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[Coffer]

Then why not give another penalty on qualy laps. Inconsistency is again the issue, not the fact someone went over a marking

Because Verstappen gained nothing from it, having qualified 6th, a whole second ahead of Ocon. And no, once again, that track extension for no actual gain is in no way similar to corner cutting to gain a position where it otherwise would not have happened, so there is no inconsistency. You're oversimplifying the rules.

 

[ears]

lol clearly you missed it

Oh no! Am I being dumb again? What did I clearly miss?

Sorry, you're going to have to explain this one to me as I have clearly missed it. Whatever it is.

 

[Coffer]

Oh no! Am I being dumb again? What did I clearly miss?

Sorry, you're going to have to explain this one to me as I have clearly missed it. Whatever it is.

Don't give him any unnecessary attention. He's trolling and running a joke into the ground.

 

[Enzo Fazzi]

Oh no! Am I being dumb again? What did I clearly miss?

Sorry, you're going to have to explain this one to me as I have clearly missed it. Whatever it is.

@Andy Jackson edited a lot of his post, removing most (hilarious) errors.

 

[ears]

@Andy Jackson edited a lot of his post, removing most (hilarious) errors.

Ah right.

I thought it was something to do with the random screen grab he linked to, that it appears he misinterpreted, which drew him to the conclusion that the posts I'd made were 'dumb'.

I watched lap 49 of the race last night. Sainz never overtook Ocon in that move. He didn't gain a lasting advantage. It was not a precedent, it was not comparable.

Yeah Andy posted something and he made a factual mistake. Happens to all of us. And he said 'yeah I was wrong'. I respect him for that.

@Mike Davies misinterpreted some random screen grab and used it to fling personal insults around when the only person he made look silly was himself.

But if I am missing something here Mike, I'd like to know what it is.

 

[gamer19]

https://www.formula1.com/en/video/2017/10/Race_Highlights_-_USA_2017.html

But... didn't Sainz done same as Max, passing Perez with all four wheels outside of the white line and get away with murder ? Illegal overtake I mean.
Watch it from ~3:13.

 

[Coffer]

https://www.formula1.com/en/video/2017/10/Race_Highlights_-_USA_2017.html

But... didn't Sainz done same as Max, passing Perez with all four wheels outside of the white line and get away with murder ? Illegal overtake I mean.
Watch it from ~3:13.

Same as with every other track extension - it's within the limits set by the stewards before the race. Again, they discussed this with the drivers.

Sainz also got the move done before that so he gained nothing from it, as the wide approach compromised his exit.

 

[gamer19]

That's your opinion, however... mine is that he DID gain advantage from that off.
And I actually love Sainz much more than Perez so I really don't feel like I'm biased here.

 

[apex11]

It certainly wouldn't surprise me, but then I'm surprised they felt the need to do that seeing as the Mercedes has been far and away the (much) faster car this second half of the season, especially after the oil burn ban. Particularly with Vettel's car failures and Verstappen running into him, if the rumors are true, then I reckon they should've already given Bottas whatever upgrades they could at COTA, because now he has almost no chance of finishing 2nd in the championship.

The minute Lewis wraps up WDC they will get Bottas's car back to where it should be and go for 2nd place in WDC.
Notice that since Hungry when Lewis let Bottas back Lewis has had the better run / car...
Lets be honest here, its no secret all this "engine mode" malarkey, its not hard to lower an engines BHP therefore meaning a driver in 'same' car can actually be in anything but...
Bottas isn't as good as Lewis, but even Bottas should be getting that Merc to 2nd..

 

[apex11]

The Philip Island race was superb wasn't it?

Even by MotoGP standards which is about as high as it can get anyway, yes, stunning race, as always from Moto3 upwards.
I was watching some on board footage of Lewis and its far far too easy for the F1 guys, the car does pretty much everything for them, tiny wheel inputs, then you see Marquez literally wrestling with the Honda in physics deifying shapes....insane.

 

[Tobiman]

Even by MotoGP standards which is about as high as it can get anyway, yes, stunning race, as always from Moto3 upwards.
I was watching some on board footage of Lewis and its far far too easy for the F1 guys, the car does pretty much everything for them, tiny wheel inputs, then you see Marquez literally wrestling with the Honda in physics deifying shapes....insane.

Motorcycle racing is by default more daring than motor-racing but I won't take anything from the guys in F1. To bring out the best out of these cars isn't something anyone can do especially given their cornering speeds. Current Moto GP lap times barely exceeds that of GT3 cars despite their much higher top speeds.

 

[Andy_J]

Motorcycle racing is by default more daring than motor-racing but I won't take anything from the guys in F1. To bring out the best out of these cars isn't something anyone can do especially given their cornering speeds. Current Moto GP lap times barely exceeds that of GT3 cars despite their much higher top speeds.

Amazing when you think how safe and protected the Tin top driver is compared to the bike racer. But yes you are right. Cars have a lot more grip too. But I agree with @totheapex Bike racers are a different breed compared to car racers. A lot braver too. But I take nothing from F1 drivers. They are super skilled too. Just not on the same level in my opinion.

 

[Tobiman]

It certainly wouldn't surprise me, but then I'm surprised they felt the need to do that seeing as the Mercedes has been far and away the (much) faster car this second half of the season, especially after the oil burn ban. Particularly with Vettel's car failures and Verstappen running into him, if the rumors are true, then I reckon they should've already given Bottas whatever upgrades they could at COTA, because now he has almost no chance of finishing 2nd in the championship.

I dunno. Vettel really had a chance of winning the WDC before Singapore and the events thereafter happened. He missed two races both of which he had a good chance of scoring podium points. He made a good recovery in Malaysia after starting from the back but the damage was already done.

As far as pace, the Mercedes does have the edge in a straight line, ever so slightly, but the Ferrari is quite a bit more taut and kinder on its tires. The red bulls are even matching their race pace now than at the beginning of the season and is one of the reasons Max extended his contract. If the Mercedes is really as fast as you are implying, the WDC would have been over before COTA.

 

[apex11]

Amazing when you think how safe and protected the Tin top driver is compared to the bike racer. But yes you are right. Cars have a lot more grip too. But I agree with @totheapex Bike racers are a different breed compared to car racers. A lot braver too. But I take nothing from F1 drivers. They are super skilled too. Just not on the same level in my opinion.

Yes i was just comparing that you can REALLY see the difference a rider can as you see them moving, current F1 cars just look like cars, you cant see the driver, old school F1 and even the Mansell / Senna era you can see how much their head stuck out it looks weird now!

But yes for sure both skillful.
I love ALL motorsport.

 

[Patrick van der Meulen]

Amazing when you think how safe and protected the Tin top driver is compared to the bike racer. But yes you are right. Cars have a lot more grip too. But I agree with @totheapex Bike racers are a different breed compared to car racers. A lot braver too. But I take nothing from F1 drivers. They are super skilled too. Just not on the same level in my opinion.

I think the differences between the top F1 drivers and the middle of the road drivers are too small. Yes, there was a timegap of around 1 second and later down to less between Jolyon Palmer and Nico Hulkenberg. But if it really would be more about the driver than the car, that gap should be either much smaller or much larger.

And motorcycle racers are nuts when compared to their four wheel colleagues .

But the forces they endure are totally different which makes it really hard to compare. But the motorcycle racers certainly all got very large balls made out of steel!

 

[apex11]

I dunno. Vettel really had a chance of winning the WDC before Singapore and the events thereafter happened. He missed two races both of which he had a good chance of scoring podium points. He made a good recovery in Malaysia after starting from the back but the damage was already done.

As far as pace, the Mercedes does have the edge in a straight line, ever so slightly, but the Ferrari is quite a bit more taut and kinder on its tires. The red bulls are even matching their race pace now than at the beginning of the season and is one of the reasons Max extended his contract. If the Mercedes is really as fast as you are implying, the WDC would have been over before COTA.

Well Merc have already wrapped up the most important one which is WCC, fans don't care about that but the big bods at Merc certainly do, generally if you win the WCC one of your drivers will win the WDC, but yes Merc has been the car to be in for the last 4 seasons now.
I do wonder what would of happened to Lewis had he stayed at McLaren, judging how he reacts when things go wrong i think he'd of topped himself.

Something Button once said at Spa in the McLaren has always stuck with me, he said that his Qual lap was the best lap he'd ever done around Spa as for the car he was in he was over the limit and 200% and he was like 17th or something.
Basically speaking some of the best performances i.e. on the edge of limits might just be from guys stuck in poor cars al la Alonso whilst the ones getting the praise are driving at 95% but still able to win such is the car advantage...this has been Merc and Lewis...

 

[LeSunTzu]

That nonsense about Bottas' car is ridiculous. Why on earth would Mercedes run with a bad car??? Is it so hard to believe that Hamilton now gets the car to work better than Bottas?

 

[Tobiman]

That nonsense about Bottas' car is ridiculous. Why on earth would Mercedes run with a bad car??? Is it so hard to believe that Hamilton now gets the car to work better than Bottas?

It's all speculation.

 

[Tobiman]

Well Merc have already wrapped up the most important one which is WCC, fans don't care about that but the big bods at Merc certainly do, generally if you win the WCC one of your drivers will win the WDC, but yes Merc has been the car to be in for the last 4 seasons now.
I do wonder what would of happened to Lewis had he stayed at McLaren, judging how he reacts when things go wrong i think he'd of topped himself.

Something Button once said at Spa in the McLaren has always stuck with me, he said that his Qual lap was the best lap he'd ever done around Spa as for the car he was in he was over the limit and 200% and he was like 17th or something.
Basically speaking some of the best performances i.e. on the edge of limits might just be from guys stuck in poor cars al la Alonso whilst the ones getting the praise are driving at 95% but still able to win such is the car advantage...this has been Merc and Lewis...

I genuinely feel that Vettel had a very good chance of winning this years WDC if not for the events that occurred in the past 4 races. Vettel had the advantage going into Singapore and blew it. To make matters worse Malaysia happened and Fuji just added insult to injury.

What would have happened to Lewis at Mclaren is the same as what is happening to Alonso at Mclaren or Vettel in 2014 at Red Bull. Mclaren could have been a serious contender for WCC these past 4 years but they failed to secure Mercedes as an engine supplier.

 

[gamer19]

That nonsense about Bottas' car is ridiculous. Why on earth would Mercedes run with a bad car??? Is it so hard to believe that Hamilton now gets the car to work better than Bottas?

I agree. Why whould risk this much, points and scandal both wise ?
Not glad to say it loud but I feel Bottas isn't exactly on Lewis level and even if they give them two cloned cars, Lewis would win. I'm sure that at Merc they feel the same, so why risking all the points, wouldn't they prefer if Botttas was able to hold of Vettel for at least 19 races ?