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Discussion in 'Simracing Team Challenge' started by Xosé Estrada, Apr 16, 2010.

  1. +30 sec

  2. +60 sec

    0 vote(s)
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  1. Xosé Estrada

    Xosé Estrada

    Disadvantaged car: Lucas Degan and Michael HJ
    Team: ANE
    Reported car: Rami Kaukola
    Reported Team: RPM


    Two to report in one video

    1. Rami passed Lucas before the start finish line.

    2. Rami turned inside of turn 5, the entrance of the chicane, fully leaving the track and coming straight on in to the side of Michael's car. This dropped him right to the back of the pack on the openning lap.

    ORGANIZATION NOTE: As Rami is the reported car in both accidents, please add your penalties to end in a total final decision.


    +30 secs penalty for Rami, with a warning relative to the jump start, in case of re-incidence the automatic punishment will be No points / DQ for next race.
  2. Ross Balfour

    Ross Balfour
    #99 | Roaring Pipes Maniacs

    My decision:
  3. This was a another lag incident though and normally as we are all human a sorry usually does the trick to avoid these penalties in SimRacing (Which Vince did say sorry about it) If there is no apology for an incident and the Victim is not happy about it then of course these penalties come up, as they have been doing.

    Lap 1 incidents should be taken just as seriously as at any other stages of the race, as on the first lap a driver can loose out more as he can end up at the back of the pack and allot of work to do. In this incident you can clearly see that Rami was not patient enough and tried to rush the pass which caused the tap so a penalty would be appropriate.
  4. Ross Balfour

    Ross Balfour
    #99 | Roaring Pipes Maniacs

    Oh yeah, I'm not saying it was Vince's fault, It was just an example of a Lap One incident that I could remember. He said sorry and we moved on, I'm saying a similar thing should happen here.
  5. Bram

    Ezekiel 25:17 Staff Premium

    Rami should stop starting from the back then this incident would have been avoided as the difference in speed is huge :)
  6. Ye, I mean for me sometimes the best way to deal with it is man to man in private, if your at fault say am sorry, 100% my fault won't happen again, victim accepts and everyone's happy and moves on. Problem is when your at fault for an incident but don't think of the victim and don't send him an apology after the race, that's when these incident reports usually get reported and come up.
  7. As for the overtaking before the line, I did the same thing to the guy in front of me, I cannot remember who it was, I still dropped behind before the line and then re applied my pace to take that position legally. I did not care if I passed him because of lag or not. I still dropped back. Rami could have done the same thing.
  8. Ross Balfour

    Ross Balfour
    #99 | Roaring Pipes Maniacs

    I will discuss this with Rami before making my final decision as I didn't notice the pass before the line in the first time I watched the video, that'll teach me not to skim-read the description :)
  9. In my view 1st lap incidents should be penalized even more than "normal" race incidents. Everybody must know that on the 1st lap your tires/brakes are not up to temp and you can't push the car as usual. Also a many drivers tend to take it "easy" on the first lap(s) to avoid doing something stupid before the car has settled into correct race trim.

    On the incidents:

    1. You simply cannot pass before s/f line. Clear penalty, unless there was so much lag that Rami did not see the car infront.
    2. Another clear penalty maneuver this. Rami's fault and no excuse for it.

    I'd say 15s+30s=45s penalty
  10. Ross Balfour

    Ross Balfour
    #99 | Roaring Pipes Maniacs

    Guys, here is the Rami incident from a clearer view. We see first Rami braking way eralier than noormal on the straight to allow Michael the position back, yet Michael braked very very early indeed. We then see Rami was on 100% brake before he hit Lucas. From this video, RPM vote NO PENALTY.

  11. 2 points

    1, Rami passed Lucas and then took me out
    2, Rami compleatly leaves the track, cutting the coner, before colliding with me
  12. Ross Balfour

    Ross Balfour
    #99 | Roaring Pipes Maniacs

    As I said, Rami braked to give the position back, but he never took it back. You see on the video he braked as soon as he passed Lucas.

    Sorry I thought it was the other way round!
  13. Thats OK Ross. From.looking at the video Lucas brakes because I had as I had just passed the guy in front when both the FO club cars suddenly slowed and needed to relinquish before the line.

    I can not speak for Rami and so will not speculate on intentions. I am only commenting on what we see from the replay.
  14. Ross Balfour

    Ross Balfour
    #99 | Roaring Pipes Maniacs

    Do you want Rami to speak to you? I can arrange that if needed. Like I said, he is not a dirty racer and didn't hit Lucas with any anger or malice. As far as us as RPM can see it both incidents are racing incidents that you see all the time in real racing, and that's life. Now I'll shut up now and let the other teams vote :)
  15. Sry but apart from lag which i can't see in the Vid Ross made, I can't any excuse to pass anyone on the S/F line. If you see the car in front of you having to slow down you need to do this also and let him pass again (if you passed him). If we allow overtaking on before the S/F line (apart from lag) then just stop using it. In most of the starts i saw, at the back you see guys speeding up and then having to slow down again as otherwise they overtake someone, can't see how you can avoid this.
  16. I really dont lke these counter videos Ross.
    And please be impartial otherwise the whole WAR system can go to the trash can.
  17. 1. Overtaking before start/finish line. As there was general confusion with both red flag and green flag messages combined with RPM car clearly braking eraly to give the place back - No penalty
    2. The bump. Same as all the other bumps. +15sek
  18. Bram

    Ezekiel 25:17 Staff Premium

    Sorry guys but something is not in the hook here. The AnE driver here who literally almost flips a TBR driver after ramming him as a lapped drivers gets a 30 second penalty, and for a light touch here we are seriously voting for a 1 minute penalty? :D

    Does that mean that overtaking one car at the start costs you 30 seconds?
  19. dooh coming too late to vote :( sry, no excuse for my behaviour. BFR forum would have voted +60. last season STC voted no points no quali for a pass before start finish (just a reminder)
  20. Bram

    Ezekiel 25:17 Staff Premium

    Then people that can't make a proper start and hit the brakes should be penalized too? I am not saying Rami should not get a penalty at all, but this is a bit ridiculous :)

    So you can torpedo two drivers and flip them upside down and that would equal a penalty for jump starting overtaking one driver with an amazing 0,5 second gap :)
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