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Pacenotes: Advice on Categorization

Discussion in 'Richard Burns Rally' started by WorkerBee, Jan 22, 2012.

  1. I have some questions regarding the categorization of pace notes.

    Maybe some of you native speakers out there may help in this task.

    Category BENDS (or would you preferably say CORNERS?):
    HAIRPINLEFT, 90_LEFT etc.

    Category MODIFIER or MODIFIERS
    Tightens, Tightens Bad, Narrows, Wide Out, Cut, Don't Cut, Long, Maybe

    Category LINKS
    Distance Call, And, Into, Onto, Callout Time, Callout Distance

    Category RACING LINE
    Keep Left, Keep Middle, Keep Right, Twisty, Go Straight

    Category ROAD CONTOUR
    Jump, Over Crest, Ford, Bump

    Category OBSTACLES
    Caution, Bridge, Caution Water

    So, what do you think of the wording and phrases ?

    Any help would be appreciated.

    Cheers
    Uncle G.
     
  2. As obviously no one seems to be interested in grouping pace notes into categories I think I have to detail what I would have needed your help for.

    Following the excerpt of the readme:

    Pacenote Plugin (Version 1.0) for RBR 1.02 SSE
    ==============================================

    This plugin for Richard Burns Rally features a pacenote editor, an enhanced
    pacenote callout handler and a camera editor.

    1. Pacenote Editor
    * edit pace notes of all types of tracks (Standard RBR, add-on, BTB)
    * add, edit and delete pace notes
    * edit pace notes in normal driving mode
    * edit pace notes while watching a replay
    * add arbitrary custom pace notes by defining new pace note IDs
    * prevent the emission of AND/INTO/ONTO calls between adjacent pace notes
    * move the callout of a pace note forward or backward dynamically without
    actually changing the location of the pace note
    * move by time (callout time)
    * move by distance (callout distance)
    Rembember that the standard "callout distance" specified in the pacenote
    options of RBR has always a fixed value (one square = 0.5s).
    * configure the editor UI to suit your needs by grouping the pace notes into
    user defined categories

    Additional features:
    * jump forward or backward to any location on the stage in driving mode as
    well as in replay mode
    * halt and resume replay, e.g. to edit pace notes
    * show enhanced FPS
    * show camera position and direction
    * show driveline bar
    * show the HUD/DASH in replays

    * save the pace notes to a BTB pacenotes.ini file
    * export the pace notes in a tabular file format for importing into your
    favourite spreadsheet application


    2. Pacenote Callout Handler
    * replace any pace note callout sound with custom OGG sound files
    * emits already "visited" pace notes again if you move your car a bit
    backwards
    * emits pace note callouts during replay


    3. Camera Editor
    * edit the standard RBR cameras (cam_bonnet, cam_bonnet2, cam_internal) in an
    easy-to-use dialog in driving mode as well as in replay mode (WYSIWYG)
    * save the changes to the car specific INI file
    * add, edit an save an unlimited number of user-defined cameras stored in a
    separate config file (cameras.ini)
     
  3. WOW.

    I am speechless... except to say that...

    I thought it was a bloody disgrace that people seemed to ignore THE TOOL MASTER, and I was actually sketching some sort of a reply last evening, even though Rally English isn't really one of my strengths and I may very well be typing out of my backside here, but despite all that, these are my suggestions:

    1) "Corners" perhaps is the right term indeed, also seen "curves" used, but since Nicky Grist talks exclusively about "corners" in his video guide to co-driving, you really can't go wrong with that. :)

    2) "Modifiers" may be a valid term, but I'd still prefer the term "suffixes". Can be highly debatable, I guess.

    3) "Contours"... Had to check the dictionary for this one, never have come across that word :). "Hazards" may have too strong a meaning, but I would probably still go for "hazards". And also include "bridge" to those "hazards". And "Obstacles" would be more like "Warnings" in my book. (Source: Rally Championship 2000 co-driver folders)

    Although it has to be said that "caution" is an interesting one in RBR, since it can be a warning of "potential problems" ahead, but also it can be a particular kind of hazard (not a bump but the opposite of that, whatever they're called in English, "holes in the road", I don't know. :) Prospect Ridge has couple of that kind of "cautions".

    Hopefully this will help you, workerbee, and indeed wake up the community. :)
     
  4. I only didnt reply because I dont know anything about this...
     
  5. Warren Dawes

    Warren Dawes
    Premium Member

    I think that is a bit harsh, considering it was only posted a day ago. Maybe given a bit more time to think about the question might have brought more response.
    TBH, I didn't reply immediately because I also don't feel comfortable about my knowledge of Pacenote Editing in RBR. It's a bit of a dark art for most of us, and i'd say most members here aren't experienced enough to feel confident advising on the topic.

    However, Workerbee's help and support here is always welcomed, and I would think he knows that. ;)
     
  6. Not ignoring, saw it immediately, but English is not my first language, so left this for the Aussies and Brits to answer.


    He only needed help in phrasing of the categories :p
     
  7. Warren Dawes

    Warren Dawes
    Premium Member

    Maybe so, but at the time it was first posted, yesterday :rolleyes: , I wasn't sure what it was needed for or why it was being asked.
    Sorry WorkerBee, but your work is highly respected by most of us here.
     
  8. I didn't mean to offend the community in any way, but I do love my overstatements. It was hardly "disgraceful", let's just say I found it surprising that no English speakers did react, not even out of healthy curiosity - when I found the original question quite peculiar and somewhat teasing myself. :) So it was more like porridge being porridge-y again, and I do apologise if I upset anyone with my childish antics. Anyway, instead of watering down my "typings", I'd like to raise a couple of points, even though I naturally understand if Workerbee probably didn't want to discuss his project any further at this stage, so best leave it for now.

    It does sound promising, it really does.
     
  9. This sounds like a brilliant addon!
    All of your initial categories seem logical to me;

    "corners" is definitely better than "bends".

    I prefer "modifiers" but as porridge said, it's debatable!

    I'd rather "contours" as it describes more the shape of the road.

    "obstacles" would be better as "hazards"

    I look forward to your next RBR masterpiece :)
     
  10. i must look into 'pace notes'
     
  11. Tomas Reinicke

    Tomas Reinicke
    Premium Member

    I'm been following this on the GVRC forum and it looks very promising!
    The correct terms I leave to the native english speekers here.

    When can we have a version to test.
     
  12. Jimi Hughes

    Jimi Hughes
    RDMCC S6 Champion

    My input on this would be maybe change 'Racing Line' to 'Positioning'?

    English is my first language and I would refer to the 'positioning' of the car over jumps or crests etc.

    Corners would be the correct term instead of 'bends', other than that I agree witht he rest of them, or at least for now I cant think of anything that explains it better.

    EDIT: Also, i Agree that Hazards is better than obsticals
     
  13. Warren Dawes

    Warren Dawes
    Premium Member

    I think all of the proposed terms in the original post are ok, except that I would use "Hazards" instead of Obstacles, "Corners" or "Turns" is maybe better than Bends.

    Looks like a very good Mod being developed here, great work "Uncle". :)
     
  14. I've only just seen this post but would like to help where I can with this mod - would be happy to do some pre-release testing if that helps - sound like you've put a lot of effort into this Workerbee - Well Done !!!!
    Pete
     
  15. Thanks for clarifying, I simply wasn't sure about the bends/corners thing.

    I took the RBR manual as first reference. This one is talking about bends, road contour and such stuff, so I sticked to it.
    I have also been thinking about "positioning" as a valid category.

    One note on the "caution" thing:
    Internally RBR has two "caution" IDs being mapped to the same CAUTION sound.
    But the small 3D icons for these notes shown on screen actually are different.
    The first is more orange, the second red.
    So I mapped this to CARE and CAUTION, this is for sure what the original developers actually aimed for.
    On the other hand there is a separate CARE in RBR, but this one has not been implemented to the end and had been left as work in progress in the original product.

    Maybe I could publish a list with the new pacenote IDs to be discussed and fixed by this now-woken-up community ;)

    Cheers
    Uncle G.
     
  16. Have a look at the pacenote plugin with all features activated simultaneously:

    [​IMG]

    Finally, I have changed some of the categories.
     
    • Like Like x 7
  17. Is there going to be the opportunity to have numeric ascending or descending with the new notes?
     
  18. Anyway you like it.

    1 LEFT or LEFT 1 up to 6 LEFT, LEFT 6 ...

    ascending, descending

    Just a matter of the definition in the INI file shipped with the pacenote plugin.
    Pacenotes.numeric-asc.ini, Pacenotes.numeric-desc.ini, Pacenotes.numeric-swapped.ini ect ect
    You can easily switch between the pacenote variants by specifying the appropriate ini file.
    No need to change or copy sound files or modify audio.dat or whatever.

    You can define your own categories and the pacenote layout in the GUI TABs.

    Unfortunately the plugin-friendly RSRBR renames the PaceNote.dll to render it useless.
    As usual PaceNote plugin was designed to work with vanilla RBR or any other plugin like TrainingDay, QuickRace, SingleRally, CZ plugin, FixUp, RX-plugin. This is 6:1 for the all-stars.
    The "hidden" attribute trick doesn't seem to work anymore as one of my testers reported. Clever, these RSRBR guys.
     
  19. That's an impressively detailed setup program you've created there, nice one!
    Surely you can just contact the RSRBR guys and find out how to get their code to play nice with yours. I would imagine they'd be pretty keen to get this incorporated into a future update anyway.
     
  20. Warren Dawes

    Warren Dawes
    Premium Member

    Yep, that would be great.
    They included the FixUp mod in RSRBR, so maybe they will also look at this one. ;)