F1 2010 F1 2010 doesn't look that promising to me

[ufunacaoenn]

If I am going ot give my personal Opinion I dont think the F1 2010 looks that promising because it looks more like the NFS Shift.
It's like if Codemasters are trying to make a box look so awesome but what is inside is average or crappy.

I realy hope they will make a proper F1 simulator because it's a bit meaning less to have a former F1 test driver if you are not going ot make a proper simulator. If the F1 test driver (wich name I dont rimember) would move to ISI they would be making one heck of a simulator.

But lets hope this game will be better then expected.

 

[Dustin Barton]

Marketing

Of course its not going to be a full sim. Sim's don't sell and Codemaster is planning to sell millions and millions of games to earn back that (too) expensive F1 license. Therefore they need to create a game that looks real but is easy to master. Taddaa: F1 2010 - The Game is born :thumb:

And still I wan't to have it

The game is very focused on physics and simulating real F1. However, like any other game, CM is going to have driving assists/aids to help people who aren't familiar with simulation games. Last I checked Steve Hood (Chief Designer) rated the game an 8 out of 10 in regards to simulation.

 

[Rob Simms]

The , is where he rated it 7 out of 10 at the time of the video instead of my mistake of 5 of 10, but he said that it should be an 8 out of 10 at release. They are not going to have full aids possibly from the handling video not the insidesimracing video, just enough for beginners to get a handle on the cars. I could be wrong on the handling, but this what I could understand.

 

[Rob Simms]

I made two mistakes on the previous post yesterday and I got them corrected.

 

[Reik Major]

The more the so called sim-elitists start shouting that the physics are rubbish and what more, the more I will enjoy the great graphics, the animated scenes and the massive amount of new people to meet :thumbup:

Absolutely right!

I'd call me a hardcore sim racer, too. That's why you won't see me posting much in sub forums about this kind of game.

Last thing i'd do here, is complaining about physics. It's such an old story which is only nerving those guys, who are happiely awaiting this game for the reasons Bram mentioned...

For me fun is only generated by feeling as real as possible. So i'm afraid this title won't suit me. But i'll give the demo a go for sure.

 

[Reik Major]

The game is very focused on physics and simulating real F1.

I wish you were right, but i'll only believe it when i see it.

The same things were written about Race Driver Grid. It was announced to be a good sim including driving aids to fit the arcade drivers, too. Then i installed the demo, turned all aids off and went to Jarama with the WTCC BMW E90. After one lap i deinstalled the demo, because a top speed of 280 kph nearly no need to brake for a hairpin was a bit too arcadish for me.

I'll never understand why they can't make a real simulation like we have with mods on GTR and rF platforms and than add the arcade mode by just giving all aids the gamer wants or by reducing some simulation parameters... This would also make simulation fans buy the game.

Don't get me wrong! I don't want to blame physics here! I just don't like the way, the companies praise their upcomming titles to be also a sim only to make some more people like me buy the title, too. (Thx god we get demos of the most titles)

 

[Dustin Barton]

I wish you were right, but i'll only believe it when i see it.

The same things were written about Race Driver Grid. It was announced to be a good sim including driving aids to fit the arcade drivers, too. Then i installed the demo, turned all aids off and went to Jarama with the WTCC BMW E90. After one lap i deinstalled the demo, because a top speed of 280 kph nearly no need to brake for a hairpin was a bit too arcadish for me.

I'll never understand why they can't make a real simulation like we have with mods on GTR and rF platforms and than add the arcade mode by just giving all aids the gamer wants or by reducing some simulation parameters... This would also make simulation fans buy the game.

Don't get me wrong! I don't want to blame physics here! I just don't like the way, the companies praise their upcomming titles to be also a sim only to make some more people like me buy the title, too. (Thx god we get demos of the most titles)

Here's the difference though; Ant Davidson has been working with the team on the handling since practically day 1. EVERYONE (even Sutil) has said the handling is very close to the real thing. To each their own, and this isn't a knock on sim fans, but a racing wheel and **** game is no closer to the real thing than a controller and great game. And there won't be a demo for F1 2010 due to time constraints.

 

[Danny Asbury]

Reik, I'm in 100% agreement with everything you just said. In fact, I feel as though I just wrote your last post because I feel the exact same way.

 

[David Wright]

Dustin, you are flogging a dead horse I'm afraid. rFactor fans believe that an amateur modder with no data input from F1 teams and no input from an F1 driver will produce a better sim than the professionals with data from the teams and imput from an F1 driver.

 

[David Wright]

I'll never understand why they can't make a real simulation like we have with mods on GTR and rF platforms and than add the arcade mode by just giving all aids the gamer wants or by reducing some simulation parameters... This would also make simulation fans buy the game.

This is exactly what they are doing - see Dev Diary 2

Stephen Hood Chief Game Designer : "You can make a realistic sim easier to play for somebody that is new to racing games or new to F1 in general, but its very very difficult to make a an arcade handling system appeal to really what we consider to be our core audience for F1, people who prefer simulation handling."

 

[David O Gorman]

1. EVERYONE (even Sutil) has said the handling is very close to the real thing. To each their own, and this isn't a knock on sim fans, but a racing wheel and **** game is no closer to the real thing than a controller and great game. And there won't be a demo for F1 2010 due to time constraints.

Id have to disagree with you there Dustin ,On virtualr A german posted a translation of an interview with Sutil and a german interviewer and Sutil mentioned that he plays sim games on pc and he considered F1 focused towards arcade.
The demo doesn't cut any ice either as Gamescon had a demo ,and while you might make an arguement that it wasnt finished code every demo i have played comes with a disclaimer that it is unfinished code and may not represent the finished article.
They could still update the Gamescon demo with what ever code they are updating the final release for it to go gold, and release that as a demo within the next week or two.

Any comment on the tire debate that is going on on virtualr or codies forums ?
What im trying to figure out is that just an animation issue(animation not tied to physics)or is their physics backwards and the animation following that. any ideas anyone ? because if i remember correctly they were saying a lot about this advanced tire model they had developed especially for F1 compared to previous games.

The damage system seems to be a cut down version of what was promised as well.

Codemaster quote approx march of this year
"Codemasters have promised the most sophisticated damage model in gaming history, and the early signs are promising. Debris really does shatter into thousands of pieces, and running over debris in the game will give you a puncture, forcing you to nurse the car back to the pits.
If you have a low-speed crash at, say Monaco the tyre will remain attached to the car by a wheel tether, but if the crash is at high-speed, the tyre will be separated from the car. The damage model has been based upon the visual explosion that was Robert Kubica horrific crash in Canada, 2007.
Codemasters studied over 500 pictures of that one crash and saw how the pieces of the car would separate from a different area of the car, and the huge crash at the start of the 2009 Spanish Grand Prix was also studied for how the carbon fibre did literally explode on that occasion."

Pity the rear wing cant come off

taken from a blog of one of their fervent supporters
http://michaelgriffinonf1.wordpress.com/2010/03/18/be-the-driver-live-the-life-f1-2010-review/

Ant Davidson im sure is an okay guy ,but what has he been testing the handling with ,its taken until today to get a wheel list and it dosent look any bigger than what any other racing game would support ,the impression that was given i was expectiog 30 to 40 wheels on the list and how come he didnt spot the tire issue deforming in the wrong direction.
Realistically even if he did tell them there was something wrong in the handling what are codemasters going to do if they believed that implementing his suggestion might make it too difficult to drive for the average user.Im not saying this happened but he only knows the hardest way to drive an F1 car,do it for real.Codemasters keep telling us real is not the market they are aiming at so any suggestion he would make has to be altered by codemasters to fit their sales profile.

Id disagree , a wheel is the closest thing we can get to real as that is what is used in real life apart from the argument of the type of game,a controller is a jack of all trades and master of none,the game has been designed so that wheels get only a very little advantage over controllers,so for a hypotical test if we connected the wheel from my g27 to an F1 car and a console controller to another and got an F1 driver to test both cars any guesses to the outcome over a lap

David they are not developing a sim ,they have said that ,Its an (not arcade ,not sim , but has sim elements)its just they are kinda vague on what elements are what that is probably causing a lot of the discussions.

 

[Dustin Barton]

Dustin, you are flogging a dead horse I'm afraid. rFactor fans believe that an amateur modder with no data input from F1 teams and no input from an F1 driver will produce a better sim than the professionals with data from the teams and imput from an F1 driver.

Stupid horse. *kicks horse* When will it learn.

Id have to disagree with you there Dustin ,On virtualr A german posted a translation of an interview with Sutil and a german interviewer and Sutil mentioned that he plays sim games on pc and he considered F1 focused towards arcade.

There won't be a demo unless they somehow finish the game early, and considering we're officially 1 month from RTM I don't see that happening. Maybe, but highly unlikely. And if you watched the video where Sutil answered in English he clearly states that game looks arcade-y but handles great. Considering handling is all I care about with a racing game, I'm sold.

 

[GAIAjohan]

Sutil said this:

Das Spiel macht auf jeden Fall Spaß, wobei ich es eher als Arcade-Spiel sehe, da es sich doch wesentlich anders anfühlt, wenn man in einem echten Formel 1 Wagen sitzt, wo die Reaktion auf Lenkbewegungen wesentlich direkter ist. Bei F1 2010 gibt es eine minimale Verzögerung.

He says it feels arcade because the reaction on steer movements aren't as direct as irl. Also there's lag.

Well, you got lag in -every- game. How minimal it is, but there's lag.
And it being not as direct may be the steering wheel that was set on a very high degree (at least, that was what it seemed). And did he play with the car settings? I don't think so.

 

[David O Gorman]

And the tire and damage ?.
He said its looks arcade ? personally i thought it looked quite authentic(to use a codemaster word)but then im not an F1 driver
A demo is what people played including Sutil at Gamescon,what else could you call it ?
As to you statement David im an rfactor fan amoung other sims and racing games,personally i believe any dev with the right physics background is capable of producing a sim.
But a modder provides his or her mod for free ,that is the big difference between codemasters and modders.
Now if you were to argue that codemasters were more capable of creating a sim that the devs of rfactor or other sims ,i would disagree purely based on track record.
Why evertime rfactor is bashed its always the modders that are brought up rather than the devs would make me assume you feel the same as me with regard the original devs.
So codemaster devs versus rfactor devs any comments.

 

[David O Gorman]

Johan Top any chance of translating the whole interview if you speak German or any other German speaker here just so anyone can make an informed view.
I dont mind if im wrong but i dislike the idea of paying money and of being right.

is this translated correctly or not ?

XboxFront: Hello Adrian, congratulations for your victory [he beat the editor]. Do you play video games in private too, or is this just pure PR?

Adrian Sutil: In this case I'm doing PR, but at home I am playing regularly, especially at the PC. Most GTR, a great game, which I enjoy because it's more a simulation than arcade.

XboxFront: And what do you think of F1 2010? Would you put it into the arcade or simulation genre?

Adrian Sutil: The game is really fun, but I see it more as arcade, because it feels really different than sitting in a real Formula 1 car, where the reaction to steering is more direct. With F1 2010 is a real minimal lag.

taken from virtualr
http://www.virtualr.net/f1-2010-a-lap-with-adrian-sutil-around-spa/#comments

Maybe its in the translation but he does differentiate between a sim and an arcade game so it could be in the nuances when translated.

 

[GAIAjohan]

It's pretty much correct what the guy on virtualr says, but I think Sutil also calls it arcade because he knows how an F1 feels exactly. I don't think he knows exactly what a GT-car feels like.

But hey:
http://www.xboxfront.de/news-2009-21012-F1_2010_Microsoft_Xbox_360.html


XboxFront: Hallo Adrian, Gratulation zum Sieg. Bist du auch privat Videospieler, oder ist das hier ein reiner PR-Auftritt?
Hi Adrian, congratulations on your win. Are you playing video games at home as well, or is this just some PR-activity?

Adrian Sutil: In diesem Fall handelt es sich natürlich um eine PR-Geschichte, aber Zuhause spiele ich schon regelmäßig, besonders online am PC. Meistens GTR, ein super Spiel, das mir wegen des hohen Simulationsgrads viel Spaß macht.
In this case it's of course a story of PR, but at home I play regularly, especially online on PC. Mostly GTR, a great game that brings me lots of enjoyment because of the high level of simulation.

XboxFront: Und wie gefällt dir F1 2010? Würdest du es eher unter die Kategorie Arcade oder Simulation einordnen?
And how do you feel about F1 2010? Would you classify it as an arcade or a simulation?

Adrian Sutil: Das Spiel macht auf jeden Fall Spaß, wobei ich es eher als Arcade-Spiel sehe, da es sich doch wesentlich anders anfühlt, wenn man in einem echten Formel 1 Wagen sitzt, wo die Reaktion auf Lenkbewegungen wesentlich direkter ist. Bei F1 2010 gibt es eine minimale Verzögerung.
The game is at least fun, and I see it more as an arcade-game, because it feels considerably different than when your taking place in a real Formula 1 car, where the reactions are much more directly on steering movements . In F1 2010 there's a minimum amount of lag.

XboxFront: Wann hast du denn angefangen Videogames zu spielen, und was war das erste Rennspiel, bzw. das erste Formel 1-Spiel das du gezockt hast?
When did you start playing computer games, and what was your first game, especially the first formula 1 game you've played?

Adrian Sutil: Wann genau das war weiß ich nicht mehr, aber ich kann mich daran erinnern, meine erste Rennspielerfahrung mit Toca World Touring Cars auf der PlayStation gemacht zu haben. Das war für damalige Verhältnisse ein klasse Spiel. Ich glaube es gab sogar ein integriertes Schadensmodell. Grand Prix 3 war dann auf dem PC das erste Formel 1 Spiel, das ich gespielt habe.
I don't know anymore exactly, but I can remember my first racegame experience with Toca World Touring cars (It doesn't exist, I guess it's Toca BTCC) on the Playstation. That was a great game at the time. I think there was even a damage model in it. Grand Prix 3 on pc was my first F1 game that I've played .

XboxFront: Vielen Dank für das Interview und das tolle Rennen, und viel Erfolg noch für die laufende und alle kommenden Saisons in der echten Formel 1!
Many thanks for this interview and the fun driving, and good luck in the current and coming seasons in the real Formula 1.

 

[David O Gorman]

Appreciate the translation

 

[Rob Simms]

It is interesting, that the xbox360 wheel was used in some of the videos with lag, were are the good wheels? I would think arcade feel using the 360 wheel or just xbox period.

 

[eddbru]

I wonder how this will compare to the BMW F1 in Live for Speed?

 

[Boby Kim]

The more and more i think about F1 2010...finaly i know what bothers me about F1 2010 and what i like about it. The thing i like about it is the other world of F1: Live your live ect. It will surely be a nice aspect of the game! Furthermore, the graphics look descent (with an S or without?) enough. I dont mind if its directX 9, 10 or 11, i dont have time to look at those details when racing. The main problem for me is the console boundry. For a PC player this means you're not able to set the game at your own hand. Simple put: TC - on/off. There is no Off, Low, medium, high. Im not able to choose for warmup laps or outlaps or a safetycar, Marshall flagsystems and choose with flags to be used in game.
They all left it out. And thats why i probably wont buy the game but stick with Simbins productions purely made for PC's.

 

[GAIAjohan]

I dont mind if its directX 9, 10 or 11, i dont have time to look at those details when racing. The main problem for me is the console boundry. For a PC player this means you're not able to set the game at your own hand. Simple put: TC - on/off. There is no Off, Low, medium, high. Im not able to choose for warmup laps or outlaps or a safetycar, Marshall flagsystems and choose with flags to be used in game.
They all left it out. And thats why i probably wont buy the game but stick with Simbins productions purely made for PC's.

Everything you mention has nothing to do with pc or console. It's just a choice from the developers.