIA's definition they apply for leaving the track and gaining an advantage, as they use either gaining time or gaining track position.

 

[Spinelli]

By rejoining the track unsafely and by blocking Hamilton, Vettel didn't lose first place - that was his advantage.

He didn't purposely rejoin unsafely. The rejoining unsafely rule is supposed to be for when people have control over their car not to rejoin on the racing line which is obviously dangerous. This isn't that situation, this was a car loosing control due to hard racing and then regaining control once he ended up back on the track at the racing line. Big difference.

Mario Andretti said exactly what I'm trying to say.

"Any of the stewards ever raced at the front in F1? Didn’t watch the race.. have now seen the 'incident'.
Mental penalty."
- Mark Webber

"That’s ridiculous 5 seconds penalty, Seb did well not to hit the wall. NO GRIP ON GRASS !
No room on track there. Great driving from Lewis."
- Nigel Mansell

"What’s Seb supposed to do? Crazy ,the car stepped out. At that point he was a passenger."
- Nigel Mansell

"I think the function of the stewards is to penalize flagrantly unsafe moves not honest mistakes as result of hard racing. What happened at #CanadaGp is not acceptable at this level of our great sport."
- Mario Andretti

"my observation on Vettel rejoining: his helmet moved to look into mirror only after steering correction! that he slid that far is laws of physics. No space for Lewis is name of game with street tracks. What happened to #LetThemRace ? Was it sketchy? yes! a penalty? not in my view"
- Alex Wurz

"Tough result for F1.
I can see it both ways.
FIA are following the rule book that you can’t rejoin by going straight to the racing line but poor choice for the sport.
All drivers know Vettel could have not gone back to power and joined safely on the inside."
- Max Chilton

 

[Michel Bélisle]

Unsafe re-enter to the track. The grass was not wet, it did not make is tyres lose grip on re-entering the track. He dangerously closed the door because he knew Hamilton was trying to get past him at that moment and it was is only course of action. The rules are the rules. Well done race stewards. The nasty German got what he deserved. And another good win for Lewis who forced Vettel into making the mistake in the first place by applying great pressure which the German couldn't handle.

I have a hard time understanding this argument. The track was in the 40 degree Celsius range. The tyres were hot so if you go off track on the grass, the tyres will collect grass. Then, at this point, driving the car is similar to driving on ice.

Hamilton did not deviate from his usual racing line. The only thing he did was lift the foot slightly as to prevent rear ending Vettel. Vettel never put Hamilton in danger since Vettel was in front of Hamilton the whole time.

 

[callumjtc]

I have a hard time understanding this argument. The track was in the 40 degree Celsius range. The tyres were hot so if you go off track on the grass, the tyres will collect grass. Then, at this point, driving the car is similar to driving on ice.

Hamilton did not deviate from his usual racing line. The only thing he did was lift the foot slightly as to prevent rear ending Vettel. Vettel never put Hamilton in danger since Vettel was in front of Hamilton the whole time.

Ah no, you don't understand, you see the grass at this corner has some magical properties which gives 3x the amount of grip tarmac does, that Vettel knew about, and was trying to cut the course! When Vettel rejoined having lost time, and his tires were now fully gripped up and of course fully in control as soon as his front tires touched the tarmac, he panicked and tried to dump Hamilton into the wall in order to win! Just classic hot head Vettel if you ask me

 

[Trezoitao38]

Too many people driving GT3 slow cars on racing simulations that dont know anything about the situation.

Try this: a mistake on variant Villeneuve at Imola with a fast F1 car and see what happens.

Probably not the best example because it has a large area and the corners of Variant are far compared to Montreal situation. But, when you make a mistake on these situations you dont have full control of the car, the speed is high, more than 200 km/h. Dont compare with last chicane on Suzuka or Monaco, because is way slower and is not grass or gravel.

 

[Andy_J]

I have a hard time understanding this argument. The track was in the 40 degree Celsius range. The tyres were hot so if you go off track on the grass, the tyres will collect grass. Then, at this point, driving the car is similar to driving on ice.

Hamilton did not deviate from his usual racing line. The only thing he did was lift the foot slightly as to prevent rear ending Vettel. Vettel never put Hamilton in danger since Vettel was in front of Hamilton the whole time.

What makes you think there was loose freshly uncollected grass clippings there? What makes you think his tyres were covered in grass? And the rules are the rules. Unsafe re-entry. End of.
Doesn't look like much grass on his tyres to me in this picture taken just after he went across the track.

 

[chrillgrill]

What makes you think there was loose freshly uncollected grass clippings there? What makes you think his tyres were covered in grass? And the rules are the rules. Unsafe re-entry. End of.
Doesn't look like much grass on his tyres to me in this picture taken just after he went across the track.
View attachment 309838

Maybe the fact that his tires were covered in grass as shown in the picture you posted. And this is when he's already back on the racing line, it was worse immediately after re-entry

 

[Michel Bélisle]

As I watched the race and on the multiple replays afterwards, I see Vettel fish tailing the back end of his car, trying to regain control.

I guess that there is two ways to look at this incident:

1. Some people judge that Vettel was responsible for going off track in the first place and therefore, if he struggled to get back on track this is is fault as well.
2. Others, see the incident as a driver going off track and working hard at coming back on track without hitting the wall.

I believe that option 2. better reflects the situation.

 

[callumjtc]

What makes you think there was loose freshly uncollected grass clippings there? What makes you think his tyres were covered in grass? And the rules are the rules. Unsafe re-entry. End of.
Doesn't look like much grass on his tyres to me in this picture taken just after he went across the track.
View attachment 309838

Ah I see the issue, you were watching in 240p! Switch too a higher resolution, zoom in and take a look at the same picture

 

[Andy_J]

Maybe the fact that his tires were covered in grass as shown in the picture you posted. And this is when he's already back on the racing line, it was worse immediately after re-entry

I can't see any grass

 

[Andy_J]

Ah I see the issue, you were watching in 240p! Switch too a higher resolution, zoom in and take a look at the same picture

Don't be a silly boy.

 

[callumjtc]

Don't be a silly boy.

Oof, seriously though you can see the grass and debris on his tires right?

 

[Andy_J]

Oof, seriously though you can see the grass and debris on his tires right?

Oof seriously No I cannot. I see blisters and debris. Look in my opinion, he came back onto the track in a an unsafe manner and deliberately shut the door on Lewis.

 

[callumjtc]

Oof seriously No I cannot. I see blisters and debris. Look in my opinion, he came back onto the track in a an unsafe manner and deliberately shut the door on Lewis.

As a fan of racing, F1 and fair competition, I respectfully disagree

 

[T_rac3]

I'm sure we are all had the same stance on penalty if the penalty targeted our favorite driver

Nah, Hamilton is my favorite driver and still, I believe Vettel don't deserve the penalty. No matter whom we like, we all want a good and fair race.