I don't like it anymore

[Bram Hengeveld]

I don't know what it is but since the 2.0 upgrade the game feels totally ruined for me. The LMS cars, especially the Ford GT, have a griplevel like in iRacing. It suddenly snaps and there is no way you can correct the first or second (2nd!! how often do you see that in real life) slip like you used to.

Where did all the grip go? iRacing before the upgrade felt like driving real cars to me. Now its like rFactor again ;(

If there are any G27 users reading please share some information how you setup the wheel as my settings are useless now.

 

[Yoeri Gijsen]

I don't know what it is but since the 2.0 upgrade the game feels totally ruined for me. The LMS cars, especially the Ford GT, have a griplevel like in iRacing. It suddenly snaps and there is no way you can correct the first or second (2nd!! how often do you see that in real life) slip like you used to.

Where did all the grip go? iRacing before the upgrade felt like driving real cars to me. Now its like rFactor again ;(

If there are any G27 users reading please share some information how you setup the wheel as my settings are useless now.

Note that not everything changed in the game. The Corvette I drive still feels the same. I don't like the Ford GT either, but that's because the way it handles. People have explained how the Ford work with a set minimum of ride height causing a lot of understeer.

I've noticed every time I launch the sim I have to re-calibrate my pedals. If I don't, my brake sensitivity is extremely high and I lock up instantly and skid off track.

Any of you guys experience the same?

I have this too. The solution is simple. Everytime it's you're first run after (re)booting your PC, go out, check whether the brake is sensative. If it is, go back to the box, click drive and pump your brake pedal a couple of times. The issue should now be gone.

 

[Yann Laprevotte]

The Corvette I drive still feels the same.

This is because it is still on OTM. It was supposed to get NTM this season, but they cancelled it in last minute.

 

[Roy Visser]

After hating, swearing and plain right being pissed off, i started doing what i was supposed to do, and that is just drive and drive and drive the Ford GT. First i changed the rotation angle of the wheel (calibrated my 900 degree wheel to 700 degrees) and hardened my brake pedal a bit. After that i spend alot of time learning the car. I can absolutly say this car has a very steep learning curve. But once you are over this enormous hump, the car is so insanly well put together that it quite easily ranks among the best simracing cars i have ever ridden. It is very rewarding but it took some blood sweat and tears. The most important thing with the Ford GT is the braking, Be sure to adjust your normal/basic braking points and lay them back 100m further. After this you will more and more understand the car. After driving it alot i even started to predict slides and catch them.

I agree with the car being very very very hard to drive, but once you understand it, it is sooooo good

But because of this high learning curve, and the HPD having a very low learning curve, i can understand why the HPD is the more obvious choice for the Proto/GT series.

I love the New Tire Model, even with its flaws, i really can't drive OTM cars anymore without feeling like the cars are on ice.

Toughen it out Brambo, you'll get the hang of it

 

[Phil Hopkins]

Okay, help me out here. What is it that makes it so good once you learn how to keep it from swapping ends all the time?! What is it brilliant at? Aren't there other cars with more straight line speed? Many other cars with sharper, more predictable handling in corners? Many cars with more agility (quick on their tires, so to speak)? What is it the GT does so astoundingly well that it pays off being "very very very hard to drive"?

 

[Roy Visser]

Okay, help me out here. What is it that makes it so good once you learn how to keep it from swapping ends all the time?! What is it brilliant at? Aren't there other cars with more straight line speed? Many other cars with sharper, more predictable handling in corners? Many cars with more agility (quick on their tires, so to speak)? What is it the GT does so astoundingly well that it pays off being "very very very hard to drive"?

Can't explain it, once you learn how to drive it you'll know. And yes there are some flaws due to the NTM, but it just feels like that's how its supposed to drive. I am really not alone in this thinking, but as said, you need to get over a very steep learning curve, after which the car is as predictable as you want it to be.

 

[Jack B]

Can't explain it, once you learn how to drive it you'll know. And yes there are some flaws due to the NTM, but it just feels like that's how its supposed to drive. I am really not alone in this thinking, but as said, you need to get over a very steep learning curve, after which the car is as predictable as you want it to be.

I'd agree. I had the same experience. In the beginning I had a ton of spins and snap oversteer. Then I started tweaking my setup. Now, I catch those time after time. I was thinking of putting together a video of all the times I caught a spin, because I had heard it can't be done. If I can do it and I'm far from the best, then I imagine that experience is shared by many other Ford GT drivers too.

I've had two races in multiclass, so I need experience and it shows. I felt always in control of the Ford, but either I'd push a little too hard and I knew it and spun or I'd get a bit overwhelmed with the traffic at times and make a mistake.

Not once in two races did I have a 4x though. Everyone did a great job with passing. With 15-20 HPD's passing me 3-5 times a race, that's a lot of passing without incident.

The great thing was how in control I felt and was able to catch a bunch of spins without swapping ends. If we just had time for another race at Road America.... What a blast it's been to practice and race this week. Tried Sebring last night and it feels like a fun track with the GT. Narrow in spots though. Could be very stressful for the GT's. :eek:

 

[Phil Hopkins]

Well, I'm happy you've learned how to drive the GT, but I'm still trying to figure out what makes it so great once you do. The Skippy is challenging as well, but learning to drive the Skippy well is a master's course in learning to drive well period, I think. There's a reason they serve(d) as training cars at driving schools. You control them by controlling all three inputs in proper ways, and so you become a better driver and do better in other cars after driving them. That makes them great cars, in my book.

I'm completely unconvinced that learning to control the GT's rambunctious ways, even getting to the place where you can predict what they will do and prevent them from doing it, translates into skills useful for other cars. Learning to drive a hard to control car is great if what you learn serves beyond driving that one car; and if not, not, I'd say.

Happy to be told or shown how learning to drive the GT will pay off, but I'm skeptical.

 

[Bram Hengeveld]

@Roy, its a GT2 car. A car class that is not the hardest in the world to drive for sure. But in iRacing it's undoable for a (too) large group of people. They can claim that the physics are all spot on and super realistic but in this case I don't believe it.
Was lucky enough to work with the MarcVDS team last year on Zolder and they ran a Ford GT1 car in the FIA GT. The only thing that is brutal on that particular car is the (insane) sound. The handling of the car is stable and has grip and certainly doesn't spin the rear that easily on slow corners (Zolder has quite a few of them )

I know that the car used in iRacing is build by Doran and not Matech like the big GT1 version. But both are based on the same vehicle i guess.

Will give the car a lot of track time in the coming weeks, as I really would like to drive it in the RDiLMS this season. If it doesn't work ill come and ask for your help and if that doesnt work Ill just return to some of the other awesome cars in the game

 

[Roy Visser]

Thats what i am saying bram, once you are over the steep learning/adjusting curve, you will understand it and it becomes dead easy to drive the car. Just brake 100m earlier then you think, and you'll be A O K!

One of the flaws is indeed the slow corner grip, which is a flaw in the NTM for sure, since all cars have it. The handling at speed is predictable (as in understeered like crazy) and grippy.

But yes, the car has some mayor flaws, but iRacing already said that they have been given tons of new data from Doran, and they are re working the car. (basicly an excuse for saying they F-ed up). You'll learn to love it once you get the hang of it

 

[Saul Boucher]

But yes, the car has some mayor flaws, but iRacing already said that they have been given tons of new data from Doran, and they are re working the car. (basicly an excuse for saying they F-ed up).

Exactly,

Personally, I'll wait until the car is fixed and NTM gets it's needed update. Then I'll learn to drive it.

I do have high hopes for it though, I think it will end up being a great car!

 

[Jack B]

Bram,

you're not alone in this. There are others who do not believe the real Ford GT drives like the one in iRacing. To my knowledge, some of those include people who have driven a real Ford GT3. Yes, some (the usual) will say there are big differences in handling between the Doran and the other Ford GT, but I don't think these differences are enough to justify the behaviour of the car modelled in iRacing.

Moreover...the behaviour of this car suffers from similar "maladies" pros have spotted in the C6r.

This, imo, is obviously not related to the tire model generation - Old vs New. It's something some long time DK fans have spotted in all his sims, something persistent.

Like many, I will wait and see what will DK do.

The Ford GT has some issues. The minimum tire pressures are set too high on purpose, because there was another issue that's needs fixing (Ian Berwick confirmed). The steering lock seems about half what it is on most Ford GT's we've seen on video (you can short calibrate though to adjust) and there is a weird issue when it becomes airborne when flying offtrack at 100 mph or so (although your race is over then anyway).

Having said all that their are a lot of Ford GT drivers like myself that are fine with the steering as is, and don't really care if the tire pressures are 200psi, 35psi or 20psi as long as the car handles to our liking and setup adjustments work. They seem to work fine for me, so I'm good for now. The Ford GT, HPD and Vette mixed class series is more popular than all iRacing series at the moment except for the Rookie Mazda series. The HPD gets more drivers, but I typically see more Ford drivers than Vette, so it's very driveable.

Ian Berwick said Dave Kaemmer is back from vacation and is going to write a post/blog this week to talk about the additional tweaks he is making to the Ford GT and/or the NTM. We all know they've been challenged to get it out by the Season 3 build and changes were coming.

Like everyone, I'm very interested in hearing what he has to say. They could have delayed the NTM longer, but Dave had a vacation planned and the natives were getting restless, so they released as is. Personally, I'm glad they did, because I've enjoyed it. Expect fixes. I trust Dave will get it right, because unlike some boxed games they don't ship and then go off to the next project. This is the next project.

 

[Jack B]

Re the steering lock. Ian Berwick (iRacing staff) confirmed the Ford GT they modeled did indeed have 8:1 steering lock.

He responded to the video on the forums showing what appears to be 12:1 or 15:1....

Hard to say if that one lap we see in the David Murry is truly representative of the normal steering lock in use. Were the front tires still cold? That would cause understeer, and require greater input from the driver. Was he intentionally trying to heat up the fronts? <shrug> Watch the F1 guys getting their tires up to temp and you can see them going full lock, inducing understeer to get the tires heated/cleaned off, whatever. Might have been intentional? Is the car setup to be super stable for the other team drivers? With the stiff front bar, is it a stable aero platform that gives up some mechanical grip in the slowest corners? Probably, but how to quantify that?

I've know David for years and intend to talk to him at the Petit Le Mans in September, so I'll hold off on any big changes until after that time.

The FFB change is primarily so that you can leave the in-sim FFB set the same from car to car. If you want more strength, just turn it up a bit. I just found that there was a loss of information as it saturated the motors in my G25.

It takes a second to short calibrate a car in iRacing and you can save all settings individually for each car, so I should short calibrate and see how it feels, but I've been fine with 8:1. Maybe I'll try it later and see if I like it better.

 

[Dario Jagar]

long story short, yes FGT has problems, yes they will fix it

I wanted to "love" this car and I wanted it to be my first choice (like Mustang was till FGT was released) and I really gave it more then enough time to adjust myself to it, to re-learn it. But everytime I tried any other car I had problems coming back to FGT. It is OK if you drive it exclusively and don´t even touch any other car, but when you try anything else it is a nightmare to come back to FGT and catch it again, for me at least. It is a blast on tracks like Watkins, Road Atlanta, Barber but at the same time PITA on Sebring, Silverstone...

wondering what will update bring to us, little bit disapointed that iR has no plans to put adjustable steering ratio for it

currently this car is at the same time best and worst car in iR IMO, worst for many reason, best because you can "feel" how much potential this car have to become best in service by far

keeping it in garage for a while :yin-yang:

 

[Jack B]

Two things:
- if DK had delayed the release of the NTM, he would be the target (more or less rightly so) of those that wouldn't forgive him for promising something when he couldn't deliver it.
- but by releasing a preview version (which, as far as I can tell, got general positive feedback) and then a 2.0 version with serious problems, he shot himself in the foot. Two widely different versions of the same thing: the NTM. And, as some acknowledged it, released before its time.

Now, I'd rather wait than get what we have now. Others feel this way too. So, I hope DK is fresh from his vacation time and energetic enough to tackle current issues (not "some issues" as you put it) before tackling new releases (track and cars).

We all stand to gain if the NTM is fixed and the cars behave as he (DK) knows they should.



Not me. 8:1 ruins it for me. But I am going to try some calibration strategies guys have been posting here and there, maybe that will
bring some stability to my steering.

It's semantics, but I don't think I've ever seen an iRacing staff member use the word "promise" in their announcements or posts. They are very careful about that and for good reason. Many iRacers will say "they promised". Not sure if they understand the meaning of the word "promise" or just use it loosely to mean, "set expectations". iRacing has dropped a feature or delayed some part of every Cat Herder or forum "here's what we think will be in the next build" statement in just about every build in the last 3 years. I kind of expect it due to the short 3 month dev windows. If they had an open ended mult-year window with a moving target date, they wouldn't miss as much, but when it must be exactly on week 13, that makes it really tough.

I don't know many MMO's or boxed titles that have these "must hit" week 13 type of deadlines. Makes it tough for them. They could say nothing and then nothing would be late, but the forum faithful want predictions and promises. They get predictions, but many turn that into "you promised". It fuels their disappointment thinking it was a "promise".

 

[Saul Boucher]

Some good information in your posts there Jack. Be sure to update us when DK's post / blog get's posted. I always seem to miss them, as I just simply couldn't be bothered with sifting through all the bickering going on at the iRacing forums these days