SEASON 10 Race 8 BARCELONA - Lap counting Incident (Marko)

[Reik Major]

Finally you guys (Nico, Jim, etc.) convinced me. I agree with Nicos solution and support it 100%.

Please don't feel I wanted to blow up a unnecessary debate. In the first place I wanted to know how the majority thinks about it instead of just saying "correct the table" which I easily would have done too.

Finally we learned that we always can safely ignore false blue flag warnings.

Marko, I saw your position behind the name tag telling you were 10th. When it became tricky on slicks I thought about letting you unlap after a mistake but I also felt I was a bit faster in other places and saw a minimum chance to catch Helder later when it got more dry, so I didn't let you unlap. Sorry mate!

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

I think awarding the real position is correct. Losing positions due to blue flag, that's enough. And in the future if there comes a lap counting bug you can dismiss blue flags.

From technical point of view, a player needs to cross xsector1, xsector2 and finishline to get lap counted. I', betting the finishline is right where Marko drifted to right side of pitlboxes for a moment and he missed it. But driving thru both pit-gates (last one stops the laptime) instead finishline should make the lap valid too but that does not always work, most tracks have extended the finishline across pits just to make sure.

 

[Nicolai Nicholson]

Like Jim I did not consider the fact that the cars around Marko might be unaware that he was on the same lap as them. I know myself how actively I use the top left counter that tells you how far to the car ahead and to the car behind. Now I much better understand David and Reik's arguements (although it does not change my view).

I would like to hear the view of more people though, optimally everyone. It is a big advantage if everybody are involved in continually shaping our rules and guidelines, it makes it work much better

 

[Anthony Ishak]

it is a tough call for sure.

Marko is a great driver , and in a normal situation he would not have finished 9th, based on his racing record he would definitely finished somewhere around the top guys where he deserves to be or maybe he would have won the race , he has not done any wrong, it was just unfortunate for him to miss a lap and finish 9th.

I would not mind to correct the laps to place him 4th and grant him those points that he truly deserves and that might help him to win the championship this year , however I personally believe he would leave a stronger impression as a unique Presto champion "regardless of the final outcome " if he decides to accept his bad luck in this race like most of us done in the past , put up a brave face and take the challenge to the guys up to the last turn of the final race.

YOU are a true fighter m8 and I believe you can do it

 

[Sean Greenlaw]

I see this as difficult one to solve leaving everyone happy, its like one way or other its always left slightly unfair to the other because of the strange situation. One good thing is we now know in future is to ignore flags in they situations.
You can see how obviously how its affected Markos race as he loses lap, but difficult to see how much it also affected Reiks, David and Dino etc racing thinking Markos a lap down.

Its probably best if top guys on points and in race finish come to some half way agreement on what's fairest for everyone and then this takes away anyone person having to make the difficult decision himself, like it being left to Nico to decide is a difficult position.

 

[Nicolai Nicholson]

I do not think we should consider the situation in the league or who a decition affects. I think we should focus on the technical side of things and what kind of precedence we want for the future.

 

[Sean Greenlaw]

In future as I said, I think we all know what to do now for future like you guys said to, simply race like flags aren't there and guy gets lap back at the end .

 

[Steeve Fournier]

If i was Marko, i would be sad to not have the correction, but in the mean time, i won't be 100% mind free as a champion (if he is at the end of the season) because of that correction. Its by reading Anthony's post that this reply came to my mind.

If the same situation happen again, the same questionning will be. As other drivers on track see the "bug victim" as 1 lap down so no need to fight. And I thnik there is no way to let every drivers know during the race: "Hey, i suffer from a lap count error, so fight me cos i am on the same lap as you, even if it shows wrong".

Does Marko deserve the correction and points back? My answer is YES.

Will the final result be the same if the bug did not happen? I think NO. Cos Knowing Marko's abilities, i'm pretty sure he would be on the podium without that bug. But no one will ever know......

What to do if same situation happen again? I think its pretty simple. If the "victim" is really fighting with someone behind him, that means he is on the same lap. If a driver who had problems and find himself 1 lap down, he should NOT fight the leader or any other lapping cars. He shoud let the other do an easy pass on him.

I don't know if i'm clear enough to make you understand my thinking?!?!? but i hope so.

Steeve

 

[Valerio Vinassa]

I agree with Anthony's thought, and how say Steeve "bug victim" in every race there is some freeze/net/lag problem and anyone can say something/cry/complain but we are a bit adult for don't do it I know is boring for Marko ( in this case have hit you ) but is an event that can happen.Marko you don't need win a championship for prove something you are a champion like much other here and the nice thing is the availability to help the others, here you are champions.
For equilibrate the season ( so all/we childs are happy) we can organize an event only for ours Champions example 10cars 15laps ( no pits ) and other fellaws connected only like spectators with beverage some snack and in chat with TS I have a doubt could be more fun for viewers ? our Champions can put their skill on tarmac with sweat, tears and blood for enjoying us and their fight

 

[Valter Ostman]

I'm only here for the privilege to race with the best and have fun. A couple of points up or down doesn't matter much to me. If you like to hear my opinion. The league-leading guys should decide this among themselves.

EDIT: Basically, I think all the technical errors and bugs should be treated the same way. You can see it as engine failure or whatever.

 

[Nicolai Nicholson]

I see the opinions go both ways and we need a decision before tomorrow's race. I am sure if someone for some mysterious reason got 1 lap counted as 2 and consequently "won the race" the majority would think the error should be corrected.

I think the right thing to do is to correct the number of laps, so to close this matter I'll do that and hope nobody think it is unfair (because it isn't)

 

[Steeve Fournier]

I am sure if someone for some mysterious reason got 1 lap counted as 2 and consequently "won the race" the majority would think the error should be corrected.

Nico you are a genius!! Why as nobody thought about that before??? Because it is too simple maybe?!?!? lol Thats the best comparison i've read in this thread, and i'm sure everyone would want the counting lap corrected if it happened opposite way, like you said.

 

[Valter Ostman]

Of course you are right Nicolai, it's fair to reorder the table.
My thoughts are irrelevant because I'm not close to the top drivers. I only wrote my opinion because I believe it makes decision making and administration easier and more consistent. Isn't part of the charm in formula racing the unpredictability. You'll never know when the s..t hits the fan, especially in heavy rain .

 

[Reik Major]

Well done Nico! That's real good admin work!

Valter, each member's opinion counts and weighs the same, so please never hold it back. Especially our "older" members may have a different (wiser?) view on tricky stuff.