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Lack of decent rallycross in sim-racing.

Discussion in 'Other Racing Games' started by Dan Allen, Apr 10, 2015.

  1. Dan Allen

    Dan Allen
    I am the Pastor Maldonado of RaceDepartment.

    Me again.

    I just wanted to uh "put forward an observation" to you guys...

    I recently DL'ed & installed the new DiRT 3 Complete Edition (bloody awesome by the way), and I've got into the rallycross racing. It's a hell of a lot of fun, but I feel it's not entirely realistic.

    1) Where are the joker laps?
    2) Not convinced about the driving physics. I get the impression Dirt is just another simcade trying to pass itself off as a sim.

    So why is rallycross so poorly represented in the world of true "sim" racing ? It's a fantastic motorsport, it could really do with the realistic treatment. I mean, imagine having RX cars & tracks in AC? Could be a lot of fun!

    Wouldn't you just love to see this in your fav sim? -


    I think it would also be interesting to hear what @Reiza Studios and @Jay Ekkel's opinions are on this...
     
    • Like Like x 4
  2. Slalom823

    Slalom823
    RDTCC S10 Champion Premium Member

    The most accurate sim that has something similar might be live for speed. There could be rallycross type mod tracks for Richard burns but it would still be single player I believe. If you haven't tried live for speed it has a free demo and I think it may have rallycross in that.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  3. Besides for the joker lap all sims that allow for modded tracks should be able to do this.

    Remember there is the next car game. Not sure when it´s supposed to be officially released.
     
  4. Dan Allen

    Dan Allen
    I am the Pastor Maldonado of RaceDepartment.

    Live For Speed sounds interesting, I'll have to look into that.

    @Pär Öqvist - They SHOULD be able to, but they don't. I haven't seen any RX car mods or track mods. I don't want something which is similar to RX, I want something that IS RX, if that makes sense :)

    EDIT: I checked out LfS, doesn't look like rallycross, but it does have autocross. I imagine rallycross to be a mix of sealed surface and loose surface.
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2015
  5. Autocross?? LFS don't containt that type of track. (In Europe the Autocross means, that a closed circuit racing, and the whole track is mud or gravel.)

    Doesn't look like rallycross? Check this video:


    LFS has 3 racing style
    -Circuit Racing
    -Rallycross
    -Slalom (When in the big parking lot, you drive beetween cones.) (Maybe in America, they said this is Autocross or AutoX)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  6. Dan Allen

    Dan Allen
    I am the Pastor Maldonado of RaceDepartment.

    Oh wow. Maybe I'll have to download then! When I had a look at the site, it said autocross. I thought it was funny because I'm in the UK, so my idea of RX is clearly the same as yours...
     
  7. Ole Marius Myrvold

    Ole Marius Myrvold
    JWB 96-13 Staff

    @Dan Allen
    rF have heaps of RX :)

    RWD Rallycross The mod was supposed to be a full Division 1 release (from the European RX rules with Gr.A cars 1987-1993), but due to time constraints, it was released in a watered down release.

    MINI Cross Entry Level old Mini Cooper RX, FWD and very fun!

    Rallycross Group B. 1987-1993 Div.2 RX, same physics on all cars, for maximum fun!

    Rallycross 2.11 Based on RX Group B. With 5 additional cars, unique physics for each car!

    207 WRC If I'm not totally wrong this mod includes a ERX-version as well.

    Then you have a mod I won't include here, due to question marks over legality. Which is supposed to be the 2014 World RX Champ. Now, some cars/skins combos in that mod doesn't work. The newly made tracks are awfully optimized. With major framedrops. Quite a big disappointment!
     
    • Like Like x 2
  8. Dan Allen

    Dan Allen
    I am the Pastor Maldonado of RaceDepartment.

    Wow, thanks for this! Much appreciated, didn't know they existed. Looking forward to trying the Rallycros 2.11 :)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  9. Ole Marius Myrvold

    Ole Marius Myrvold
    JWB 96-13 Staff

    ^^, I didn't get all of my input into that mod, but it is a great little thing.

    I uploaded a package of "Dirty Tracks" as well :) Should AFAIK include all the released RX-tracks from the 80's + Sosnova in The Czech Republic. As well as the new tracks, (some are quite bad optimized as I said). Plus the LFS-RX track, Madcowies fantasy Mid-Ohio RX. Fantasy RX of Mills Metropark and Toban (ISI tracks) and Fantasy RX of Norisring.
    Plus autocross tracks. 6-7 Stadium SuperTruck gravel tracks and some rally stages as well (really recommend to just try the Peyregrosse stage).
    There is a readme included, not a huge bit of information there, but it contains some info regarding the bad-optimized tracks etc. :)
    I do think all RX-tracks made for rF is included here!

    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/28015720/DirtyTracks.zip

    EDIT: Tagging you as well :) @Dan Allen
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. Dan Allen

    Dan Allen
    I am the Pastor Maldonado of RaceDepartment.

    Unfortunately, that's rF1, I only have rF2 and have no idea how to convert these things... :(

    But thanks though! Much appreciated :)
     
  11. Some month ago we talking about this, in our RichardBurnsRally forum.
    In RBR only one car in the track even if you play online, so no opportunity for RX.
    Some RX track is made for RBR, but you can only run 2-3 lap on it.
    For example Slomzyn from Poland is released for RBR.

    When we talking about it, I reviewed all the game which i tried for rallycross:

    CMR-Dirt1
    Ai: Don't remember
    Physics: not so good, strange
    Graphics: good
    Cars: good
    Tracks: good, real RX tracks

    CMR-Dirt2-3
    Ai: good
    Physics: A bit arcade, slippery, but fun!
    Graphics: good
    Cars: good
    Tracks: good, but not real RX tracks, some of them are in mines, and in cyties....

    LFS
    Ai: good
    Physics: good
    Graphics: A bit old.
    Cars: 5-6 different fantasy car.
    Tracks: Only 3 tracks...

    These games biggest problem is, that we can't mod them, we can't make new tracks, cars.

    Modable games:

    Rfactor
    Ai: very bad
    Physics: bad (on gravel)
    Graphics: average
    Cars: Various good cars, a lot of new cars DS3, 208, Fiesta, and other RWD RX cars.
    Tracks: A lot of RX tracks released, most of them is real track.
    (Some of them is converted from the ISI's old game, from SCGT :D )

    Rfactor2
    There is a gravel track for rF2, but can't tried it yet. I saw it in video, but I didn't see so good movement of the car. (The car was a simple toruing car. Samara :) )

    In rF1 and rF2 the online gaming has more fun, than racing again AI's.


    I finally, this is the game in which I get a best rallycross/autocross feeling:

    Cross Racing Championship 2005
    Ai: If I remember well, its good.
    Physics: good, not so slippery as Dirt2-3
    Grafika: good
    Cars: fantasy, but you can build them as you want rwd, fwd,awd, engines, gearboxes, etc...
    Tracks: fantasy, but well designed, race tracks.



    This is game was made in our country, in Hungary. Maybe it was not so succes because it need a bigger system performance. And some other good game released in 2005.
    And a bit hard to set up the wheel/controller for it.
    But it has a lot of features what is not include in the others.
    Example it has animated driver, who put the gearbox 3d model to its real position when he switch gear, or turn the wheel more than 180 degree.
    If you didn't have steering wheel, you can steer with mouse.
    Or you can use mouse to move the gearbox "stick" :D
    You can race in cross/circuit/"street" tracks.
    And it is modable from the start. They give us, good tutorials, sample files.

    There was a lot mods for it, but not real, and new RX cars and tracks. Maybe if I had time, and I was learnt 3dsMax before, I made some real RX track or cars. Now I haven't time for modding, and playing so much. Every 2-3 year, I search the game's DVD, install, play on it some week, then I delete.

    Ohh I forget, that Flatout 1, was not so bad, but that is not modable, and they new game the Wreckfest is good too, but our PC's performance is a bit weak for it.

    Ohh, the most popular sim game, the Assetto Corsa, is not for rally, or RX....
    I tried some gravel tracks, those are very bad, slippery, I think worst than Dirt2-3...

    In the future, maybe we get some good game.

    http://piboso.com/
    Piboso develop 4 game paralel. (motocross, gokart, circuit racingcar and bike simulations)
    In his racing car game, the World Racing Series there is an Fiesta RX car, and a Dirt car model, but no gravel track yet, maybe after the motorcross game, he integrate that physics into WRS.

    Milestone
    The WRC1-4 and MotoGP/SBK game develeper's new game will be the Sebastian Loeb Rally Evolution, which will contain RX tracks.
    The game features:
    – Around 300 Kilometres of tracks
    – 8 different rallies, 5 rallycross tracks and the Pikes Peak track
    – Over 50 car models
    – Over 20 car manufacturers
    – 15 game modes

    But if I see his all car simulation (WRCs,SupertarsV8 games,GT Evo, SCAR), I don't expect so good physics...

    But I hope they make better physics.
     
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  12. Ole Marius Myrvold

    Ole Marius Myrvold
    JWB 96-13 Staff

    Ah, ye! I always write rF for rF1 ;)

    Me neither, but hopefully some will be able to convert/scratch-make them! :)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  13. Have you tried Shift+U aka layout editor in LFS? New update gives lots of opportunities for new tracks and layouts. Try it out.

    Also I know that running modified server is allowed by LFS devs, so you can tweak your car specs.
     
  14. Yes I know that. I made some "track" some years ago, example the Prolog of the 2003 Budapest Rally.
    It was an older version the 0.5Y. In the newest version i don't tried the layout editor, maybe some new object in it, but you cant build a real track, cant make different surface, andyou have a fix size place for building.

    I tried tweeking the physics of the car, and the last times, there is a lot of new car model for LFS.
    But nobody made both.. So made a car, and give a tweaked physics for it....
     
  15. there was a fun rallycross mode in colin mcrae 2 as well, four or five different tracks against up to 7 (?) AI. I read somewhere that mcrae02 was rereleased for smartphones, so that me be a very cheap way to get some rallycross action.
    for years now, iRacing has produced rumors of "dirt" physics and tracks being in development, so far nothing has come of it.
    I suppose that engines like rF and rF2 do not translate well to loose ground, while the engine that is just miles ahead of all other "dirt" engines, richard burns rally, does not allow for multiplayer. It is testimony to this engine's brilliance that people still play it after what, 14 years? nothing gets even close to it, pity it was not developed further.
     
  16. Ole Marius Myrvold

    Ole Marius Myrvold
    JWB 96-13 Staff

    Up to 6 if I'm not wrong.. I think it was the "arcade-mode", and the mobile version, is the same that is on steam. It is awful!
     
  17. Gijs van Elderen

    Gijs van Elderen
    Premium Member

     
  18. Paul Bennett

    Paul Bennett
    Premium Member

    @Gijs van Elderen
    Tried out VRX rFactor a while back, looked & felt very much WIP what's it like now ?

    Edit : :rolleyes: forgot I had this installed just done update will try it out next week
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2015
  19. Paul Bennett

    Paul Bennett
    Premium Member

    Tested an still very much WIP, exterior car models & skins okay. But cockpits & FFB need a lot of work.
     
  20. I'd recommend rFactor (1) too, even if gravel will always be like worn gravel, or sand on tarmac, or overly bumpy.