What USB protocol do racing wheels use for force feedback?

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The USB specification defines the "physical interface device" standard for force feedback devices, which is an extension of the already extremely versatile HID device class. But I have noticed that peripheral manufacturers have a nasty tendency of not using established standards and rather configuring their devices to only work with proprietary drivers. Is this the case for wheels as well?

I expect most wheels to expose a secondary proprietary interface for configuration, but I'm not concerned with that one.

I'm asking because I'm looking into the possibility of building my own sim racing gear for fun. Since I don't have a wheel that I can prod at over the command line, it's difficult to even know where to start my research. Things would be a lot easier if I had some listings of device descriptors to base my work on.

 

[GagarynGaribaldi]

The USB specification defines the "physical interface device" standard for force feedback devices, which is an extension of the already extremely versatile HID device class. But I have noticed that peripheral manufacturers have a nasty tendency of not using established standards and rather configuring their devices to only work with proprietary drivers. Is this the case for wheels as well?

I expect most wheels to expose a secondary proprietary interface for configuration, but I'm not concerned with that one.

I'm asking because I'm looking into the possibility of building my own sim racing gear for fun. Since I don't have a wheel that I can prod at over the command line, it's difficult to even know where to start my research. Things would be a lot easier if I had some listings of device descriptors to base my work on.

Start here - https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/uwp/gaming/racing-wheel-and-force-feedback

Looking forward to seeing your build.

 

[blekenbleu]

I guess more force feedback devices are based on traditional joystick than xbox controller API
DirectInput Force Feedback

vJoy implements force feedback,
making it relatively easy to emulate a joystick with force feedback

 

[GagarynGaribaldi]

I guess more force feedback devices are based on traditional joystick than xbox controller API
DirectInput Force Feedback

DirectInput is deprecated and no longer supported, replaced by GameInput across all Microsoft platforms. Legacy stuff may still be using DirectInput like you say but the deprecation was made a while ago - over ten years.

 

[Neilski]

DirectInput is deprecated and no longer supported, replaced by GameInput across all Microsoft platforms. Legacy stuff may still be using DirectInput like you say but the deprecation was made a while ago - over ten years.

Well...
The G27 (on my desk) apparently first hit the market in 2010
Also the deprecation of DI back in 2011, which may be what you're thinking of, was only for keyboards and mice, according to Wikipedia.
I also have it in my head (potentially incorrectly!) that GameInput is quite new (maybe 5 years old?) and I am unable to remember what (if anything) came in between DirectInput and GameInput for mainstream generic gaming devices. (XInput doesn't count, obvs, cos it's only for Xbox controllers. I have tinkered with RawInput but have no idea how it fits into the timeline.)
Edit: DI is kinda yuck to program btw.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

Was it like DirectInput, XInput and now the latest and greatest GameInput
They also had RacingWheel API for UWP.
Almost everything high end, dd wheels, pedals, handbrakes, need DirectInput anyway. Glad they are adding it to Forza Motorsport (finally).

 

[blekenbleu]

the latest and greatest GameInput

GameInput is arguably M$ conceding defeat for Xinput,
which lacks support by other gaming platforms,
with GameInput nominally embracing and extending DI:
"GameInput is a functional superset of all legacy input APIs
—XInput, DirectInput, Raw Input, Human Interface Device (HID), and WinRT APIs—
in addition to adding new features of its own. "

 

[Neilski]

Well like I noted above, I reckon XInput was never a replacement for DI, because it was for controllers, and only controllers, so I don't think it would ever have been credible to attempt to shoehorn a wheel+pedals into an XInput device.
GameInput sounds interesting but the last time I took a serious look at it, I backed away because there is so much software out there that builds on DI (and XI), which I'd have had to essentially forget about. I guess it's the future though.

Would be interested to hear from people with wheels newer than my G27 (not hard! ) about what API they use.

 

[blekenbleu]

what API they use

Without Sim Commander intervening and exercising its proprietary API,
SimXperience AccuForce works fine as generic DI. After running Sim Commander
long enough to download a useful "cloud tuning" configuration into it,
I now use AccuForce without it.