Junior teams, no other solution?

[Kevin Clark]

think i should put a comment as i was one of the drivers who had to fight so hard to get the 6th spot. i think it unfair that for all the work we put in we get this taking away, after all we must have had to beat a main team for us to get a track choice over one, like mike says we are two different teams main team cant drive junior and vice versa and main team cant vote on there track or car, sure we could get advice and help from the faster guys but that's just team work and this will happen in all main and junior teams, and for the future does this mean junior guys have to be slow so that they cant finish high up the table?

just that we finished 6th and this was our reward witch now your trying take away at last minute??

 

[David Garcia]

Guys, no one is trying toi take it away from you, but find the best option or what we consider more fair.

It is decided, top 6 teams will have his own Home GP.

 

[Damian Henderson]

Well, it would of been nice to see what the rest of the teams think instead of getting Flatout saying what they say and just changing the rules just because of that.

This is not right IMO, a team has 2 home GP's...it don't make sense.

 

[Sebastien Bortoli]

i can understand the point of view of FOJ if they've fight all season long to hit the top 6 and choose their own track...but if the rules says that the junior teams are replaced by an "A" team in this case, the rules shouldn't been changed so near of the begining of the season,rules should be modified for the next season( btw i can't remember if it's in the rules i must read it again ).
the 2 cents of a new team

 

[Mark A Warmington]

Ok - my thoughts as another team member:

I would have to say that this seems to be a mountain/mole hill situation. I really don't see the advantage of a home track. Instead it is more a kudos thing. As has been stated already, the top six finishing teams should get the choice. It would be different if the junior teams scored points for the main team but they don't. So they truly are a seperate entity very much like the Red Bull and Torro Rossi teams in F1.

I therefore fail to see the issue and can't see why it would be unfair for the junior team to reap the benefits of their labours.

Just my two pennies worth.

PS- if the tracks were kept secret and only announced the week prior to the event I might have a different opinion as there would then be an advantage as both the main and junior teams would know in advance the tracks they would be running. As it stands we all know the tracks in advance.

 

[Xosé Estrada]

One remark...

Junior teams have no vote, no team spokesman independent from main team, because they are considered part of a main team, so I have to agree with damian.

More than this, we talked about the junior's won't have home GP as their home GP is same than main ones.

Once this is clear, we can continue talking about what to do.

 

[David Garcia]

@ Damian: Would you say the same in the case Fanatec DHR has ended the seasson in Top 6?

@ Sebastien: There are still almost 3 months to go for the first official race, but you are right we should make a decision now.

@ Mark: Agree with you, but not 100%. I feel that having a Home GP is not a clear advantage, everybody can prepare the race since the choice is done, since day one. But probably you can choose a combination of cars/track good for your own interest, so choosing a slow track for a car with good traction is a little advantage.

@ Xosé: This is true, and this is the main problem.

I will open a poll at WAR Forum in some minutes. Team Spokesmen, your turn.

 

[Mark A Warmington]

If only FOTA, FOM & FIA could sort their differences like this .

 

[Eckhart von Glan]

IDon't see the point of having two championships in one. There will always be differences between teams.

well, I for one enjoy the Indpenet's trophy in the WTCC, same grid but two layers, makes sense because its a fact that not all teams have the same resources

 

[Tom Ilsbroux]

One remark...

Junior teams have no vote, no team spokesman independent from main team, because they are considered part of a main team, so I have to agree with damian.

More than this, we talked about the junior's won't have home GP as their home GP is same than main ones.

Once this is clear, we can continue talking about what to do.

Fail to see the point here, why give them seperate points then if all the rest is the same. Sry but sharing the TS has nothing to do with it. For me they can have their own TS, no problem what so ever.

Question is will they benefit from their labour ? Can't find a reason why not to be honest. They race for their point and thus should benefit from it. Otherwise just take them out of the standings if apparently it doesn't matter where they finish.
You could raise the question if they would get a prise if they finished in the top 3 ? Would then the answer be no also ? How silly would that be ?

 

[Damian Henderson]

@ Damian: Would you say the same in the case Fanatec DHR has ended the seasson in Top 6?

.

Yes I would....

One remark...

Junior teams have no vote, no team spokesman independent from main team, because they are considered part of a main team, so I have to agree with damian.

More than this, we talked about the junior's won't have home GP as their home GP is same than main ones.

Exactly, why change this rule all of a sudden? It was made pretty well clear heading into last season that if a Junior team finished in the top 6 they would not get a home GP as it means one team gets two home GP's, it's just changing the rules as we go along...+ the Junior team is just the same team as the main team unless they have their own website, forums, set-ups , team spokesmen and everything else. What if we had 2 Junior teams in top 6 and then had 2 home GP's for them...thats 3 home GP's for one team, which would not be right.

 

[David Garcia]

OK, POLL will be postponed untill next week (...if stills being needed...) because we are waiting for some important information about the server capacity.

For me it is not fair that the Junior Teams fight on track and can´t get a home GP, but please, always remember that you have 2 chances of being in the Top 6 while the other teams have only one. Remember aswell that the only case a Junior team will not have a Home GP is when the main team is also in the Top 6...

I have an idea. Maybe, in the case both teams are in top 6 you can have a GT Sport Flat Out Junior Home GP and a GT Pro Flat Out Club Home GP (both races in the main team circuit or in the junior team circuit, the one you decide). For me it looks fair and a good option to solve it, and one of the teams with only "one" team on track can still have a Home GP.

For me it is a good solution.. now we neeed a bit of will to do it from all sides. :beauty:

 

[Xosé Estrada]

Fail to see the point here, why give them seperate points then if all the rest is the same. Sry but sharing the TS has nothing to do with it. For me they can have their own TS, no problem what so ever.

The problem is not them having TS, it's if they have TS the team in question will have double vote. I don't see DHR Fanatec voting against GMT-DHR, and same for the rest...

If FOJ for example chooses circuit, being realists, inside FO you will decide an d you will choose two tracks you like, as FOJ and FO are the same team, same forum... teams with only one team are in disadventage.

Question is will they benefit from their labour ? Can't find a reason why not to be honest. They race for their point and thus should benefit from it. Otherwise just take them out of the standings if apparently it doesn't matter where they finish.
You could raise the question if they would get a prise if they finished in the top 3 ? Would then the answer be no also ? How silly would that be ?

No, then answer will be obviously yes, because Top 3 prizes are not related to spoting benefits for next season as home track is.

 

[Xosé Estrada]

Ok, possible solution:

TOP 5 main teams will have a HOME GP

+

Junior Trophy is created, with winner having right to have a home GP.

This means:

GMT-DHR
RPM
TBR
FOC
BVM
DMSv
BFR
TGG
PROJECT D
[ANE]

will compete for 5 HOME GP positions.

FOJ
DHRF
DMSv2

will do it for 1 HOME GP position.

It's ok?

 

[Andreas Hultgren]

Not a fan of it but it is an ok compromise...

... but for last seasons result there should be no change in my opinion. The rules were clear before the season and changing such a thing after is not good, that is wrong. Everyone could read the rules before race 1 of the Blue Cup. If some didn't do it then that is their problem.

 

[Damian Henderson]

Not a fan of it but it is an ok compromise...

... but for last seasons result there should be no change in my opinion. The rules were clear before the season and changing such a thing after is not good, that is wrong. Everyone could read the rules before race 1 of the Blue Cup. If some didn't do it then that is their problem.

Exactly.

 

[Tom Ilsbroux]

Ok, possible solution:

TOP 5 main teams will have a HOME GP

+

Junior Trophy is created, with winner having right to have a home GP.

This means:

GMT-DHR
RPM
TBR
FOC
BVM
DMSv
BFR
TGG
PROJECT D
[ANE]

will compete for 5 HOME GP positions.

FOJ
DHRF
DMSv2

will do it for 1 HOME GP position.

It's ok?

I like this. It is kinda what Eckard Suggested. It gives those team also something to fight for.

If FOJ for example chooses circuit, being realists, inside FO you will decide an d you will choose two tracks you like, as FOJ and FO are the same team, same forum... teams with only one team are in disadventage.

The junior team will deside on its own. It would be totaly unfair if the main team would do this in their place. That is the whole point why i asked this.

As you might have noticed we do everything by vote. Also the home track is done this way. If the junior team could choose a home track it will be a vote among themselves.

 

[David Garcia]

I also like the 5 Teams + Best Junior to have home GP.

What you think guys?

 

[Neil Gault]

I also like the 5 Teams + Best Junior to have home GP.

What you think guys?

:no:
like what has been said already "The rules were clear before the season so why change"?

Ideal solution would be to scrap the junior teams and try to get more teams to compete or increase the number of drivers that each team can enter per race.

If you are to run with so called junior teams running their own race then they should also be in junior cars like club class, but myself i can not see the point in reducing the quality of the races by reducing the quality of the grid size, seems like a big step backwards and makes the whole league a lot less attractive..

 

[Eckhart von Glan]

also don't like it, because that way, the really big teams almost for sure have two home races while the weakre teams (BFR, GG, AnE) stand little chance of making it. On the other hand: what's the big deal? How about following the rules that were posted before the season (always a good idea ) and then for next season come up with a good formula, maybe along the lines of the A and B groups I suggested, with top5 A teams to choose and top B team to choose (Mind you: they start in the same grid! I think I was misunderstood there)