Downshift protection removal

[Terry Rock]

How can I get rid of that blasted feature for good?
I've tried turning it off in menus and it still exist.
The darn thing does not work properly for me.
I can be in 5th gear going 60 or 70 mph, try to down-shift to select 4th gear and the gear won't select until I'm way below.
I absolutely hate that feature.

 

[=Fieldzy=]

I know first hand in the gt3 cars as I have tested this. If you left foot brake and hold throttle you can down shift when ever you like. I can down shift 2 gears hold 6000 rpm and it does it every time. Yes there is a fault. I use to heel toe and can't get shifts down as good as I can left foot braking now.

 

[Coffer]

If sim racers want better than mediocre games and fixes to those games, then sim racers also have to work in their analytical feedback.

Combined with your first paragraph, I sure hope you're not working in any field that is remotely close to software engineering because you wouldn't have much hope in the industry.

and don't experience any problems

Doesn't particularly make it impossible for you to miss issues such as this one, mind you, particularly if there's a level of pushing which you're comfortable doing that doesn't run into this issue. The double downshifting problem in particular, if it exists as it so far appears to me, is a natural result of someone pushing as close to the limit as possible, which will naturally also catch out those who go way above the limit due to not knowing better, but at the same time it's not unlikely for your testers to miss this due to the rare need to go into full quali mode when testing most issues.

in the latest version of AC I've added some additional debug info in the log specifically to investigate DSP inconsistencies... that should be reasonable even for the busiest of the busiest simracer out there.

Sounds good to me, I'll look into that the next time I specifically test for this. Good on you for making it naturally easier for people to test these things.

I actually didn't test for that, slipped my mind. Maybe the gear shift debouncing setting in the AC control options could play into this.

I did say that I did my testing with the debouncing intentionally set to zero. Normally it's at 50ms, which is the default, but putting it back at that value after testing with it at zero actually didn't make the failed double downshift happen any more often, which to me is a strong hint that it doesn't affect the issue.

And yeah, I know it's supposed to be very helpful - one quick look at various google results pertaining to people in pCars having issues due to its absence confirms that.

 

[Rob Every]

I am not a coder or anything so I have no real need to burrow down and work out exactly what the problem is. I am a gamer and a consumer, and this little feature is a bit of a daft niggle, it doesn't happen very often, but I can see no real reason for it to be there, if you shift down too early you buzz the engine or drop a valve surely? Not lock up because a small feature locks up the shifting mechanism and brakes and pretty much the whole car.

I feel sir you have looked at my username and made a judgement based on my criticism of other games in the past!!

I am perfectly happy with AC on the whole, there are not enough tracks and I do not like half finished games that then offer tons of DLC in packages to make more money.

But AC are tiny in comparison with most sim developers so it is to be expected, and by and large their product is very good in comparison with most rivals.

 

[StefanoCasillo]

it's there because it's a sim and since it's there on the real cars, it's there in the sim too. If you don't like sims, try some other game genre more suitable to your taste.

 

[Coffer]

it's there because it's a sim and since it's there on the real cars, it's there in the sim too. If you don't like sims, try some other game genre more suitable to your taste.

To be fair, without watching Massa's aforementioned pole lap I would've also not known that DSP is a real thing in real racing cars. It's not a difficult assumption to make.

 

[StefanoCasillo]

To be fair, without watching Massa's aforementioned pole lap I would've also not known that DSP is a real thing in real racing cars. It's not a difficult assumption to make.

it's pretty obvious that you are not alone
That is why we've added the audio and the visual indications in the last build.. a lot of people though it was a bug when it's actually a feature.

The important thing is to put the info out there, then it's up to the single user to understand it or not.

 

[Coffer]

it's pretty obvious that you are not alone
That is why we've added the audio and the visual indications in the last build.. a lot of people though it was a bug when it's actually a feature.

The important thing is to put the info out there, then it's up to the single user to understand it or not.

That does make me wonder though - it's perfectly possible that, now that there is a very clear cue when the DSP triggers, more people are noticing it and they are noticing it more often, especially when it's down to driver error, so there could be a strong psychological effect involved as well.

It certainly was the case for me - before, if it ever happened, most of the time I would forget about it by the end of the session, whereas now I have a much easier time remembering the times when it's triggered, whether it's from driver error or the possible double downshift failure bug, since I have something to readily associate these failed downshifts with now. This also applies to two of my friends who also play AC, whom I've heard complaining about failed downshifts way more often after the addition of the cue even though they, too, were occasionally running into failed downshifts before that.

 

[Takumi69]

I just had an issue with DSP yesterday. It was the special event with the McLaren at Barcelona GP. Almost everytime i tried to downshift the DSP was kicking in, even when trying to shift at very low revs. And i never had that issue before on that particular car.
I restarted the event and everything was back to normal (no DSP kicking in).
There must be something that messes up the DSP. I don´t know what it is, but there is clearly an issue if it goes away after a restart.

 

[Radu Oros]

I am not a coder or anything so I have no real need to burrow down and work out exactly what the problem is. I am a gamer and a consumer,

It doesn't take coding skills to describe properly the situation of your problem. Recording a gameplay video is even easier or more efficient than describing. But if you prefer to use words, say the car, the track, the corner, and say the gear and speed you were at that wouldn't let you downshift.
Kunos also said in this thread that by giving them the logs they can see what happened technically.

Here it is:

open a thread on the support forum attaching a log.txt file of the session in which the problem manifested itself, in the latest version of AC I've added some additional debug info in the log specifically to investigate DSP inconsistencies

 

[Amir Vodokotlic]

Honestly downshift protection is one of my favorite small features in AC.

It works as intended and if it takes just a bit of muscle memory to get used to it, if you are one slamming downshift with brake same time.

Brake first than downshift and you will never trigger downshift protection.

 

[MaXKiLLz911]

It does not work as intended. Many times it prevents downshifts at very low speeds when the previous five laps the car downshifted properly at much higher speeds. I wouldn't mind it if it worked properly 100% of the time.

 

[Amir Vodokotlic]

It does not work as intended. Many times it prevents downshifts at very low speeds when the previous five laps the car downshifted properly at much higher speeds. I wouldn't mind it if it worked properly 100% of the time.

What car?

I believe there is over rev function in downshift protection in AC.

So its possible there is various amount of over rev allowed ie 100-500 RPM.

Which might confuse people to say it doesn't work consistently.

 

[Ivgonsky]

it's there because it's a sim and since it's there on the real cars, it's there in the sim too. If you don't like sims, try some other game genre more suitable to your taste.

It´s there because it´s a sim, but in this sim it is poorly implements, like others items, for example v10 tyre model, an absolute garbage.
If AC is a "sim", why all the time is changing the physics and the cars behaviour? How many realities exist? When AC is most "sim"; the previous month, this month, or the next month?

 

[Radu Oros]

It´s there because it´s a sim, but in this sim it is poorly implements, like others items, for example v10 tyre model, an absolute garbage.
If AC is a "sim", why all the time is changing the physics and the cars behaviour? How many realities exist? When AC is most "sim"; the previous month, this month, or the next month?

The physics of the game have stayed pretty much the same since the beginning. What changed mostly was the tyre model by adding new characteristics that bring it closer to the behavior in real life, it changed inertia values of the cars, technical things in the camber and aero, and specific things like that. Over time they also added more physics modules due to new different cars in the game needing it, such as awd, hybrid systems, 4 wheel steering, active suspensions (for some Porsche road cars), and possibly other things I don't remember now. Maybe a dev can make a retrospective for you with better details.

Updating tyre model is not the same as changing game/car physics or data. In the simulation industry there isn't a tyre model that everyone follows, as such many racing game studios do their own investigations in the tyre simulation area. The method of simulation is often different from (sim) racing game to (sim) racing game, but the result tends to go in the same direction in terms of how you can drive the car.

 

[StefanoCasillo]

It´s there because it´s a sim, but in this sim it is poorly implements, like others items, for example v10 tyre model, an absolute garbage.
If AC is a "sim", why all the time is changing the physics and the cars behaviour? How many realities exist? When AC is most "sim"; the previous month, this month, or the next month?

Software and science improve every day... so ya, next version is going to be better than this one hopefully, if I come up with something new and better.
I guess you must be the only one in the world to be shocked by this pretty obvious fact.
Nobody forces you to play AC, we're all very lucky to live in a time where many options are available.. with so many great sims around you must have a pretty big chip on your shoulder to take your time to come here and insult my company's work.
I really don't see what are you so angry about.

 

[MarcG]

Software and science improve every day... so ya, next version is going to be better than this one hopefully, if I come up with something new and better.
I guess you must be the only one in the world to be shocked by this pretty obvious fact.
Nobody forces you to play AC, we're all very lucky to live in a time where many options are available.. with so many great sims around you must have a pretty big chip on your shoulder to take your time to come here and insult my company's work.
I really don't see what are you so angry about.

He/She is angry about change, angry about progression, angry that games don't "stand still", angry that he/she can't accept that Racing Sims these days need to evolve through time and take advantage of new technologies, new ideas, new data.
People find anything to be angry about which is odd and strange, the rest of us accept this change with open arms and look forward to the future, for we don't stand still...we're running forward!

 

[StefanoCasillo]

He/She is angry about change, angry about progression, angry that games don't "stand still", angry that he/she can't accept that Racing Sims these days need to evolve through time and take advantage of new technologies, new ideas, new data.

he should find a religion.. maybe he already has

 

[Andy_J]

Nobody forces you to play AC, we're all very lucky to live in a time where many options are available.. with so many great sims around you must have a pretty big chip on your shoulder to take your time to come here and insult my company's work.

I agree, he must a have a big chip on his shoulder but he still does not deserve any deriding from you just because you feel you can belittle someone once they have already spent their hard earned cash on your product.

 

[Radu Oros]

I agree, he must a have a big chip on his shoulder but he still does not deserve any deriding from you just because you feel you can belittle someone once they have already spent their hard earned cash on your product.

Why do you assume is hard earned cash?

"but in this sim it is poorly implements, like others items, for example v10 tyre model, an absolute garbage."

Why weren't you here when Ivgonsky said that. Or you only come when devs defend their game. Users can talk how they want but devs must always follow etiquette... they are people like anyone else and passionate about their game and effort put in their work.

Make a constructive post about the game's or simulation's flaws and you might also receive a constructive reply. Come all hostile and insulting, you'll likely hear things you don't like.

 

[Amir Vodokotlic]

and thread lock is incoming.


why can't we have nice things.