Season 11 race 5 Abu Dhabi setup

On diff settings:

Road cars use "zero" lock: the power is applied always to the wheel that has less resistance. Race cars use Limited Slip Differential. This allows torque to be applied more freely between the rear tires. During cornering, wheels rotate different amounts: inside wheel travel less distance. At the same time body roll gives outside wheel the most amount of grip. You can see that this is not a good thing, with "zero" lock diff, the inside has less grip, less resistance and thus would spin out very easily limiting acceleration forward. But you can go fast around corners since you're outside wheel is basically free wheeling and has maximum grip.

There also the other alternative, 100% lock. This situation gives outside wheel ideal torque but would make inside wheel to push the car forward while outside wheel is dragging: horribly cornering abilities follow. 100% lock has the maximum straight line acceleration. Both extremes cause excessive tire wear on top of all bad things.

So we have LSD. This dictates how much power is applied on both wheels. If we have 50% then at least half of the torque is applied to both wheels. Very much a theoretical optimum between cornering. In practice, this is usualy the top limit, no one uses 50% as this still makes outside wheel to loose grip (with F1 thing are a bit different as those things reach closer to theoretical limits on everything..) What i've seen in F3000 and other series too, is that 30% is typical, some using as low as 5% and some as high as 40%

But it isn't over yet... We got power (pump) and coast... (pump is not available in Race07 F3000, it has power and coast only, i think it's LSD type 1.5)

Power: the amount of torque always applies to inside while while accelerating. Basically all that above was power side of the differential. Lower this if you push out of corners but be careful of not exceeding the limits. Once the inside wheel loses grip, it gains a lot f rotational energy and it keeps spinning even when power is applies evenly: tire that exceeds grip and rotates faster than ground speed has less grip than a tire that moves with same speed relatively to ground.. So you got less grip on one wheel, differential lock applies all the torque i can according to LSD setting.. On track this happens when you think you are free to accelerate, late or even after corner exit and the car just keep spinning out. You have to first gain traction back and then go back on power. This can happen without you knowing that you've exceeded the grip, it's slow gradual process. Too high power lock is easy to notice, it spins immediately at the exit or even at the apex, it's violent and fast.

Coast: The amount of torque applied to both wheels while decelerating (and i think during steady pace, no acceleration or deceleration). This usually is higher than power side, more lock stabilizes the car but has worse turn-in capabilities. Too low and your car moves under braking, too high and it will push straight forward.

Pump: It's used on some cars.. It's amount of torque that is applied while pumping the throttle, ie your vehicle speed doesn't change a lot but your accelerating/decelerating in small amounts quickly. It has the possibility of changing behavior during apex. Since F3000 has only power and coast, pump is the same as power diff.

Pre-load: how the transition between power/coast happens. Higher preload starts using coast side of differential much "earlier" while decelerating and vice versa on power. This is very much driver preference. On lowest setting the transition is very gradual but it can be too slow to pick up changes. Too high and it becomes unpredictable. If you got even setting, for ex 30 on power and 30 on coast, preload can be anything (in theory, it could be that there are small modifiers so you never get identical power and coast.) Maximum preload is basically on/off.

EDIT: i use almost always 10-15% power, 20-40% coast with 2-4 preload.
 
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Engine maps can be changed with Notepad. Locate My Docs\SimBin\ace 07\UserData\CarSetups and the track you're on, select a setup you saved. You can find engine and engine brake map settings there. Once you've saved the file, reload it in game.

There's a program called MoTec i2 Pro, it's free to download and use (Without actual sensors on an actual vehicle.. then it's PRICEY:::) You need to edit your PLR file (can't remember from memory exactly but you need to create a folder where telemetry is saved and give that location, MoTec exe location, allow telemetry to be saved and whether to use different file for each session.)

I have a MoTec project where everything is scaled for open wheelers and has tons of custom math to analyze body roll, differential, suspension etc. The link is somewhere here, i can dig it up if you want.
 
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I think the best way to do setup is just to change small things and try see how it feels. If it feels better good or if it feels worse back to what you had or other direction.
Im pretty sure this is method used by me Reik and David and mostly how any of faster guys in other leagues make them to.
Ive used motec in past etc and made setups perfectly for it and its a slower setup compared to something made by just doing laps and feeling it, its game after and not true to life no need to get to into details it only complicates things when its pretty simple.
My advise would be to use 1 of the shared setups you like feel of as a base and change very little just click at a time of 1 thing until you possibly make it feel better, steering lock should be only thing you change right away to what you normally use.
In the past I used to just dl Reik's setup and just practise with it watching his videos mostly with mmg with out any changes and was by far best thing I did to improve.

Also on the engine maps the default values are the best you can use ie fastest accel and best power, brake map is set as highest engine braking so any changes to these makes your car either slower to accel saving slight on fuel which isn't enough to make up pace lost or less engine braking, sure this maybe good for certain wet circumstances but not being able to on the fly means its not as good a option as you could end up having to brake 50m early than you could with default . Im pretty sure we all found this out with a lot of practise over the years so Me David and Reik use default with these and mmg when we raced.

Just some advise so people realise there's not all that much to setups really and its more the fact we have done some more time on practise and spent very little time on actually making setups. They are basically what we have used in previous races just slightly edited:thumbsup:
 
...brake map is set as highest engine braking so any changes to these makes your car either slower to accel saving slight on fuel which isn't enough to make up pace lost or less engine braking, sure this maybe good for certain wet circumstances but not being able to on the fly means its not as good a option as you could end up having to brake 50m early than you could with default . Im pretty sure we all found this out with a lot of practise over the years so Me David and Reik use default with these and mmg when we raced...

Not so sure about your comments about engine brake-mapping.
There are 2 settings below the default values for more engine-braking while beeing off the throttle (1 and 0). That's what I've used in every race so far in this season and this definatly helped me to make braking feel better compared to last season.
 
I think that's how it works in rfactor Dino but I don't think I ever noticed as big a difference in gtr other than it being slower for myself, last time I tried though it was with mmg I will possibly check it out again with these but pretty fine with how these brake but I do use more throttle than others 5.28 a lap vs David's 5.12 of fuel.
 
On diff settings:


Power: the amount of torque always applies to inside while while accelerating.

Hm, isn't it the other way around? The % of power diff is the amount of power distributed to the OUTER side? Or am I a bit confused here.

Edit: btw, today, my head is heavy, eyes soar, brain sleepy, coordination and short- as well as long-term memory on a low today... so please bare with me on this, or maybe just skip this until tomorrow so I can retry to understand :D
 
all i can say is lol this thread has got long.....

i think yet again too much emphasis is placed on setups, for the love of god just use one of the ones posted and practise with it, if we can do the times on it then so can you, it only takes dedication and practise, theres no secret setup or secret setting within them, what you see is what you get, honestly just pick one, practise with it, youll go faster, most of this is placebo effect kicking in, i also dont think its a coincidence that the faster guys put in the most time, do you?

turn attentions to track time instead of this guys, it helps considerably, and practise online whenever you can, it makes it much more enjoyable doing it on the servers with other guys who are doing the same :thumbsup:
 
Peter: Hmm.. i have to check on that, if it's outside or inside value.

David: Some people like to twiddle with setups, it's a HUGE part of the whole game experience. And i can say that if setup is not working, i'll loose seconds so it IS important. I've heard this from many talented drivers who can drive on what ever you give them. On the other end of spectrum we got drivers who have to be very close to optimal setup vefore we can get even the basic performance. I think this is part of that talented vs non-talented thing i mentioned earlier. We can't' figure out how you can drive so fast (it's NOT the amount of practice, i should be way up if that was the only thing.. ) and you can't figure out why we can be so slow...

All i can say is that i need to be close, not perfect on setup and the time difference between basic and fully tweaked is about a second (and i mean basic as it's not the way i like it but gearing and aero is about in place..). The difference between horrible and basic is two or more. With training i can gain about a second more. That still leaves about 5-6 second of which i think i know where two of those are (precision) and the rest three is unobtainable. I've given that up long time ago, i can get within 3 seconds and that's my limit. Even if would drive 20 years, it's not gonna change.. But i got those couple of seconds still to improve, thus i continue. If those times would be possible with any kind of setup, i quit. That would mean i'm maybe the worst simracer in this planet. It always feels disrespectful but i know that this picture is only in my head.Saying setup doesn't matter sounds "this is it, you're never getting any better.." But that's not true, setup is ~30% of the pace.

It's the same when i pick a keyboard or a guitar and i simply can't understand how someone feels that's hard... It's always been easy for me, seeing both of my brothers struggle to get even basic notes out just baffled me. I don't know how it feels to suck playing an instrument.
 
kennett your too hard on yourself, i get the whole some folk will be better than others naturally but thats besides the point, this is a game, it costs nothing to wreck yourself then try again, look at my record in presto since i started in season 2, its consistantly got better ever season since i started, i had no sim experience before presto, id literally played it for 2 weeks before i signed up to join, i had and still have very little clue about setups and what makes the car go faster in certain situations, i get by with changing very little from the race before so im always on a continuation of the setup before, all that changes is i get more used to driving the car, the car becomes very predictable the more you drive it.

you mention the amount of time you put in would make you the best ever, if you dedicated that time to f3000 on the server with others getting out of the habit of using race fuel for qual and take advice onboard youd get better, but to be honest kennett it seems like you dont want the help ive offered loads of times, you always come back with setup this or that when if you just said to youself ok ill try the suggestions, load a setup do a load of laps, adjust your style to the setup rather than start adjusting setups to your style because that way youll always be stuck in the same rut and id like to see you improve big time its why i constantly try and get it across to you that you focus on the wrong things too much.

p.s me and sean will be on server around 9pm (uk) tonight, if your not busy and fancy some practise come on, ill watch your laps, give you tips, help in any way i can, everyone who comes on the server regular knows i try to help, sean would too.
 
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I do follow up your advices, really grateful for all the help. It's just a different approach, that's all. It sound like i endlessly tweak setups but in reality, it is very small part of it all. Mostly i try drive around the issues for 10-15 laps, go back to garage and change the setup. Unless of course it's something that keeps spinning me out like wrong aero-balance, there's small tweaks here and there done in a longer period of time.. Couldn't do that if there weren't a period where setup was everything, changing one click at a time and spending hours studying how it all works. Now everything around setups is so much easier, if i can't drive around an issue, i'll try to change it and usually i get what i want.

This time i've tried 3 setups, including my old one from Suzuka, went out, drove about 8 laps and chose the one that felt the best. Apart from steering lock (different steering wheels...) and small adjust in gearing, only major change was fast rear rebound (too sensitive around curbs to my liking), tiny adjustment on front springs (not really feeling anything, a bit better on braking, i suppose..just a precaution on those lower rear rebound values) and one click on power lock... doesn't sound like "all setup" to me ;) There's very little to do with setup, driving style is where it all really lies.. But then again, you have to agree that horrible setup pretty much stops you performing fully, it destroys enjoyment and can lead to a catastrophic failure.. And requires lot lot more work, concentration and sometimes unnatural approach to problems on track. Better to have at least somewhat good setup. If there weren't any gain, no one would be talking in this thread. One needs to learn the basics to quickly make right decisions: car spins out on high speed corners, tweak aero balance, slow down or take different line. Rear snaps on braking: change brake balance, gear down differently or use more throttle. If i can fix one issue with small change on setup, i'll rather do that than change my driving all around the track. If setup change makes changes all around track because of one corner, i'll rather take that corner in a different manner.
 
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Double post, sue me...

One thing i agree on, there's too little talk about driving lines, braking points etc. , you know, the actual driving should be the main focus. Like "should i take the first hairpin hugging the inside or slow in-fast out." In all my years and the different series/leagues i've been driving, no driver has really wanted to talk about those aspects (except my original home, simracingsuomi..)
 
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I thought most of the talks about driving line aren't necessarry, because the fast drivers post vids of their laps very frequently, which show things much better than to explain them.

If I'm wrong and anyone likes to get driving tips in general or particular places, I'm happy to help.
 
I think bottom line is that the real magic happens online on the practice servers. You look at the others through garage, you look at the difference in sector times, you ask them questions, etc. etc.

In my eyes doing practice online is everyones small contribution to the league. If everybody did their practice offline I don't think this league would excist today. Personally I do 98% of my driving online, only exception is if I for some reason want to use the time attack mode to learn a thing or two.

The more people that are online, the more fun it is and the healthier the league is.
 
no driver has really wanted to talk about those aspects

ill talk about anything except any sexual problems, so fire away :)

reik is right in that videos are posted, setups are posted so it cuts down the need to have lengthy discussions about lines and whatever else, but like he says if anyone wants to ask then dont be shy.

i agree 100% with nico about the practising, i dont know how it is for everyone else but i personally really enjoy practising with others on the servers, wether its purely qualifying or stints, its great fun, usually even when doing stint practise for a race if someone has a mistake we stop and wait for them or quit and retry, always fun to be had and good practise at the same time, alot of the time its just me and sean who are on, obviously we all have diffrent times we practise at but maybe we could bring back practise races or have a fun race on the week off so as to bring us all together a bit more, there used to be alot of activity on the servers and the presto forums, nowadays seems like just the same 5 folk post, lets get it back to how it used to be.
 
I shy away from online practicing simply cause i'm just sooo slow... It's just embarrassing to be 10 seconds slower and the i start pushing and spin... So i make my mistakes offline and go online when i'm already at my peak, don't have to think about anything else but driving.. And when i do get online, i' never see anyone, must be different schedules.
 
ive seen the naked pictures of yourself on your facebook kennett so dont kid on your shy :roflmao:

(before everyone starts asking for kennetts facebook i was only joking)

get online when you can, we can help if you do, if you insist on making your practise routine private then we cant help, its fair enough if you do thats your choice but we'd have fun on the server :thumbsup:
 
Connection issues, went offline for a minute. Now i get +200ms to our UK based BF server (usually it's 90-120ms) and the worse thing it's not solid 200 but stutters and skips. No packet loss but really unstable. edit: went to server where fortunately peter and dino saw my ping. It looked ok but i'm very worried about lag spikes. Ping test showed about 50-70ms spikes about every 3 seconds.. Very worried.
 
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