How do you set up aero?

[Dan Allen]

Hey guys,

Quick question. How do you tell which tracks are high downforce and which are low downforce? I'm pretty sure I can setup the car well in terms of suspension & tyre choices, but I find that I can't really get the aero dialled in properly (mostly put too much on and really affects my lap times, sometimes by 20 seconds!).

So how do you figure out what the aero should be?

Example: I drive on the Yas Marina track in an F1 car with fairly high downforce settings (around 26 on both wings). Is this too high, and is there any tips you could give me to help me figure out how to set up the wings for various tracks in the future?

Cheers in advance

 

[Georg Siebert]

High downforce tracks generally feature many/long high speed corners/sections, for instance:
- Nordschleife
- Albert Park
- Brands-Hatch
- Circuit of the Americas
- Gentrack 1
- Hungaroring
- Interlagos
- Mugello
- Mosport
- Silverstone
- Suzuka
- Watkins Glenn
- Zandvoort
- Catalunya
- Red Bull Ring, Austria
- Spa Francorchamps

The wing values themselves really depend on the kind of car. For GT cars, e.g. Kunos's GT3 cars, section 4.13 of the Setup guide applies.
For Formula cars a more detailed approach is needed: There it seems the speed penalty for high wing values is minute to the massive aerodynamic grip they provide and is in my opinion too low.
I've seen setups with max front wing and increased front ARB to be very successfull, but they are not applicable to my personal driving style.
Find a right balance through high speed corners first, and then increase them one value at a time and compensate unwanted side effects with further setup changes.
A more time saving approach is to crank all to max and work from there.

 

[Dan Allen]

Thanks Georg! Much appreciated

 

[Georg Siebert]

Thanks Georg! Much appreciated

Edited in track info.

 

[Georg Siebert]

I'm currently working on a Setup Guide for Formula cars, that will deal with the Formula Abarth, The Exos/S1, the GP2 and the F1 car, however I'm already working on several projects in parallel here at RD - so don't expect it to be released next week or so

 

[Sander Eefting]

Low downforce is needed for tracks with long straights where you need a high topspeed during qualy and race. For example Montreal (f1 circuit) is a track where you need low downforce to be competitive.

The ''problem'' with most tracks is that you have long straights in combination with a lot of corners, so it's hard to find the right balance. Yas Marina is one of them, there is a long straight but the last section contains a lot of corners where you need downforce.

 

[Dan Allen]

Yas Marina is one of them, there is a long straight but the last section contains a lot of corners where you need downforce.

That's the problem I'm having. It's difficult to find that balance. Do the front wing and rear wing values have to be the same?

 

[Sander Eefting]

That's the problem I'm having. It's difficult to find that balance. Do the front wing and rear wing values have to be the same?

I have the same problem sometimes. I usually spectate or ask other drivers what kind of topspeed they have and from there on work on my downforce.

And no, from my experience they should not be the same. Rear downforce is always higher than the front if I'm not mistaken. (Unless you go 0-0 in downforce when driving on Le Mans)

 

[Dan Allen]

Thanks Sander, will try higher rear wing values. Out of curiosity, how much difference is between the two?

 

[Sander Eefting]

Thanks Sander, will try higher rear wing values. Out of curiosity, how much difference is between the two?

You can't really tell, because every track has different values. I think when I drove the gp2 mod in rFactor I always had a 3 difference between front and rear. 1-3, 2-,6, 3-9 etc etc.

But that was a totally different game + mod, so I really don't know how it is in AC

 

[Georg Siebert]

@Dan Allen
@Sander Eefting

The aerodynamics are nicely modeled in AC, their force is dynamic and speed dependant.
Aero balance: drive through high speed corners on a track, if the car understeers, raise front wing, if it oversteers, raise rear wing.
In general and for instance on the Exos, the front wing values are more effective, because they are exposed to clean air. The rear wing is less effective, because it is exposed to dirty air. To have the rear wing face more clean air, you have to raise the rear ride height (more positive rake). This ensues side effects like a bit of oversteer to the car and an increased rake needs proper spring, damper and travel range settings to be effective.
On the Exos S1 I had a 30mm difference between front and rear ride height during stand still, with a wheel base of ~4000mm that was a rake angle of 0,5°. Consider that the car is pressed to the ground while driving and the rake angle changes because of it. It is therefore important to look at the actual angle while driving and not at the one during stand still.
On modern race cars, 60-70% of the downforce is generated by the diffuser. It is modeled in AC as well. With an increased rake angle, the diffuser generates more downforce, however rake is sensitive, has its limits and is no magic bullet.
The RB10 features, like its predecessors, more rake than the rest of the teams:

That's one of the reasons, why Red Bull has an advantage on tracks with high speed corners like on the Hungaroring.
Formula cars with their aerodynamic systems add complexity to the car setups in comparison to GT3 cars with simpler aero.

 

[Mircea Rad]

I'm currently working on a Setup Guide for Formula cars, that will deal with the Formula Abarth, The Exos/S1, the GP2 and the F1 car, however I'm already working on several projects in parallel here at RD - so don't expect it to be released next week or so

Looking forward to this one

 

[Ben Lee]

I personally put the aero down to almost nothing, then only raise it if I need to.

 

[Fernando Deutsch]

Fantastic post by @Georg Siebert

Would like to add a bit. Aero setup could mask a deficient mechanical (spring, dampers, rollbars) configuration. Check how the car behaves on low speed corners, where aero does not take part of the equation. Keep in mind that is important to consider springs will need to be stiff enough to properly hold the car when downforce is at the peak, and that the rake does not change too much when negotating high speed turns.

 

[Georg Siebert]

Fantastic post by @Georg Siebert

Would like to add a bit. Aero setup could mask a deficient mechanical (spring, dampers, rollbars) configuration. Check how the car behaves on low speed corners, where aero does not take part of the equation. Keep in mind that is important to consider springs will need to be stiff enough to properly hold the car when downforce is at the peak, and that the rake does not change too much when negotating high speed turns.

Yes, you are absolutely right - didn't want to add 100 words more to the already long post