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So......lets talk AI?

Discussion in 'RaceRoom Racing Experience' started by Msportdan, Sep 16, 2014.

  1. Msportdan

    Msportdan
    @ Simberia @Simberia

    So firstly I want to say good job on the AI (so far) suppose im worrying that you will ruin the AI like what AC has done to its AI. But to be fair simbin have always done a competent ai. I think theyre good they overtake you (unlike cms f1) theyre quite quick even on low 90s level. I would like to see them better RF2 aI.

    However maybe we could just talk about points about the AI and what you would like to see, or how they perform.

    *I would like to see them defend a tight corner (hairpin) if your right behind I like them to close the door on the inside. (anticipate your out breaking move)

    * Not get bunched up that sometimes happens. when accident occurs I think?!

    What do you think? had a good moment with them. ?
     
  2. Mainly punted off the track - they will dive down the inside from 4 or 5 car lengths.
    They sometimes set mental lap times - like one car goes 5 seconds faster than everyone else. Rubber-banding?

    If you make a mistake they will take advantage, which is good. They like to put you under pressure and sometimes they do defend a corner - i had several do so at Oschersleben last night.
    They often dice with each other too, and cause each other to make mistakes or spin/crash. Also good.

    Just had a small patch i see, wonder what this effects.
     
  3. Msportdan

    Msportdan
    @ Simberia @Simberia

    16-09-2014
    - Fixed an issue where the AI difficulty was not working correctly in certain cases.
     
    • Beer Beer x 1
  4. not sure if it's meant to be, but formerly 92% AI was a bit challenging to get to pole (mostly after a few laps) from ~10th place. Now (after patch?) i need to pump up the AISkill to 105% for a similar result.

    On some tracks it's very easy to overtake the ai on the outside at some places like Indianapolis gp, 2 laps and i was pole@105%.

    +1 haiprin defend.

    And the first drivers should be faster than the last ones, i had races where after 10 laps, the whole grid was still together like a snake and the end result seemed wrong calculated !?!

    Besides those balancing issues, it's a pretty good AI to drive against. Had lots of nice 1vs1 challenges and overtakes from AI :thumbsup:

    &TireWear for AI is still missing (i guess).
     
  5. I would like to understand what it means in detail adaptive AI, is based on time or on how to drive? E 'active after a few laps or the next time I come out of the same race? I'm always using this option to understand but at the moment I do not know what to say, on some tracks I have the pole with two seconds ahead of others are also back 4 seconds, this looks good to me because the outcome is not decided but I would understand if it is AI aggressiveness and talent that changes or something else?
     
  6. Id like to see ai which is adjustable by sectors(maybe) as the ai speed does not seem to be consistent with a players as some corners they pull away in big way (mainly corners that require very good throttle control) and a are easily slower at others (fast corners and flat corners) or maybe im just bad at throttle control
     
  7. I don't have a problem with the AI as much as I do with the fact that your car loses control quite easily when the AI bumps you and they do bump and rub a lot. Maybe its realistic but there's a point where it just becomes infuriating when they bump you and your car spins off the track going from the front of the pack to last. I would like to see my car a bit more stable when bumped. That being said, its refreshing to see a racing game where the AI actually gets into their own accidents. I've seen multiple car accidents already in some races. Maybe I can't have it both ways.
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2014
    • Agree Agree x 1
  8. There is most likely many combinations that doesn't work very well since the tracks aren't updated to match the new AI code yet. Only the tracks which were updated with GT Masters pack are better optimized. For the cars only GT Masters cars have AI at the moment which better reflects how it's going to be with rest of the content as well, and is also better balanced how fast they can take all kinds of turns vs player.

    Also the AI behaviour is still being worked on so all the feedback is wellcomed!.
     
    • Beer Beer x 3
  9. Just for laughs, if you have not yet visited, or bought Mid-Ohio, (get it soon, well worth the price) and watch the AI on the first couple laps learn the track just after the esses. I actually pulled over to a safe spot near the inside guardrail and just watched and laughed at the calamity for a couple laps as they learned that series of off camber, up hill, downhill, drop away high speed, quit steering for a moment turns before heading into thunder valley. Its a hoot and they learn rather quickly. Three laps later I was working trying to defend my line and laughing a lot less. Good job on every aspect so far after the update, keep em coming but, I must agree with Blkout above, but please call him mike. Just the slightest touch sends ME off track. Not them, ever. I don't care if you fix it or not, maybe it's not broken, but make them spin and hit a wall every once and a while just so i feel better.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. I love the AI, I can beat & bang with them with no problem most of the time but I have had the car suddenly "instaspin" if you are door to door with an AI car. Don't really know how else to explain it. Doesn't happen consistently, but when it does there is no saving it.
     
  11. The AI show a lot of promise. My only feedback is that I would like to see a greater field spread. At the moment there is a lot of bunching, especially mid-pack, which causes AI behavior in races akin to traffic congestion on a freeway. In other words because they are all so close, corner braking at the front of the pack causes much, much slower speeds in those same corners further down the field. This makes it very difficult for the player to establish a rhythm.

    While I appreciate this happens in real life, but usually only on the first part of a lap. In RRE atm its happening for a number of laps and in just about every slow-medium corner.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  12. jimortality

    jimortality
    Premium Member

    Do you all use the adaptive AI?
     
  13. I have not used adaptive since the latest patch. I've been testing the different AI levels with the manual settings.
     
  14. same here i prefer to find my own level and i also like to have different difficulty's depending on racelength ect
     
  15. Peter

    Peter
    Premium Member

    I still use it.
     
  16. jimortality

    jimortality
    Premium Member

    I did a 20 lap race in one of the ADAC tracks and cars so hw does it all work. The AI were very slow in corners and didn't really get any better.
     
  17. Msportdan

    Msportdan
    @ Simberia @Simberia

    yeah I just done 7 laps at 90 AI level, (probably too low for me just testing) and I got last to first in 3 laps... But I think mainly cos the AI bunch too much so you can almost take 2-3 guys in a space of as many corners.. they need to be spread have faster drivers or slower drivers. Drivers dragging eachother along etc... But must admit they are good to race and fight with.

    bad corners for me at nurburgring..

    _first/last hairpin, easy to dive down inside (as said they need to defend this if your near)
    _next few corners after 1st hairpin..

    think had the same issues with race07. If on;ly the Ai could defend hairpins and slower corners if the player was 2-3 cars lenghs behind. it would be challenging. But not too much where they end up smashing you off track.. I can appreciate how hard these things are to code. :)
     

  18. That's what I'm talkin about. I can beat them too, that's not the issue. Great racing front to back, bumping and being bumped but, get along side fighting for a line and suddenly, you are looking at armco with amazing speed, no hope of saving nuthin. Loads of fun tho. I look forward to getting behind the wheel again.
     
  19. Hi guys,

    I just have to write something about the AI. I'm having a really hard time to find words for it. It's so ridiculously bad, it's not even funny anymore.

    I just wanted to test the AI in a quick race. So what I did was configure myself a race with AI in GT Masters on the Red Bull Ring. I left AI on adaptive, put 23 opponents on the track, no training, no qualy, with me starting from the last spot in a Nissan.

    I restarted the race at least 10 times until I was so fed up of the experience that I just left the race.

    The AI was several seconds per lap slower than me. When I was behind them they braked very early for the corners and went through the corners quite slow, resulting in the bad laptimes I just mentioned. But as soon as I got ahead of one of them they suddenly braked way later than before. But they not only just bumped into my rear. No matter what - they found a way to push their noses beside my rear on the inside and then push me around into a spin apparently on full throttle and happily continuing their race. They tried it nearly every time when I had just passed them and in most cases succeeded to make me spin. The only cases I could go around a corner in a clean way was when noone was behind me or they were too far away after they screwed up to badly the corner before. But every time I could see the otherwise slow a$$ AIs massively gaining on me under breaking after I overtook them.

    Long story short: the AI drives like an aggressive horde of complete morons, they all do it and they do it all the time. It's completely impossible to have a clean race against the AI.

    And now comes the worst part. Yes it can even get worse. Sometimes the AI even pushed me off the track. I mean literally. Sometimes after spinning me around they didn't stop pushing me. They went on pushing like crazy against my car and pushing me off the track like a big "T". And after doing so I (yes, I) recieved a drive through penalty for cutting the track while the AI just raced on like nothing happened.

    The only laps I was allowed to finish without being pushed off were the ones AFTER I was pushed off so badly that I was far behind the field and had to catch up to them again.

    I'm not quite sure what happened here. I mean the SIMBIN AIs from former games were never very good - at least compared to what Geoff Crammond was capable of doing several years before. But it was quite "raceable". Even the adaptive AI from RRRE from before the last big patch was not THAT bad. When I did some free practice laps with AI cars enabled they were nearly as "raceable" as in older SIMBIN games. They only had problems with very slow corners which they slightly missed nearly every time.

    So what happened here? I'm sitting in front of my wheel now and can't really believe what I have just experienced. Too unreal. And I also can't believe I'm the only one making this experience. I mean, really, WTF??? I think the only simracing-AI worse than that was in LFS.

    Any ideas?
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  20. OK, I just tried it again. The only change I made was to set the AI to 100 instead of adaptive.

    That was waaayy better. They were still about two seconds slower than me and it was still a lot of unnecessary (and in terms of real racing: unfair) pushing and bumping involved. But at least I got pushed into a spin only once this time, being already in the last third of the race. I still think AI is way too agressive, waaayy too optimistic whom they can outbreak and they still don't "respect" the players car-"boundaries" at all. What they really often do is this: I pass them on the straight and they want to change their driving line to the other side of my car. They never wait until you have passed them completely, but just slightly slam into your rear end from the side they're coming from on their way to the other side. This is really unnecessary and annoying behaviour.

    But why is my experience so much different just from setting the AI strength from adaptive to 100? Or is there some randomness in aggressiveness of each AI driver that changes from race to race and I just had extremely bad luck in the first race and good luck in the second one?

    I just can't help but scratch my head about what has happened tonight on my virtual track...:O_o::O_o::O_o: