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PC Inside Kerbs - Gentlemen Agreement (?)

Discussion in 'Assetto Corsa' started by Andreas Knöpke, May 25, 2014.

  1. Andreas Knöpke

    Andreas Knöpke
    GT3 is where it's at! Premium Member

    Hey guys,

    I know this may very well be a rather pointless discussion, hence the goal is not necessarily to come to a universal agreement but I just wanna raise some sort of awareness for something I've seen quite a lot recently.

    I am, of course, aware that many things in AC are still in Alpha and thus unfinished. ;)

    Okay, here we go :unsure:

    Many tracks in AC (still) allow for a rather nonsense cutting over the inner kerbs despite actually featuring a special high kerb element as seen in the picture below (yellow rectangle). As you may know, hitting that elevated kerb directly with a tire will upset your car in a pretty realistic way.

    However, if you manage to get your inside tires even beyond that kerb (to the inside of the corner), meaning you basically drive right over the kerb, then your car will most likely remain on the ground and not be upset at all. Needless to say how much this is improving lap times. :speechless:


    So I thought since most of us here are looking for an experience as realistic as possible, we could perhaps think / discuss about not using such nonsense cuts in corners. :cool:

    Again, I know the game is far from ready and it's just somewhat meaningless clubs races currently, but still I figured raising a certain awareness for realism may not be wrong at this time. Especially as we are seeing many drivers being new to simracing these days. :thumbsup:
    Last edited: May 26, 2014
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  2. Leemstradamus

    Mid pack attack!

    I already try to avoid them but I hope this brings attention of the issue to others.
  3. Rupe Wilson

    Rupe Wilson
    Keep Yoga real Premium Member

    Well we have a rule at RD
    that we all agreed to when getting a licence.
    • Do not deliberately cut the track. The white (or yellow) lines mark the edge of the road. Do not cross them with more than two wheels.
    so if drivers are doing this they are breaking our rules, and need reporting

    all drivers that are unsure of the rules please have another look

    Once you have read them you can like the post to show you have read it and understood it if you wish.
  4. Bram

    Roaring Pipes Maniacs | #27 Staff Premium Member

    Fully agree with Andreas. I have sent out a link to our club rules with each password pm during the last two weeks and still a lot of the people simply refuse to read our pretty simple rules.

    Let me quote the part of our rules with regards to cutting:
    • Do not deliberately cut the track. The white (or yellow) lines mark the edge of the road. Do not cross them with more than two wheels.
    Thats a crystal clear rule that we expect everyone to follow. However with a lot of newcomers joining in it might need take some time for this to settle in the soft or the hard way.

    For the latter to happen we really need to receive incident reports. If you see people deliberate breaching any of these rules we expect the drivers to make a report so something can be done about it.

    Edit: @Rupe Wilson = :ninja:
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  5. Yes Andreas, you're right. As two staff members already mentioned, the RD rules clearly state that at least two wheels must stay within track limits, which are defined by the white lines at the side of the track.
    Your example picture should be T4 & T5 at Monza.
    Case in point is the chicane at the end of Nürburgring GP: If you want a good time on RSR, it's far more advantageous to position the wheels of your car between the elevated curb - and this is not penalised ingame.
  6. Andreas Knöpke

    Andreas Knöpke
    GT3 is where it's at! Premium Member

    There are quite a number of corners like the above, T1 for instance as well. So it was a mere example.
  7. Bram

    Roaring Pipes Maniacs | #27 Staff Premium Member

    For online play i don't mind kerbs being twice as high to be honest ;)

    Good example is the current Nordschleife. Kerbs that set you off immediately when you hug them too much, perfect.

    AC does have a couple of notorious cutter tracks in game: Nurburgring, Imola, Monza but its of course the driver's responsibility to round them in a clean way.

    Reporting time please and it will soon be over I can guarantee that.

    The above is also the reason why I don't like ego-swinging leaderboards. Real racing is done in between the white lines with and against other people.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  8. Bram

    Roaring Pipes Maniacs | #27 Staff Premium Member

    On the same topic its also good to mention that the game imo still has a bug: the outer astroturf doesn't belong to the race track.
  9. Or you can just ignore track limits and go as fast as possible into a corner - like Wadim Kogay did in the #333 green 458 in the Blancpain Endurance series race at Monza a couple of weeks back :D


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  10. Chris Stacey

    Chris Stacey
    Ted Kravitz Appreciation Society Staff Premium Member

    I think for corners such as the one outlined in the OP, we need to have a "Gentlemans agreement", simply because you can get two wheels on the inside of the sausage curb, and still have 2 wheels on the racetrack, since most cars are easily wide enough to do so. And in doing so, you haven't technically broken any rules.

    Obviously we cannot penalise every single situation because sometimes it's a genuine mistake, and they'll often get hit with the 5 sec penalty which is harsh enough of a penalty to de-incentivize anyone from cutting. However if we look at the replay, and it's clearly a blatant cutting of track limits, then we have to penalise them.

    But as Bram said earlier, we're relying on people reporting these things. Because we can't go through the replays of every car at every race.
    Last edited: May 26, 2014
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  11. Justin Swan

    Justin Swan

    Do we have a way of viewing a full race replay? Seems very limited at the moment.
  12. Leemstradamus

    Mid pack attack!

    Nope only gets you about the last 5 laps I think with the current build.
  13. I know there is one RSR WR (BMW M3 E30 Grp A vs Monza) involve some heavy chicane cutting with all 4 wheels off track like this:

    The RSR WR

    Actual hotlapping image taken from exact that WR replay video

    But then somehow in this case i actually have no problem with that for 2 reasons:
    1. its really not that easy to cut that 2nd chicane with at least 90km/h without upsetting the car. So this is not a easy cheat cut. To be honest i actually see it as some kind of achievement for cut that chicane & all 4 wheels avoid that bump stone so perfectly :rolleyes:
    2. Its allow by the game. So what else can i say ?? :D

    I already try like 80laps on this combo trying to at least do less than 0.5s slower than this guy but his 2nd session is just too fast for me to catch, yeah he cut that 2nd chicane so deep that help him alot with carrying lot more exit speed but i just cant found a way to cut perfectly like him so i accept i lost. Yeah may be he got lucky or something but am ok with that.

    By the way to be fair i bet all the in-game or 3rd party leaderboard should be reset once the proper penalty system (if that gonna happen) is finally in the game so everything will be 100% fair to everyone. But will that ever happen ??
    Last edited: May 26, 2014
  14. it`s true, I don`t blame those cutters either since it is allowed by game. It would be childish. Just `cause they want to be the fastest for a world record....
    And as you said, it`s some kind of achievement. But I`m only speaking for Hotlapping! In a league and on the servers it has indeed to be considered a gentleman`s agreement NOT to cut anything! That is just something that has to be agreed on.
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  15. Btw, I am really looking forward to full damage system, hope there will be proper tyre and suspension damage; that should really be a whole different story then in multiplayer ;) :D
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  16. Bram

    Roaring Pipes Maniacs | #27 Staff Premium Member

    That is something everybody agreed on when they agreed to the licensed membership.

    Those that get caught after a report will first have their license temporary taking away and for a second offense removed entirely.

    But we do need proper reports.
  17. Qazdar Karim

    Qazdar Karim
    Premium Member

    I don't understand why devs didn't fix chicanes the way they did it with imola's last chicane ! that one is really hard to cut ,once you get the green thing of it you get a penalty :D
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  18. See how deep enters the real
    Last edited: May 26, 2014
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  19. I dont know. To me hotlap or race is just the same thing where people will use every possible way to win; So if one are capable to always cut that 2nd chicane without upsetting the car then i have no problem at all even its a race. Its allow by the game so everyone can do the same thing so to me its fair enough, otherwise the game should be the one to blame, not the player.
    In fact I bet every real pro world class racer will cut that chicane too if they found a way to do so.
    Of course if race in league then no doubt people should follow the league rule but other than that everything is fine to me.
    Thats mean if one beat me by cutting that corner but i fail to beat him back by doing the same thing then he win, i lose. I wont complain at all.
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  20. Bram

    Roaring Pipes Maniacs | #27 Staff Premium Member

    How about the SIM in sim racing. Aren't we simulating the real thing? Apart from the very hilarious real life picture above you don't see real cars cutting corners like that either.

    To me allowing what the game allows without caring if its real or not is just the difference between a simracer and a gamer.

    So if the game would allow that a driver instead of taking the first chicane at Monza goes straight ahead ignoring an entire chicane would you be fine with that as well as long as you can do the same?
    • Agree Agree x 3