Would You Race Fictional Cars & Tracks, And Why Not?

Rodger Davies said:

Heck, if there's anyone out there who hasn't played FatAlfie's incredible Fonteny for Assetto Corsa

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The track is fictional but it's based on real roads in the vicinity of the village Brassy.
And I fully agree that it's a masterpiece.
This year David released Battenbergring which is another masterpiece!

I have no problem racing on fictional tracks. I'm currently enjoying old Forza games, and the fictional tracks there are quite fun. In Assetto Corsa, I also enjoy racing in fictional places. Other than that, I have fond memories of original tracks from Gran Turismo.

Completely fictional cars can be quite fun as well, though usually "fictional" cars in games are just real cars with changed minor details.

I am fine with fictional tracks in Rock'n Roll Racing, or Mario Kart. But I play racing games for motorsport immersion, for the love of cars and to get closer to what I see on TV. Fictional stuff does not bring me more immersion.

Absolutely. I actually prefer well made, realistic, fictional content in general.

It's also what I (try) to create for myself.

Jimlaad43 said:

We used the short circuit, but the GP circuit itself looks good. It does have some issues with Shaders, in that if the weather is wrong, the circuit is very bright and shiny a bit too much. However the layout itself is excellent.

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So it could indeed use some more... "investment", just like I want the others on rF2

Totally fine with fictional content, but unless it brings something of its own to the table, it's better if it's a realistic adaptation. Most of Gran Turismo's nonexistent touring and race cars fit that bill, while adding to categories like GTE or GT1 where licensing (or options in general) might be limited otherwise.

Oh man if just someone did create this one in one of the modern sims.
I have used hours in the GTP mod to NR2003 on this track.

CatsAreTheWorstDogs: And its even more fun if you have been to Paris in RL

BrunoBæ said:

Oh man if just someone did create this one in one of the modern sims.
I have used hours in the GTP mod to NR2003 on this track.

CatsAreTheWorstDogs: And its even more fun if you have been to Paris in RL

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only if it's possible to fall off one of the bridges and virtually drown...

Fictional tracks, yes., because there are not enough open road cars in sim-racing and I don't really care if they exist in real life or not. Fictional cars, no, because there are already too many real cars not simulated or very poorly simulated and we don't really need fictional cars.

yes

I've done this in the past and likely will in the future... just pick up a Gran Turismo game and race one of their 'old' LM cars, or perhaps one of the plethora of 'Vision' cars that litter the game now.
But there's nothing like getting into an E-Type or even a Ford Anglia and firing an hour or so round Goodwood or Brands hatch, that to me is satisfying.

Djadania said:

Djadania said:

Fictional tracks, i think are cool. Gran Turismo, BeamNG and Assetto mods do it well, and i have enjoyed all of them.
Fictional cars on the other hand, I'm not sure. I dont mind them that much (using BeamNG as another example, those are great), but the main thing is that i feel like the engineering of a real car is not in it, or at least not yet. You could just give a car 10000 horsepower, boom. "Fast Car McGee".
I prefer driving real cars, but if there was some way to put actual engineering into the cars instead of just putting in some numbers (i know its not that simple, but just to make a point) i would accept fictional cars more. If not that, there should be regulations to making them for specific classes, or something like that. Maximum downforce, power to weight levels, standard gearboxes, but it should still be free enough. Fictional cars mean that someone with decent coding skills could make a car for a class, if they wanted to compete. You cant just enter GT3 to get in ACC, if you wanted to it would take

EXAMPLE 2: Dream Car Builder 3d challenges. These are done similarly to Automation Challenges, but they are far more complex. They require knowledge into car suspension, steering, how to build chassis, aerodynamics, etc. These are very difficult. I have attempted to compete in one before. I made a car, but it drove so badly that i never entered it. That tells you enough.

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d to compete. You cant just enter GT3 to get in ACC, if you wanted to it would take a lot of money.

Fictional cars have potential to me. If they are done correctly, it could end up in there coming similar competition online. But for much less money, or free! Im pretty sure many people have dreamt of making an F1 team, bu

EDIT 1: Thought i would give some examples of how this would work, and how it has worked.
EXAMPLE 1: Automation Challenges. These use Automation The Car Company Tycoon, and people send in their car files to enter. I do these myself, so i know how much work it is, but the final result is almost always worth it. I use BeamNG for these, so all the cars are driven in a sort of time attack way, and points are rewarded. These require decent engineering knowledge, and you cant just make a 10000 "Fast Car Mcgee". You could try to, but you will probably end up with a car that drives so badly that it gets DNF'ed.

EXAMPLE 2: Dream Car Builder 3d challenges. These are done similarly to Automation Challenges, but they are far more complex. They require knowledge into car suspension, steering, how to build chassis, aerodynamics, etc. These are very difficult. I have attempted to compete in one before. I made a car, but it drove so badly that i never entered it. That tells you enough.

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Is there a site, Discord, or whatever that runs these challenges?

Thanks for mentioning Dream Car Builder -- I hadn't heard of it.

While we pretend to drive real cars and tell ourselves that they're accurate simulations, in reality it'd be nearly impossible to model any car for which detailed data is not available. That includes all the classics I love. I know there's no way to model a particular car as it raced on a particular set of tires on a specific day in, say, 1967. It probably behaved differently from race to race! And a car at a historic race will never be the car is was thanks to additional safety gear, modern tires, etc.

So all cars are sort of "fictional", though we happily pretend otherwise.

I want to race were real pilots race,you can't have a real driving simulation on a fake track,it is ok for arcade games,some pilots that race on simulators and real track can say how much real is the feeling,they practique on their sims before race.

I enjoy fictional tracks, have them in every sim, as long as they are realistic (no "Motorific Torture Tracks").

A classic, originally made for GPL but converted to nearly every sim since, is Machwerk; eight miles of German country roads based on a real area, it is fun in anything from a Spitfire to an F1 car.

Fictional cars? To a degree all sim cars are fictional. What is the inertia of a 2015 F1 Ferrari? What is the coefficient of drag for a '75 BMW? What are the actual slip angles and grip values of any real tires? Such data is rarely, if ever, divulged by manufacturers or teams. So the sim devs must make educated (we hope) guesses at many parameters. But I can enjoy a truly fictional automobile if it is realistic; if it isn't then it is an arcade racer not a sim, though arcade racers can be fun also. I have created numerous "what if" cars just for fun. What if Ford had been allowed to race the GT MkIV with the 427 SOHC engine? Perhaps a TR3 with a Rover V8, 5spd, and IRS.

I have no problem at all with fictional tracks, as long as they are realistic. My all-time favourite track is Mid Field from GT, and Tyrone's version of it in Assetto Corsa is my most-driven track. Real tracks are often restricted by the terrain, or were converted from old airfields or public roads, and that dictates their layout. Also, safety concerns mean that some features are not practical, like flyovers. Fictional tracks are not constrained in the same way so they can be challenging, interesting and fun in ways that real tracks can't.

In some ways I feel the same about fictional cars, as long as they keep to the 'spirit'. Pessio Garage's 'Porknose' is a perfect example of a fictional car done right. It doesn't represent any real-world car, but it captures the feeling of a classic open-wheel Formula car from the 60s combined with modern suspension and engine. A field of them blasting around the banking of the High Speed Ring is an impressive spectacle!

An interesting compromise is to build a fictional track based on real-world scenery. There's an AC circuit called Cannock Chase, which is a real place near where I live, but there isn't a track there - only mountain bike trails. As far as I know, the designer has used real elevation data and built their fictional track around it. In theory, someone could go and build that track for real because the location actually exists. You can do the same with cars - rather than building an outright fantasy car, build one to an existing ruleset - for example, a GT3 Jaguar F-Type. Or a completely fictional manufacturer and body shape, built to GT3 specs. As others have pointed out, almost all of the available cars are 'fictional' to some extent, especially the old ones. Who REALLY knows what a Ferrari 250 GTO is like, flat out around the Nordschleife?

Where do 'Classic' tracks fall in this? Most sims feature historic layouts of tracks like Spa and Monza. Those layouts no longer exist and you can't drive on them IRL, so are they technically 'Fictional'? Driving on one would be 'unrealistic', and wouldn't bring any 'immersion' - would it? I really don't feel that the question of 'immersion' is valid in this debate. I've never driven around the real Spa, and never will, so it makes no difference to the sense of realism or my level of immersion whether I'm driving around this week's layout or one from 1966. The tracks might go in different directions, but they still feel equally 'real' (or 'unrealistic') to me, and I think that's the important thing. Does it 'feel' realistic?

As a final thought, there is a possibility that one of the most popular fictional tracks from GT - Deep Forest Raceway - is actually based on a real circuit that closed in the 1960s. If that's true, it really puts this debate into a different light.

BrunoBæ said:

Oh man if just someone did create this one in one of the modern sims.
I have used hours in the GTP mod to NR2003 on this track.

CatsAreTheWorstDogs: And its even more fun if you have been to Paris in RL

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I did not know about that track, it seems a nice one. There was a similar track for GTR2, even simulating the old Paris' pavement on some parts of the track (the one covered by temporary asphalt for the e-prix), it was an amazing fictional track too, thank you for the reminder!

Jean-Pierre Sarti said:

Is there a site, Discord, or whatever that runs these challenges?

Thanks for mentioning Dream Car Builder -- I hadn't heard of it.

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It got deleted, im stupid. What did i expect? Anyways, the automation discourse forums have challenges there, though i cant post the link here. DCB also has a discord, though i also cant post the link here.

There are many players with different preferences and it is right to find the things we like because the final goal is to have fun then if one likes it real or imaginary is just a detail

Yes to both if they look and feel realistic. I sim race because I love to race in real cars/karts on a real tracks. Sims that give give me the same feeling, regardless if fictional or not, are fun.