RDRC - Suggestions

Status
Not open for further replies.
This means that almost whoever achieves to do a clean rally with no retirement and few CFHs can score points in theory.

and in practice, lol.

I second Yann: no changes in the middle of the season. I have so far only run championships with points for either everyone or the top 20 and it was fine, but our system here is neat because it reflects the WRC in real life. I don't think people will be kept from dropping out if you can score a wee point here and a wee point there. Most dropouts in leagues had unrealistic expectations of fame and fortune to begin with because they were fast on public servers, but if anyone is odd enough to play a 10 year old game, I suppose one is odd enough to keep coming back even for losing :)
 
This means that almost whoever achieves to do a clean rally with no retirement and few CFHs can score points in theory.

and in practice, lol.

I disagree with that, I'm afraid.
Guys, I think you are baseing your findings solely on the Alpine Rally (Round 2) which was probably the most dangerous Rally round we will have. The red ink (retirements) in that one will not be indicative of most Rounds.

Take Round 1 for example (purely an example to illustrate the point, I'm not complaining about my result :wink: ) . I finished without any red ink, only two rollovers with one CFH, finished P15 overall (out of 53 starters) and didn't get close to getting a point. I believe there were lots of drivers above and below me in the standings who had no red ink, few CFH's, and scored no points.
I expect that Round 1 results may be more typical of most rounds (unless Rick goes bananas with the weather settings :tongue: ).

One important point to consider here is not whether drivers will drop out or not, but to provide some interest / incentive for drivers other than only the top few. I'm sure it might add some more fun for a driver who is running, say 25th, to have a personal battle with another guy running 24th or 26th, rather than just leaving them as one of the large bunch with very little chance of scoring a point all season. This is especially the case when you have more than 50 drivers involved. Sure, many drivers will keep running just for the fun of it, but a League should allow a little more interest (for ALL drivers) than the normal Rally Club Events, IMO.

If a league is seen to be aimed only at the top few, there is a chance that we could end up with only the top few maintaining genuine interest.

I'm sure it is possible to design a points system that provides some incentive for all (or most) drivers, but still provides the extra reward points for the top drivers who reach the win or podium of each rally Round.
 
Easiest way to solve how to sort out drivers without points is to sort them in order of their highest finishing position.

That's what I've always done while doing league standings too.

Will probably do it in the final standings, but can't really see myself doing that in Excel, with 50+ drivers, manually, after every round. I can provide the link to the file, if anyone else will want to give it a go :tongue:

Also against major mid-season rule changes.
 
Will probably do it in the final standings, but can't really see myself doing that in Excel, with 50+ drivers, manually, after every round. I can provide the link to the file, if anyone else will want to give it a go :tongue:

I want to volunteer but I'm not good at excel or other MS offices lol
I think by just adding the total/final time (right now for Rd1 and rd2) will give the standing for the drivers, is that how its done?
 
There was an idea to increase the number of scored drivers to 15 or 20; now that's been brought up here - do many of you feel that we should do this? It's still early in the league...

I think this is a good ide to increase the number of the scored drivers. It shouldn't be changed so dramatic; I think the first 15 driver should score points (because I think in the season everybody will at least one top15 finish).
 
I have to say battling for my position in the "B league" last season was great. I wasn't going for the overall win or even the class win and still felt like every point mattered. This season I love how much participation there is, but since points are hard to come by the championship rounds end up not being much different than the club rallies for a large chunk of the field.

I would rather see more classes to score in than larger scoring tables tho, and this would allow more cars to be used. Having something like Group N 2WD, Group N 4WD, Group A 2WD, Group A 4WD would segment people into smaller scoring groups. Perhaps I am overestimating the amount of people that want to drive 2WD. Maybe 2WD, N4/N4S, A8, A8W? Just throwing stuff out there (rambling).
 
I would rather see more classes to score in than larger scoring tables tho, and this would allow more cars to be used. Having something like Group N 2WD, Group N 4WD, Group A 2WD, Group A 4WD would segment people into smaller scoring groups.

I think there is merit in this idea, and I believe Rick and his Team might already be thinking along those lines for next Season.
It will need to be somewhat limited, I think, too many classes adds a lot to the Admin workload, and I would still like to see reasonable numbers of entrants in each Class (eg. at least 5 in each class, preferably more).
 
I think there is merit in this idea, and I believe Rick and his Team might already be thinking along those lines for next Season.
It will need to be somewhat limited, I think, too many classes adds a lot to the Admin workload, and I would still like to see reasonable numbers of entrants in each Class (eg. at least 5 in each class, preferably more).
It's not so hard to execute, adding a class mid-season is a definitive no-go though. Look around the different packs before Season 3 tough, just sayin' ;]

Will probably do it in the final standings, but can't really see myself doing that in Excel, with 50+ drivers, manually, after every round. I can provide the link to the file, if anyone else will want to give it a go :tongue:

Also against major mid-season rule changes.
My point exactly. I can't think of a way to execute this smoothly without creating at least a simple database (which is an overkill at this point really). With 50+ drivers this would be a major PITA.

Increasing the number of scored drivers at this point is a minor/medium change; right now many drivers express interest in it, I personally like it too. Just like in WTM, where despite the fact that points are awarded for 25 out of 40 positions I still find it a success to score anything :D. Also it gives you more motivation to drive after making a non-lethal mistake (such as rolling). With a tight leader group this might mean a loss of chance to score points, hence the fighting spirit might go away.

And don't give me the "have a clean rally" crap, think McRae and shut up :p
 
Increasing the number of scored drivers at this point is a minor/medium change; right now many drivers express interest in it, I personally like it too. Just like in WTM, where despite the fact that points are awarded for 25 out of 40 positions I still find it a success to score anything :D. Also it gives you more motivation to drive after making a non-lethal mistake (such as rolling). With a tight leader group this might mean a loss of chance to score points, hence the fighting spirit might go away.

Good point there, I've seen a few people that looked like they gave up after a couple of bad stages.
 
Also:
I second Yann: no changes in the middle of the season. I have so far only run championships with points for either everyone or the top 20 and it was fine, but our system here is neat because it reflects the WRC in real life. I don't think people will be kept from dropping out if you can score a wee point here and a wee point there.
Yes and no. In WRC you often barely have 10 WRCs, so to mimic that we should award points to top 25 :].

And we haven't changed the number of scored drivers, because we were looking at slightly lesser figures at the final round of S1. S2 got off to a really neat start (probably the movies and some main page stories helped) and thats why we got positively surprised.
 
WOW, my little post have created huge ripple effect, i didn't know this is such a hot topic. Well, i had some time to think about it and i want to go futher with it.

The point system we have atm is simply inadequate for the number of drivers in the league. I would even use a stronger word; it is destructive for it. Lets have all arguments put in one place.

1: we want to follow real life as close as possible.

I feel this is the weakest of them all. Real life point scoring system is design for real drivers, whom job is to drive rally cars regardless of their finishing position. For us is just a passion which really doesn't bare any marks on our real life, in most cases anyway :D. And like all fellings it can change, either way. We ( as opposed to real life ) have the power to change things quickly and efficiently, to benefit the community as a whole. Our goal should be to make the championship attractive to as large number of driver as we possibly can. And the current point scoring system is doing harm to that.

2: Its too late / no changes through mid-season.

Its only been 2 rounds, we are still at the beginning. This championship is very long, there are many months still to go. But i'll simplifie this even futher: WHY?? Can someone make a logical explanation WHY is too late and WHY we can't make any changes?? Especially if those changes won't disadvantage anyone?? For me this is another weak argument.

I don't see ANY barrier why we can't make a change right now, before the harm is done.
What harm? Let me explain.

For most of us RBR is an addition to other racing sims and as such make less impact with our time allocation priority. If you are a mid / bottom driver and you don't get rewarded you gradually lose interest and then you drop out. This will be true for many drivers, especially the new ones. The hard learning curve of this sim only adds to that. And if you good at other racing sims but find yourself out of depth in RBR is even harder to keep the motivation going. The nature of rallying is that you will never see another competitor on stage, no direct fight means the only way you can compare yourself is through scoring.
I,m maybe a pessimist but if we don't change the way the points are allocated we will lose a third of the field ( or more ) by the last round. Of course some drop outs are inevitable but we can limit the impact if we act NOW.

Do we want to have a limited amount of hard core pilots or do we want to have a large field of all skills so everyone can have a chance of fighting?

This is my opinion and you don't have to agree with it, lets have more voices heard.

Points for EVERYONE i say :) :).
 
I'm a person who thinks WRC and F1 should go back to 10-6-4-3-2-1 so I think it is fine as it is. My motivation is to drive as good as possible in the rallies and any points are a bonus. It is boring of points gets to "easy" or common...
 
All of this talk and discussion is very intersting. I think I will hold my opinion for a while as i KNOW it will offend people.

The final decision I will leave up to the rest of the team, i will not be involved in making this one.
 
I agree to what Dariusz Swiderski and Ole Marius Myrvold point is in their message

The point system we have atm.......

I'm a person who thinks WRC and F1 should go back...

But just like Dariusz point out this is not our real profession.
We don't get paid by playing this game or winning the championship, we compete here to enjoy the game and for most of us see where we stand versus the others, if theres a real reward for the winners then I would suggest not to change the scoring system imho.

or we can scratch the changing of scoring system and think of something that will encourage/give motivation to all the drivers to continue participating in the championship. A large pack of participant/co-competitors is a good environment to have I don't want to see it dwindle.

**note**

maybe not all the participant can see or heard about this discussion is there a way to give them a heads up so we can hear there opinion as well? because they are part of this matter.
 
I like this scoring system, and in my opinion the best idea in this thread is to have more classes, but that would have to be done for next season.

Is it not possible to enter the results manually into GPCOS? So that the driver outside of top 10 can also see were they stand in the championship
 
Is it not possible to enter the results manually into GPCOS? So that the driver outside of top 10 can also see were they stand in the championship

Ben, I'd rather we didn't start getting involved with GPCOS at this stage, I suspect it wouldn't suit the Rally environment with stage times/wins etc. Besides, GPCOS usually relies on extracting server results directly into GPCOS, and I'm not sure how our Admin guys could do that.
Also, GPCOS would still only allocate the agreed points (wouldn't it?) so there would just be a bunch of drivers with no points listed in no particular order anyway. Regarding each Round, everyone gets to see their finishing order for that Rally now, or am I missing your point?? :confused:

Basically, all drivers outside the top 10 (or at least those consistently outside top 10 in all Rounds) would be equal in the overall standings on 0 points.

This is, of course, based on my "flimsy" knowledge of GPCOS. :wink:

EDIT: I'm all for trying to keep the Admin side of things as easy as possible so that they can enjoy the Rallys too. :)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest News

Are you buying car setups?

  • Yes

  • No


Results are only viewable after voting.
Back
Top