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RDHGP S4 - Race 2 - Watkins Glen, New York - 12/11/09

Discussion in 'GT Legends' started by Stuart Thomson, Sep 11, 2009.

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  1. Stuart Thomson

    Stuart Thomson
    The Stoat Without Fear ™ Premium Member

    Welcome to Round 2 of the RDHGP S4

    Welcome back to the 2009 RDHGP S4. I hope the shock of the Australian lightning in Round 1 didn’t diminish anyone’s eagerness for this League, and only left you clamouring for more of the same, or in some cases, the chance to put things right.

    The Albert Park track is very idiosyncratic, with lots of right angles, joined by short, squirty straights, and little or no elevation change. We are putting that right almost immediately, as we move north, from the Terra Australis to the Empire State. We all know Watkins Glen and its various incarnations, so I’m hopeful of a nice close race right through the field again.

    Last time, I wrote the following – “While by its very nature, the League environment is more competitive than the Club environment, please remember what makes the GTL Club so unique – our consideration for all other competitors at all times. Let’s try and carry this tradition of clean, fun and considerate racing over into a League environment … I would expect people to wait for someone they have taken off, even if it was accidental.”

    After a few pieces of confusion in the Australian aftermath, I will be clarifying my position in the Incidents, Investigations and Penalties section. I urge you all to read and process it, please.

    As predicted, the prevention of discussions about laptimes meant that no-one was particularly sure how their times stacked up until we all got on the server. I genuinely think that this is a good thing, and I hope everyone else does. I hope you will all respect the rule for the rest of the season, especially as we are changing track types fairly regularly this year, and so different cars will shine at different tracks. That in itself is a worthwhile result for keeping this rule in place.

    Circuit Notes

    Watkins Glen, in upstate New York, is one of the most created tracks in Sim Racing. We are all very familiar with it in all its incarnations. From the deceptively simple 1956-70 GP Circuit, the 1970 reprofiling of the Glen (turning T1 into “The Ninety”, removal of the “Speed Trap” and “Fast Bend”), to the 1975 introduction of the Inner Loop and The Boot section, allowing multiple layouts to be achieved with ease.

    RDHGP is using the “Long” layout, including the Boot and the Inner Loop sections. The Inner Loop will be discussed at some length in the Race Director Notes section below.

    The Glen is the first time this season we have encountered any real gradients this season (including the test events which were chosen to acclimatise people to the demands they’d be facing in Melbourne), so I expect it to be a nice shift of experience for us and will change the emphasis of our technique sharply in contrast with the preceding round(s).

    The downhill braking into T1R The Ninety, those fast uphill Esses where it is so easy to lose momentum, the diving T7R of the Outer Loop, followed by the downhill braking zone and diving entry into T8L - the Chute. A fast, uphill hairpin in T9R, followed by an uphill straight which crests and falls away into a downhill braking zone for T10R, which is then followed by a short uphill straight. With 3 corners still to go in the lap, you can see the difference between previous events and this one. Gradient often changes a good track into a great one, and I think that nowhere is this exemplified better than at the Glen.


    The Race Director has some notes for drivers. Please see the track map above for location of Race Direction note:-

    · General note – the kerbs at Watkins Glen are white sections - some raised, some flat - and not the normal multicoloured saw-toothed kerbs we see at most other tracks. Irrespective of this, the normal kerb rule applies, in that the kerb is deemed to be part of the track, but that advantage gained with any part of the wheels beyond the boundary of the kerb is deemed illegal.

    · The Start / Finish straight is – like Melbourne - wide, with scope for manouever, and a relatively long run down to T1R, but unlike Melbourne the braking zone is steeply downhill, causing braking efficiency to be degraded. Like Melbourne, I would hope that we are all calm enough to realise that you can only lose a race in the first corner, and not win it. Again, I will not be posing a non-overtake rule there, but also again, if you suffer from an overly aggressive piece of driving from anyone, you are urged report it. For Lap1 - and Lap1 only - there will be no penalty for people going wide and over the kerbs on the outside of T1R, as long as it is only to avoid collisions. This should not be used to deliberately try and gain a racing advantage. If anyone loses a place to someone choosing to use this outside area and there is no accident or potential collision being avoided, you are urged report it.

    · T5R & T6L is the Inner Loop Chicane. There are the normal Watkins Glen white kerbs lining this section, which are to be treated as track – but anyone straight-lining the chicane by using the grass or tarmac on the outside or inside of the corners will be deemed as taking an illegal line. Unlike any collision incidents, I urge anyone who witnesses habitual illegal cutting in this section to report it. The key word in the preceding sentence is “habitual”, so if someone drifts across the grass once or twice, that is not habitual. Cutting it every lap is habitual and should be reported. Because of the importance of cutting this section, and because it is a point scoring item - I will review the pole position lap, and if it includes a cut, I will levy a 2 sec penalty and then move down qualifying until I find a clean lap, and that driver will be awarded pole. This will be done after the race, and so will not affect the grid, but it will affect the total points scored.

    · T12L is a fast, heavily cambered corner leading onto a short straight, but on the outside exit of this corner is some low friction sand and a very hard wall. People should be aware of the potential consequences of getting too creative in this corner, and more importantly, the consequences to other drivers if you do not give them enough respect in this section. the second half of a set of fast Esses – two wheels within the white lines on exit at all times.

    · T13R is the entry to the S/F straight, and is crucial to a good lap, but there is a wall on the outside of this corner very close to the track – so impacts here will mean that the afflicted car will almost certainly remain on track, and on the racing line.

    Incidents, Investigations and Penalties

    After round 1 there are currently no outstanding Incidents or Investigations, but there are a few Penalties being levied.

    4 no-show penalty infractions are being levied:-

    Nigel Atkins
    Piotrek Blaszczak
    Simon Bacon
    Stuart Neal

    As it was the first race, and some people are new to GPCOS, I will be suspending the punishment until Race3, so if the drivers involved all allocate themselves correctly for Race2, I will rescind the infraction. If they do not, the infraction will stand.

    As for Incident reports, let me make clear what I expect so that there are no confusions arising. I expect anyone who feels they have been affected by an incident to file a report. Let me re-stress that – anyone affected by an incident. The only times that I would like people who witness an infraction of penalty when they are not involved will be clearly marked - for instance in this race I have stressed the witnessing of cutting in the Inner Loop should be reported.

    As for the waiting / no-waiting rule – in a League, there is no rule that says you have to wait after an incident, so I cannot enforce that as mandatory. However, what I can say is that, in my experience, causing an accident and then not waiting will have 2 major effects on you:-

    • You are more likely to be reported in the first place.
    • The penalty is likely to be heavier than if you waited by way of an apology and / or penitence.
    Please read and digest the above, and then you can choose for yourself how you wish to behave. Either show the courtesy you would like to be shown by other people, or behave like a thug and take your chances with the penalty board. The choice is entirely up to you.

    I hope that the above is clear to each and every driver.

    Please remember, the League staff will only review incidents if they are reported to them.

    No report = no review.

    Please try and remember the incident reporting guidelines: review, cool off, review again. Only after following the above process, and if you are convinced you still need to report it, should you let the League staff know. Please give as much information as possible during the report (time of incident, drivers involved etc.)

    Any accusations or complaints aired in the Chat during or after a race will mean a penalty levied on the person complaining or making the accusations, even if a subsequent official complaint gets found in their favour. I simply will NOT tolerate any post race finger pointing.


    You have chosen your car and livery already, and you must only drive your chosen car at any time during an RDHGP event. Every driver has a unique livery in this season of RDHGP.

    Scoring System

    I have extended the points distribution method down to P20 (75% distance completion required) so people can fight for some points no matter where they are on the track, and hopefully have a season long battle with people around them in the League.
    The Distribution is as follows (double for the 200km event):

    P1 - 25 pts
    P2 - 22
    P3 - 20
    P4 - 18
    P5 - 16
    P6 - 15
    P7 - 14
    P8 - 13
    P9 - 12
    P10 - 11
    P11 - 10
    P12 - 9
    P13 - 8
    P14 - 7
    P15 - 6
    P16 - 5
    P17 - 4
    P18 - 3
    P19 - 2
    P20 - 1

    1 point for fastest race lap (not double on 200km event)

    1 point for qualifying on Pole (not double on 200km event)
  2. Stuart Thomson

    Stuart Thomson
    The Stoat Without Fear ™ Premium Member

    Thread opened
  3. Just had wee go, and what a lovely track. After the fiddly technicality of Melbourne, it is a joy to drive a fast flowing track Big :good: :good: :good:
  4. Also couldn't resist spending 30 minutes on Glenn: Lovely! What a flow.
    I was about to make some pics/movie on how to/how not to handle the first chicane, but ran out of time. Hopefully tonight! (I will PM you Stuart)
  5. The chicane was really easy I felt, not much temptation to cut at all. At least in the 911 it was :D
  6. Stuart Thomson

    Stuart Thomson
    The Stoat Without Fear ™ Premium Member

    Empty track, no time pressure = chicane done properly
    In traffic, quali/time pressure = another story.
  7. I see your point, but I was surprised by how much room there was through there, having never driven the track before and only seen IndyCars go berserk through there earlier this year, including one Dario Franchitti.
  8. Stuart Thomson

    Stuart Thomson
    The Stoat Without Fear ™ Premium Member

    Again - there's loads of room when there's one of you, and your line isn't compromised, or there aren't cars faster than you all around through there.

    Once you're forced into taking, or choose to take, a non-optimal line, or trying to hang on to, or keep in front of, a faster car, we'll see just how roomy and easy it is, and just how readily people are tempted to resort to a cheeky cut or two.

    I may be surprised. I hope I am.
  9. You can really make up some time in the chicane if your brave enough, but I whole heartedly agree with the idea of reviewing qualy.

    Great breifing - i still can't believe how much effort you put into this league Stuart, it's insane the length you'll go to to make RD the place to be.
  10. Read the first post again Ben - it was for a no-show.
  11. Stuart Thomson

    Stuart Thomson
    The Stoat Without Fear ™ Premium Member

    Yes, you can ask, even though why you're asking as it doesn't affect you in any way is slightly beyond me.

    I asked Nigel, as he has withdrawn, to please change all his already done allocations to "Will not participate". He agreed to do so, but didn't, and so he picked up an infraction. Remember the phrase "already done".

    He was given one because anything disciplinary needs to be consistent. I'm sure everyone is happier knowing that all rules get applied equally to everyone in the League.

    The infraction (for ALL the drivers picking it up) has now been suspended for a race, so that if they allocate properly for Race2, it will not be enforced, so I've already given everyone a second chance, but again that's consistent to all offenders.

    As Nigel's pulled out, his correct allocation (technically) is no allocation - as I was only concerned with the already done allocations - so the infraction will be lifted for him after Race2, and not affect any subsequent races in any subsequent leagues.

    Hopefully that's clear enough for you.

    Anyway, back to discussion for the build up of this race.
  12. Also did some testing Sunday, but I must say that I preferred Melbourne much more :D

    This is mainly due to the less longer medium speed turns @ Albert Park.
    I keep having troubles @ finding the proper speed to enter these longer turns so I get to punch it right after the apex without losing my race line ... it's like, "now I can hit it, no, wait, now, ... no, that was too early... rrrh " lol

    @ Melbourne, all you needed was to find a proper mark to brake and a sensitive foot on the throttle ... here, I don't know but I bet Ivo will have loads of fun in his corvette :) hehe just hope to not have him in front of me as this corvette takes off awfully quick and is huge =))
  13. Stu, do You plan to start server for training before the race?

    Circuit is fine, but these fast parts show weakness of Escort :(

    I also think that the wall behind turn 11 can be place of some disaster ;)
  14. Stuart Thomson

    Stuart Thomson
    The Stoat Without Fear ™ Premium Member

    Yes Roman, I will start the League server immediately after the Tuesday 10th event finishes (65 Muscle @ Magny Cours), but you can always train offline until it's up.

    Also, I think we need to accept that the people who've picked the 911 & the 906 have picked the fastest all-round cars in the League. Some drivers will have picked them purely for that reason, while for others it will merely be a nice bonus.

    I hope that the rest of us picked our cars for reasons other than outright speed (I know I certainly did), and that no-one gets too disheartened by not being up the sharp end all the time, and looks to have their battles against their nearest rivals, whoever they may turn out to be. Last season I picked the wrong car for me, this season, I picked exactly the car I always intended to drive, even though I knew it wouldn't be a contender - because I enjoy driving it so much.
  15. edit
  16. You're wright Stu, i almost forgotten why i choose the BMW. It was because i wanted to learn race better. So indeed, i should not let the face hang!

    Porsches will be the fastest indeed, but i wasn't worried about that to be honest, it was just the handling of the car. But i now already know it was Melbourne overall not being a good track for me. This one is different though. :)
    Time to put things right!
  17. I picked the Vette because i want to scare people when i am behind them (or in front, right or left) :D

    All joking a side. My Chevy heart can't handle it when i don't pick it when there is a option to choose one. And i like to drive it. Drifting is his middle name and i enjoyed myself at Melbourne even when i was the most of the time alone. :)
  18. I have chosen Escort, because I used to have one :)
    I don't care that Ford can't keep pace of Porsche, opposite it's always gives me some kind of satisfaction when I manage to be faster in slower car.
  19. I was just lucky that the Porsche was quick, having never driven any of the GTC76 cars before I chose it :D.

    Although my particular Porsche, and all 911s with the big wing will suffer BIG time when it comes to Le Mans. This place, with it's fast corners, is the place to take advantage of the 'big wing' Porsche's higher downforce over the lower downforce version that Peter and Jari are driving for example.
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