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Major Head Movement @ Montreal In Formula V12

Discussion in 'Stock Car Extreme' started by Jason Murphy, Apr 2, 2014.

  1. Ive got head movement set to 1% but i can't hardly keep an eye on the track at the end of the back stretch because my screen is vibrating and moving so much its making me sick. Whats the best way to fix this? Ive not had this issue with other cars/tracks.
  2. I would suggest installing the plugin RealHeadMotion and set your head movement to 0
    1st read this about what is going on
    Then to the following link and download the zip file. Extract the 2 files dll and ini
    and put them in your GSC2013/plugins folder with other plugins.
    You mus use the rfactor1 plugin not the rfactor2:
    The web page for the download as some instructions for PLR changes that you must put in every profile. Copy of this is below
    First, edit the file\rFactor\UserData\player\player.PLR

    And change those lines like this

    Cockpit Vibration Mult1="0.00000" // Primary vibration multiplier affects eyepoint position (base magnitude is in VEH or cockpit file)
    Cockpit Vibration Freq1="0.00000" // Primary rate of vibration affects eyepoint position (higher framerates allow higher rates)
    Cockpit Vibration Mult2="0.00000" // Secondary vibration multiplier affects eyepoint orientation (base magnitude is in VEH or cockpit file)
    Cockpit Vibration Freq2="0.00000" // Secondary rate of vibration affects eyepoint orientation
    Car Vibration Mult1="0.00000" // Vibration multiplier affects cameras attached directly to the car
    So the internal rFactor/gsc camera vibration will not interfere
    Then set the max pitch/roll as default =>
    Look Up/Down Angle="0.40000" // Angle to look up/down (pitch) w/ controller in radians (= degrees / 57)
    Leanahead Angle="0.00000" // Angle to lean head (roll) w/ steering in radians (= degrees / 57)
    Look Roll Angle="0.75000" // Angle to lean head (roll) w/ controller in radians (= degrees / 57)
    Then copy RealHeadMotion.dll in \rFactor\Plugins
    Now it's ok :)

    Configuration File
    It must be in same directory than the DLL file.
    Default commented .ini in ZIP archive.

    To check if its working, drive a car slowly in the grass along side of the track.
    The cockpit will move around and the horizon will be much more steady and
    not move around which is what causes the motion sickness.

    There are 2 other suggested changes if ReadHeadMotion is not enough in this thread
  3. I think i'll just wait and hope they patch....
  4. It does sound like they have some track/car issues.

    You might try the simple setting head motion = 0 in the IN GAME settings.

    You can also try a larger FOV In Game settings.
    A larger FieldOfView just reduces the movement amount since it makes distance objects smaller. But at some point a very large FOV (field of view) is not very realistic.
    I use 45 to 50deg. The way to calculate it is based on your widthl monitor size (w) and the distance from your eyes to the front monitor (d) per this document.
    Some people use the height of the monitor instead of the width and use a really low value of FOV but I find this TOO jumpy and get motion sick is I spin out or crash.

    In the PDF it shows you that you have to solve a simple trig equation since GSC does not have a built in function to do it for you. Then you edit the FOV value in the OPTION DISPLAY panel.
    2 * arctan (0.5 * w / d)
    For the trig

    If you need any help with other changes just contact me anytime.

  5. I tried Montreal in a V12 just now and yes same problem with vibration as at Brasilia Full. But at Montreal you can not get up to the very high speed that you can at Brasilia Full which makes high speed corners like driving on marbles. Dont you just get irritated or confused when you can not read the turn distance markers.
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2014
  6. Jason,
    For me, the realhead motion plugin solved any motion sickness problems.
    If all that editing information is putting you off, you do NOT need to change any of those plr settings. Just download RealHeadMotion by magicfr, extract the dll and config files and put those two files into your GSC plugins folder. That is all.
    You will still find an immediate improvement. I have used the plugin with and without the plr settigns and they are not essential to cure the motion sickness feeling. I cannot recommend it highly enough.

    If your problem is NOT the motion sickness, then please specify which track and car so we can have a look, but I have not seen any problem in any track, the bumps seem very realistic to me.

    Hope that helps :)
  7. I looked at about 6 other tracks running with V12 this morning. I was looking for unusable vertical vibrations.
    I thought most of them might not have long enough straights to get up the the threshold where the combination of road texture and speed seem to cause a problem. But you can get up to speeds as fast or faster than on Montreal and Brasilia. Like you I also was not too bothered with the main straight of Campo Grande 295km/h, Caruaru straight at 285, Cordoba at 295, and the fastest track I tried was Interlagos External Ring at 310km/h.
    Yes some vertical bumps but no constant shaking.
    Since I dont know the details in the track texture file its hard to compare. Maybe its also related to how much background information has to be rendered in the images. I have all the display parms set to the max image quality. Maybe I need to reduce the detail as well as check the frame rates.
    Before changing the image detail I used the garage and changed items tire pressure, a suspension settings from min to max hoping to see some change in the frequency of the vibration or amplitude. NO CHANGE. FPS average was 320.

    Then I restarted the game to reset the car settings, I went to the OPTIONS DISPLAY I turned down or turn off all the DISPLAY settings and the FPS went up to average of 571, BUT NO CHANGE IN THE vertical VIBRATION amplitude or frequency.
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2014
  8. Renato Simioni

    Renato Simioni
    Reiza Studios

    As explained to Rick via PM, even after you set head motion to 0% in-game and turn "CockpitVibrationMag=" down to 0 in the vehicle´s cockpitinfo.ini file to neuter head movement relative to the car, there will still be vibration from the vehicle itself in the case of the V12 and other super-stiff cars like it along a rough bumpy surface such as the backstraight of Montreal. It´s an extra challenge from the car / track combo, not an "issue" any more than running under shadows from trees or through a cloud of smoke.
    • Like Like x 1
  9. I got it. Live with it or drive a slower car or one with suspension that does not react to the texture/bumps as much.

    As for AI vs me compare: I assume the following: AI has less vibration because the GSC authors have to mod my car under the covers to allow AI track speed control as a function of the % setting. The AI driving car gets much less tire slip as shown by MoTeC analysis and therefor AI can take the corners faster since the texture/bumps that create a average lower friction dont cause him to go wider. AI also ends up with more effective braking performance.
  10. Renato Simioni

    Renato Simioni
    Reiza Studios

    Yeah the AI has its own simplified physics model, which among other things generally includes a softening multiplier for the suspension rates.
  11. @Reiza Studios I understand when you say it's "realistic" but please give us the option to reduce it at our will (like the rear mirrors etc). There's no way to drive more than two laps at Montreal and generally I'm not much sea sickness sensitive.
    We hear from various Devs: "no steering lock it's not realistic", "camera movement as it should be" etc, but don't forget we are behind a single monitor, sitting in our office chair with our A/C on and a couple of beers next to us. How realistic is this?

    Don't get this the wrong way. I really LOVE your games and the way you handle your costumers/us, and it's very appreciated.
    Just see this as a positive feedback or maybe a wish

    ps My English is limited, so if the above sounds a little harsh, it's not my intention.
    • Like Like x 1
  12. Maybe Reiza would be willing to tell us how to mod the suspension to soften this vibration amplitude to the point that V12s would be fun to drive even if its "not realistic." Even just the 2x improvement that AI shows would be enough. Any chance?
  13. Renato Simioni

    Renato Simioni
    Reiza Studios

    Not that simple, you can´t just apply AI physics to the player. You *could* raise the ride height by 1-2cm and soften springs all the way down so that it would absorb the bumps a bit better... It wouldnt drive any better mind you, might as well just take any of the touring or street cars in the sim :)

    We appreciate the feedback gents, just understand that we´re not deliberately aiming for something with this issue, it´s just the way it is - the car is stiff, the road is bumpy, the car vibrates and with it your POV... A head motion physics system that can absorb part of that vibration would be a solution, but we cant promise that.
  14. Thanks for the comments. How would I also set SLOW and FAST bump parms?
    Fast Bump and Repound to lowest value?

    I found this with a google search.

    Fast Bump
    Controls the rapid UPWARD movement of this suspension corner following bumps and curbs. Called "Fast" because the damper is moving *up* (compressing) in a rapid motion, usually above 100mm/sec (use telemetry). So this adjustment controls how a tyre conforms to the road as it's negotiating the leading edge-to-peak of a bump or road undulation. If you find the car pushing to the outside of the track in a "skating" fashion over bumps, then soften (lower) this setting. If find the car floating and changing direction erratically, then stiffen (higher) this setting. When in doubt, go softer
    Fast Rebound
    Controls the rapid DOWNWARD movement of this suspension corner following bumps and curbs. Called "Fast" because this damper is moving down (extending) in a rapid motion, usually above 100mm/sec (use telemetry). So this adjustment controls how a tyre conforms to the road as it's negotiating the peak-to-trailing edge of a bump or road undulation. If you've changed the bump setting, then it's usually a good idea to change this setting in a similar manner.

    Last edited: Apr 6, 2014
  15. Anestis,
    I have given up on trying to make the car softer, I just can NOT get enough reduction in the vibration on these tracks. I also want to drive this car more than 2 laps on Brasilia and Montreal, so I gave up on the cockpit view.

    I made the default view TV Cockpit and hacked 3 lines in the following file.
    This makes the driving the fast V12 FUN with at least 2x vibration reduction that I can live with.

    TV cockpit changes in red. This will give you a starting point.

    Edit the file GameData/Vehicles/F_V12/F_V12_Cams.cam

    Fov=(50.000000, 50.000000) // adjust depending on what you like to see
    Color=(164, 218, 249)
    ClipPlanes=(0.075000, 500.000000)
    Size=(1.000000, 1.000000)
    Center=(0.500000, 0.500000)
    RadiusLimits=(0.00000, 0.00000)
    OrientationRate=(40.00000, 40.00000, 40.00000)
    PositionOffset=(0.00000, 0.0600000, -0.14500)
    //(+Left-Right, +Up-Down, +Back,-Forward)
    OrientationOffset=(0.000, 0.000000, 0.0)
    //(+Up-Down, +Left-Right, Roll: +Left-Right)

    I added the comment lines in blue to aid in minor changes you might want to make later.

    Remember to create a backup of this file 1st.
    And also a backup of your changes since when you run GSCsync for updates this file will get restored and your changes will go with it.

    I could can not get the TV camera back in the drivers helmet location without the visor hiding everything or showing up on the side monitors so you have to trade off Fov and the forward/back location of the camera and adjust the up and down to see the rear view mirrors and not see the wind visor of the helmet. I dont really care about seeing the dash and wheel which I turn off once I see is looks about the right size.

    There might be a way to turn off the drivers head/helmet/body in the PLR but I have not found the variable. If one could you could move the camera back more.
    I tried these variables but they did not help.
    Shadows In TV Cockpit="0"
    Self In TV Rearview="0"
    Self In Cockpit Rearview="0"
  16. Please don't take this the wrong way, and if I could offer any help I would, but I must give an opinion from the point of view of others who are enjoying the new V12 just as it is.
    I usually only ever do 100% distance GP races. I have not had time to do that with the V12s yet, but I have raced 40 laps as a test, in the V12 at Montreal, not to mention countless practice laps, and I had a FANTASTIC race. I did NOT have any problem with the vibration, this car is truly awesome.

    So I for one would certainly NOT want to see it edited out.

    Again, if I could help in any way I will, but I am just stating for the record that I think Reiza have got this one spot on and personally would not want to see it changed.

    My FOV is set to 35 IIRC (triple monitor, non-multiview, cockpit view), don't know if that is making any difference to the appearance of the vibrations.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  17. @Keith Windsor I can totally understand that many people like this(including me up to a point), I don't want from Reiza to just turn it off.
    What I'd like to see is an option so I can set it wherever I think it's good for me and if this consider as an advantage against other drivers add some kind of penalty(just saying, I don't even know if this is possible) What I want to say is that I don't care if without the vibrations I become faster or slower, because the way it's now I can't play and have fun at all. (at least to some tracks)
    I own Reiza's games from day one and I haven't regretted not a single moment, so again don't take this wrong:)
  18. I understand completely, Anestis, I did not want to come across as arguing, I just wanted Reiza to know that there were differing opinions out here.

    I agree an option to adjust it would be a great answer for everyone.

    (I know I mentioned it already in an earlier post, but if you have not tried it already, why not take a look at RealHeadMotion plugin, it really does help remove motion sickness feeling by giving a more realistic movement of the car around the driver).
    • Like Like x 1
  19. I know what you mean, never came as arguing.
    I already use the "realheadmotion" plugin to all the sim it supports(gsc,fr2,ac) but thanks.