• "Mwoah" - Kimi Räikkönen
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Dear Guest. Follow RaceDepartment on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, Twitch, Steam and YouTube.

Steering Lock & Ratio buggered?

Discussion in 'Automobilista' started by Spinelli, Sep 12, 2017.

  1. Spinelli

    Spinelli

    Messages:
    636
    Ratings:
    +154
    I noticed not much variability in my AMS install (up to date). Many cars have the same "generic" steering lock as-well as overall steering ratio. Some examples (didn't check DLC or F1 cars):

    900/32
    Opala Stock Car 86
    Opala Stock Car
    Camaro
    Mini Challenge
    Lancer RS
    Lancer R
    Formula Vee

    180/20
    kart 125cc direct bodywork
    kart 125cc direct
    kart 125cc shifter
    kart race
    kart rental
    bodywork

    450/20
    Brazilian V8 Stock Cars (all models/years)
    Copa Montana
    Formula Truck (all models)
    Metalmoro MR18
    Copa Petrobas De Marcas (all models)

    540/24
    Porsche
    ARC Camaro
    Formula Vee Dirt

    360/18
    Formula 3 F301
    Formula 3 F309
    Super V8


    All those cars in each group have the exact, identical steering lock as well as exact overall steering ratio (except the F-Vee Dirt by a tiny bit). It doesn't seem right to me. For example, a Copa Montana, Formula Truck, BV8, Metalmoro MR18, and Copa Petrobas all have the exact same steering lock as-well as overall steering ratio?



    Not enough steering lock and/or a too fast overall steering ratio? Some examples:
    - Porsche: 540/24 - Real Porsche 911 GT racecars generally only have 540 degrees of steering lock?
    - Porsche: 540/24 - Steering ratio of 11.25? Are the steering racks really generally this fast?
    - Brazilian V8s (2015 and 2017): 450/20 - BV8s generally only run 450 degrees?
    - Super V8: Aussie V8s generally use around 360 degrees? This one is most certainly wrong.
    - Super V8: Steering ratio of 10.0? Really? That seems way too fast.




    P.S. I know cars can be adjusted in real life and in game but these default values seem very generic (too many cars set to identical values) and also with a lot of cars seemingly having too fast overall steering ratios.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2017
    • Agree Agree x 1
  2. CMGARAGE

    CMGARAGE
    Staff Premium

    Messages:
    430
    Ratings:
    +219
    The reason they seem generic is because they are generic by design.

    As a general rule of thumb

    900/32 for road car or road-derived racing/touring
    180/20 for Karts (Superkarts may differ as these are designed to race on full circuits IRL)
    450/20 for modern, purpose built Touring, GT/Sportscar and Prototypes
    360/18 for dedicated open wheelers

    Unlike rfactor 2, that has updated code to allow the ratio to be locked to 'special' values, AMS can only default to a range of values determined in each cars .hdv file. There should be enough flexibility for you to achieve a real world value for what you're trying to simulate.

    I'd rather not have to google the steering ratio, rotation and lock values of every track, car and series I race in so I'm happy with the approach Reiza have at the moment. :)
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. Paulo Gomes

    Paulo Gomes

    Messages:
    357
    Ratings:
    +191
    I really think that steering lock and ratio is big part of simulation, because when using general values or unrealistic ones, it takes away a bit of each car dna.
    I always try use real values, but is really hard to find good reliable information in the internet...
    For example, for the superv8 I use 450º rotation and 16 lock. For the 450º is possible to see a full lock from Jamie Whincup in this video, and for the 16º lock in this video. Then I play with the front toe depending on the track, usually from -0.60 to -1.20.

    Some information about f1's : "Typically, a Formula 1 car's front wheels have about 15 degrees of steering angle. But in Monaco you need at least 20 degrees - and as much as 22 if you want the driver to be able to dive up the inside of someone at some of the tight corners, such as Loews."

    The stock car v8's in real life seems to have a very big steering rotation or low rack, copa the marcas and copa montana are also the same case, so I use almost full steerting wheel rotation available.

    Caterhams with fast steering rack are 1.93 turns lock-to-lock (694,8º), and I would say about 28º to 30º lock. The bonus for g27 users, is that the origninal steering wheel is exactly the same size as a real caterham ;)

    I guess that for someone to go full realistic, would need the correct steering wheel size for different cars, and as @fortyfivekev said in another thread " Reiza are trying to make the cars in AMS controllable and fun as well as being reasonably realistic"
    But one thing is for sure I can't really understand how some of the best times in automobilista are 360º with 24 lock in a f1, that feels 5x more direct than a kart...
     
    • Like Like x 1
  4. Paddler

    Paddler

    Messages:
    61
    Ratings:
    +8
    Also, if I use a too direct steering input, then the ffb feeling changes considerably to the worse.
     
  5. Spinelli

    Spinelli

    Messages:
    636
    Ratings:
    +154
    Reiza said most of the ratios are a generally close number and that some of them are compromised for low-end wheels (cars set to faster overall steering ratios/speeds IE: more sensitive and "touchy").

    For example, I'm very skeptical about the 70s Opala, 80s Opala, 200x/201x Camaro (roadcar), Mini Challenge, Lancer RS, Lancer R, and Formula Vee all generally running an identical overal steering ratio/speed in real life.

    AMS works good enough with the steering lock and rotation settings. Updated code so that we can change the steering lock while automatically keeping the same overall steering ratio/speed would be cool but not that important and not what I'm talking about (I don't mind calculating that myself based on the default steering ratio/speed). i simply mean more realistic default overall steering ratios.

    Exactly, that's why I'd like more accurate ones: so we don't have to google them. By the way, you don't need to search for steering ratio/speed, rotation, and lock for every track, car, and series. An accurate overall steering ratio for each car is all that's needed for the most part.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2017
  6. simracedriver25

    simracedriver25

    Messages:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1
    @ Paulo Gomes. Very helpfull infos! thank you, perhaps you have a very nice FFB setting for the g27 too, could you share your knowledge on the matter pls? (if not allready done)
     
    • Like Like x 1