RDHGP S4 - Race 2 - Watkins Glen, New York - 12/11/09

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Stuart Thomson

The Stoat Without Fear ™
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Welcome to Round 2 of the RDHGP S4

Welcome back to the 2009 RDHGP S4. I hope the shock of the Australian lightning in Round 1 didn’t diminish anyone’s eagerness for this League, and only left you clamouring for more of the same, or in some cases, the chance to put things right.

The Albert Park track is very idiosyncratic, with lots of right angles, joined by short, squirty straights, and little or no elevation change. We are putting that right almost immediately, as we move north, from the Terra Australis to the Empire State. We all know Watkins Glen and its various incarnations, so I’m hopeful of a nice close race right through the field again.

Last time, I wrote the following – “While by its very nature, the League environment is more competitive than the Club environment, please remember what makes the GTL Club so unique – our consideration for all other competitors at all times. Let’s try and carry this tradition of clean, fun and considerate racing over into a League environment … I would expect people to wait for someone they have taken off, even if it was accidental.”

After a few pieces of confusion in the Australian aftermath, I will be clarifying my position in the Incidents, Investigations and Penalties section. I urge you all to read and process it, please.

As predicted, the prevention of discussions about laptimes meant that no-one was particularly sure how their times stacked up until we all got on the server. I genuinely think that this is a good thing, and I hope everyone else does. I hope you will all respect the rule for the rest of the season, especially as we are changing track types fairly regularly this year, and so different cars will shine at different tracks. That in itself is a worthwhile result for keeping this rule in place.

watkins.jpg

Circuit Notes

Watkins Glen, in upstate New York, is one of the most created tracks in Sim Racing. We are all very familiar with it in all its incarnations. From the deceptively simple 1956-70 GP Circuit, the 1970 reprofiling of the Glen (turning T1 into “The Ninety”, removal of the “Speed Trap” and “Fast Bend”), to the 1975 introduction of the Inner Loop and The Boot section, allowing multiple layouts to be achieved with ease.

RDHGP is using the “Long” layout, including the Boot and the Inner Loop sections. The Inner Loop will be discussed at some length in the Race Director Notes section below.

The Glen is the first time this season we have encountered any real gradients this season (including the test events which were chosen to acclimatise people to the demands they’d be facing in Melbourne), so I expect it to be a nice shift of experience for us and will change the emphasis of our technique sharply in contrast with the preceding round(s).

The downhill braking into T1R The Ninety, those fast uphill Esses where it is so easy to lose momentum, the diving T7R of the Outer Loop, followed by the downhill braking zone and diving entry into T8L - the Chute. A fast, uphill hairpin in T9R, followed by an uphill straight which crests and falls away into a downhill braking zone for T10R, which is then followed by a short uphill straight. With 3 corners still to go in the lap, you can see the difference between previous events and this one. Gradient often changes a good track into a great one, and I think that nowhere is this exemplified better than at the Glen.

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The Race Director has some notes for drivers. Please see the track map above for location of Race Direction note:-

· General note – the kerbs at Watkins Glen are white sections - some raised, some flat - and not the normal multicoloured saw-toothed kerbs we see at most other tracks. Irrespective of this, the normal kerb rule applies, in that the kerb is deemed to be part of the track, but that advantage gained with any part of the wheels beyond the boundary of the kerb is deemed illegal.


· The Start / Finish straight is – like Melbourne - wide, with scope for manouever, and a relatively long run down to T1R, but unlike Melbourne the braking zone is steeply downhill, causing braking efficiency to be degraded. Like Melbourne, I would hope that we are all calm enough to realise that you can only lose a race in the first corner, and not win it. Again, I will not be posing a non-overtake rule there, but also again, if you suffer from an overly aggressive piece of driving from anyone, you are urged report it. For Lap1 - and Lap1 only - there will be no penalty for people going wide and over the kerbs on the outside of T1R, as long as it is only to avoid collisions. This should not be used to deliberately try and gain a racing advantage. If anyone loses a place to someone choosing to use this outside area and there is no accident or potential collision being avoided, you are urged report it.

· T5R & T6L is the Inner Loop Chicane. There are the normal Watkins Glen white kerbs lining this section, which are to be treated as track – but anyone straight-lining the chicane by using the grass or tarmac on the outside or inside of the corners will be deemed as taking an illegal line. Unlike any collision incidents, I urge anyone who witnesses habitual illegal cutting in this section to report it. The key word in the preceding sentence is “habitual”, so if someone drifts across the grass once or twice, that is not habitual. Cutting it every lap is habitual and should be reported. Because of the importance of cutting this section, and because it is a point scoring item - I will review the pole position lap, and if it includes a cut, I will levy a 2 sec penalty and then move down qualifying until I find a clean lap, and that driver will be awarded pole. This will be done after the race, and so will not affect the grid, but it will affect the total points scored.

· T12L is a fast, heavily cambered corner leading onto a short straight, but on the outside exit of this corner is some low friction sand and a very hard wall. People should be aware of the potential consequences of getting too creative in this corner, and more importantly, the consequences to other drivers if you do not give them enough respect in this section. the second half of a set of fast Esses – two wheels within the white lines on exit at all times.

· T13R is the entry to the S/F straight, and is crucial to a good lap, but there is a wall on the outside of this corner very close to the track – so impacts here will mean that the afflicted car will almost certainly remain on track, and on the racing line.

Incidents, Investigations and Penalties

After round 1 there are currently no outstanding Incidents or Investigations, but there are a few Penalties being levied.

4 no-show penalty infractions are being levied:-

Nigel Atkins
Piotrek Blaszczak
Simon Bacon
Stuart Neal

As it was the first race, and some people are new to GPCOS, I will be suspending the punishment until Race3, so if the drivers involved all allocate themselves correctly for Race2, I will rescind the infraction. If they do not, the infraction will stand.

As for Incident reports, let me make clear what I expect so that there are no confusions arising. I expect anyone who feels they have been affected by an incident to file a report. Let me re-stress that – anyone affected by an incident. The only times that I would like people who witness an infraction of penalty when they are not involved will be clearly marked - for instance in this race I have stressed the witnessing of cutting in the Inner Loop should be reported.

As for the waiting / no-waiting rule – in a League, there is no rule that says you have to wait after an incident, so I cannot enforce that as mandatory. However, what I can say is that, in my experience, causing an accident and then not waiting will have 2 major effects on you:-

  • You are more likely to be reported in the first place.
  • The penalty is likely to be heavier than if you waited by way of an apology and / or penitence.
Please read and digest the above, and then you can choose for yourself how you wish to behave. Either show the courtesy you would like to be shown by other people, or behave like a thug and take your chances with the penalty board. The choice is entirely up to you.

I hope that the above is clear to each and every driver.

Please remember, the League staff will only review incidents if they are reported to them.

No report = no review.

Please try and remember the incident reporting guidelines: review, cool off, review again. Only after following the above process, and if you are convinced you still need to report it, should you let the League staff know. Please give as much information as possible during the report (time of incident, drivers involved etc.)

Any accusations or complaints aired in the Chat during or after a race will mean a penalty levied on the person complaining or making the accusations, even if a subsequent official complaint gets found in their favour. I simply will NOT tolerate any post race finger pointing.

Liveries

You have chosen your car and livery already, and you must only drive your chosen car at any time during an RDHGP event. Every driver has a unique livery in this season of RDHGP.

Scoring System

I have extended the points distribution method down to P20 (75% distance completion required) so people can fight for some points no matter where they are on the track, and hopefully have a season long battle with people around them in the League.
The Distribution is as follows (double for the 200km event):

P1 - 25 pts
P2 - 22
P3 - 20
P4 - 18
P5 - 16
P6 - 15
P7 - 14
P8 - 13
P9 - 12
P10 - 11
P11 - 10
P12 - 9
P13 - 8
P14 - 7
P15 - 6
P16 - 5
P17 - 4
P18 - 3
P19 - 2
P20 - 1

1 point for fastest race lap (not double on 200km event)

1 point for qualifying on Pole (not double on 200km event)
 
That was an interesting night.

Did a PB in qualy (first time) to go middle order, not bad for me. Race start was really smooth in comparison to other, got away cleanly and made up ground as other fell apart on the grid. Was a little gutted to have to slow it down and restart because I was doing ok, but the restart was the right thing to do.

Qualy two, was OK, not a great lap but was under pressure. Middle order again.

Race start again, but this time a shocking get away, bags and bags of wheelspin and I lost a lot of time. Had a good opening lap in a group of 4/5 of us, but coming into the chicane on lap 2 (or 3) i was punted from behind by someone, not sure who though. Once i'd got back on track I had a good race, battled back to 15th and made a few good passes, had some good luck too with others going off. After a few more laps I was closing in on Carlos, but once the gap was at 4 seconds, i couldn't close up. I did get it down to 3.1 at one point, must have been a mind-bendingly good lap by my standards.....

Spent the latter half of the race trying in vain to catch carlos, I was focused on him so hard that I didn't notice Stuart creeping closer and closer every lap......

Stu did get through with an awesome move round the outside of the 'big dipper' - the right hander down the hill near the end of the lap. However he promptly stuffed it in T1 afterwards and I was back on carlos again.

After a couple more laps Stuart 'Ninja' Thomson was back on my tail and was able to get by again with another good move, I couldn't fight back after that, adn with predrag closing in I was pretty busy on the last lap. A really close finish for Carlos, Stuart, Predrag adn Myself. A great end to a good evenings racing, even if it was a little wierd at first.

Cheers adn Grats to all who stuck it out.
 
First of all i wanna thank the FF of GT Legends. O man that saved alot of times
Second if there is a way te experience hell on Earth then it must be trying to get the Vette through the inner loop. :D

First race.
No problems for me. Saw everybody on the grid. But restart was the best thing to do.

Race:

Started 21th after a bad Superpole. Had a great start as always with the Vette. Got a little tap in turn 1 so i lost some places. After that some very hard laps and got a tap at the exit of the inner loop wich caused me to spin. Was really struggeling with the car, but got some places (one time 3 at ones in T1) but also lost some places because of the stupid brakes. But had some nice fights with Lee, Bert and Arkadiusz. Last lap was a great example of Stuart his point system. Was on 17th place in the last lap when Arkadiusz had a little problem in Turn 6 i think. Because of that i was right on his tail 3 corners before the finish line. Most time i ease off because it was really close next to each other but because of the point system it was all or nothing in the 2 last corners because i wanted that extra point and i got it. :D

But for me it's clear now that i made a very bad car choice. Did after the event a lap with the 911 and was 4 seconds faster then the Vette.
But i made the choice so i need to suck it up it's my own fault. :wink2:


Thanks Stu for racing and see you guys next time.
 
race review:

started well and b4 T1 was like days of thunder ...smoke, lights, fenders , cars all over the place lol
made it trough as well !! didnt see any lag or probs..

2nd time round.. started even better..
took around 4-6 places after T1 (i think)
goin through the SS's I think i had very slight nudge on Green BMW and spun sorry I held up for him to regain I wasnt 100% i touched but...
I thought you had to yeald like i did.. if u disadvantaged someone? I didnt go off track but he made me suffer slight !! sorry for no names im still new an in the heat of the race its all blank hhah
later in the race I had spin sorry for the road block stu in the escy an couple of bmw's
anyway back to the race... made my way through the pack from 20 up to 15th and great fights with Ivo and Burt great fight burt I was putting you under pressure for sure haha you kept your head and i lost mine trying to hard .. i was in 15th place then as i was turning in .. the engine blurbed in mid corner coursing me to spin !! I was like WTF..?? a couple turns later I registered that it was running out stuttering and farting ..I was having a great race too really enjoying it and a mid table finish was looking ever more possible... but it wasnt to be... just bad luck on side again..
after the stress of not having a pc up till monday night then the trouble cos of W7 and gtl...I battled up to the last minute to make this race possible and for all my efforts... running out of bloody petrol in the last or second to last lap! which I have to ask...22laps of fuel not finishing 19 lap race??
although i did have fun and thanks for making it happen cheers guys:good:

congrats to the winners
 
OK let's clear a few things up:-

1. The results stand.
2. I can't do much more than give the people who had a problem a restart - or in Peter's case another quali lap as he stumbled over me as I was explaining - for the 6th time - the one lap quali procedure. I even spewed my own quali as I was typing round my outlap, and spewed it on freezing cold tyres.
3. If EVERYONE was having the problem, or it was EVERY driver in a particular car, then OK - I'd think possibly a bug. But - we've had big fields on there before without issue, as have other leagues/sites.

Am I sorry people had problems? Yes, of course. Anyone who thinks different can come and say so to my face.

Do I think it's my fault? No. I think I would have been totally justified in not ordering a restart and carrying on - but I didn't, everyone had another chance, effectively penalising the people who were fine and didn't have issues on the first start.

If I'd been able to load test these tracks, then possibly this track behaviour might (empasis on might) have been picked up as a pattern, but because we only get everyone turning up when there's points, I have to go with an educated guess, based on previous experience and research.

The fact that it seemed to be the same people affected each time - irrespective of the slot they had in the game (which I found after looking at the logs) - would seem to rule out the track as being at fault, IMO. If it was a pit box, or grid slot issue, it would always have been the people in the slots after the tracks coded capacity limit that would have been affected - that wasn't the case.
 
well without Ryan and Peter D it was rather easy race for me, also Leszek was very helpful :) creating train so I could switch to cruising mode and just taking car home, only when Peter G show up in my mirror I did few faster laps but still taking it easy, last two laps very little bit nervous with many traffic on the way but there were no problems and mission was completed successfully

I feel sorry for all people with problems but sometimes it goes like this and for sure for Stuart it was really hard time as I know from my experience with administration of leagues
 
So, who else has a bunch of cars with their wheels pointing left in their replay, and bouncing around all over the place?

Stu, I know you have already given too much of your time to this league, but if it's not too much to ask, could you pretty please post up the replay from the server? Maybe it will better than what I ended up with, which is crap.

Thanx in advance bud, even if you don't do it.:good:
 
So, who else has a bunch of cars with their wheels pointing left in their replay, and bouncing around all over the place

better than me I dont get a replay in any condition from online just sat in garage or in the pond like at melbourne :giggle:
I do get a hot lap mind there ok.. !
can any body tell me why this is ?? please?

would be good if you could Stu.. cheers mate :handshake:
 
OK, here's my race report. Sorry for all the screenshots, I got trigger happy with the F10 key :tongue::photo:

Lucky for me I drove the fastest lap ever during the second qualy and I placed 13th, which is not great but it's better than I ever expected considering the high caliber of drivers in this league. Funny thing is I never again got close to going as fast as I did during qualy. I guess it's because of all the extra fuel the car carries during the race, or maybe just nerves.

So...A few minutes into the race this is the pack that had formed and we took turns trading places for a little while.
The pack: myself (that's my wing), Tom, Bert, Jay, Stu, Drobac, and Lee.
gtl2009111311523499.jpg


Here I thought for sure Tom was going to pass me on the inside, but something happened and he backed off.
gtl2009111312010583.jpg



When Tom backed off Bert and Jay started to gain on me.
gtl2009111312232884.jpg



Shortly after that Jay gained on me quickly and was making me VERY nervous, lol. He was so close at times that I feared we would touch and go off spinning. But the guy is an awesome driver and never once touched me. Thanks Jay!
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Here I thought Jay would finally pass me for good and put my nerves to rest, but there was a right hander right after this and because I had the inside it put us sort of side by side as we exited the turn.
gtl2009111312485838.jpg


Bert was right behind us and on the turn exit, it turned into a 3 way drag race, which I lost. The second pic shows us about to enter T1 after the drag race. Lucky me, I had the inside again so I ended up right in front of Bert and Jay again on exit. Right after that I went wide and gave Jay enough space so he could move to bigger and better things, I knew he was faster than me anyhow, no point trying to keep him locked up.
gtl2009111312531233.jpg


gtl2009111312544002.jpg


During the above pics, Stu had been going through the pack and soon cought and passed me, along with Bert who is currently in front of Stu (not in the pic).
gtl2009111312562235.jpg


So now my nerves are being shaken by Tom, who is closely followed by Drobac and Lee.
gtl2009111312580613.jpg


Shortly after...Just as I think that a nice battle is about to begin between Tom and I, something happens and he spins out. Lee right behind him in this shot. Here you can also see that Jay has begun to permanently break away from the pack. We soon never saw him again.
gtl2009111313060359.jpg


Then, coming into the downhill righthander, Stu decides his escort doesn't have enough sand in the tires, and goes off into the sandpit in search of some:tongue1:. Allowing Bert and the rest of us to pass.
gtl2009111313104009.jpg


With Stu and Tom gone (for now anyway) Bert, Drobac, and I start to harass each other. Here we are going through the last turn right before the Start/Finish line.
gtl2009111313132999.jpg


Here we are going through the fast long turns right after T1. By the way, that red car back there is Kris, who had spun out and is now quickly regaining. In the next couple of picks you will see Kris drive right past us, as if we were just cruising on a Sunday morning, lolz.
gtl2009111313150520.jpg


Here I take the inside and I am going a bit to fast into the turn which causes me to understeer a bit and I end up bumping into Bert. :sorry: Bert!
Thankfully, no one wiped out so we kept on racing.

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Here, I go wide to let Kris get back to catching the faster boys upfront, but I go too wide and Bert and Drobac get by too.
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Well, I'm tired of :typing: so I'm gonna cut it short. At some point I pass Bert and end up alone for the rest of the race. I notice Tom behind me, he's a few seconds behind but never really gets close enough to fight with me. At some point he is joined and passed by Stu, the pic of the pass is included below along with some other random pics.

All in all, I had a wonderfull time at the beggining, trading places with the pack, but the fun died when a few of us broke off. I almost slowed down a bit to get into a fun little battle with Tom towards the end, but then I remembered that this is a league and that every point matters, so I kept my pace. I also noticed towards the end that Stu was closing in very fast. Lucky for me, the race was 19 laps and not 20, Stu would have surely passed me.

On to the screenies...
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My replay has a bunch of cars with the tires doing crazy stuff. I will upload it anyway, maybe if a few of us upload our replays Jari can peace them together and make one good movie from them.

I will upload it as soon as I get home. Where do I upload it to?
 
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