Depth of Field

Steve Worrell · May 23, 2017

Hi all.

I have just updated to dx11 beta. I was expecting to see those beautifully soft backgrounds that I saw in the screenshot previews, but i'm not. Am I missing something?

Thanks

Gijs van Elderen · May 23, 2017

https://www.studio-397.com/2017/05/open-beta-with-directx-11-and-virtual-reality-support/

Release Notes
We’ll start these release notes with a few hints on how to setup the DX11 graphics (regardless of VR):

In the same config window where you set your ‘Video Settings’ you have a drop down for post effect levels. Post effects provide you with some exciting new graphical options that look great, but as with any graphics option, need to be balanced against a good framerate. Therefore, we recommend you start at a conservative level (none or low), and if you have a graphics card of the latest generation, try the higher ones (medium or high). The highest setting (ultra) gives the best quality effects, but will also require a really fast graphics card. Note that even the “None” setting gives a better graphical quality than the DX9 graphics we had before! An overview of the levels:

None
Low = Glare Effects
Medium = Glare Effects and Depth of Field
High = All Effects at High Quality
Ultra = All Effects at Ultra Quality

Steve Worrell · May 23, 2017

Gijs van Elderen said:
https://www.studio-397.com/2017/05/open-beta-with-directx-11-and-virtual-reality-support/

Release Notes
We’ll start these release notes with a few hints on how to setup the DX11 graphics (regardless of VR):

In the same config window where you set your ‘Video Settings’ you have a drop down for post effect levels. Post effects provide you with some exciting new graphical options that look great, but as with any graphics option, need to be balanced against a good framerate. Therefore, we recommend you start at a conservative level (none or low), and if you have a graphics card of the latest generation, try the higher ones (medium or high). The highest setting (ultra) gives the best quality effects, but will also require a really fast graphics card. Note that even the “None” setting gives a better graphical quality than the DX9 graphics we had before! An overview of the levels:

None

Low = Glare Effects

Medium = Glare Effects and Depth of Field

High = All Effects at High Quality

Ultra = All Effects at Ultra Quality

Heyyyyyooooooooooooooooooo

Sven Hielscher · May 25, 2017

Sorry for capturing this thread. Just thought my question fits in this topic: Is the DOF effect controllable yet?
Just wondering because taking screenshots with manual camera positioning is not that easy now

Steve Worrell · May 25, 2017

Sven Hielscher said:
Sorry for capturing this thread. Just thought my question fits in this topic: Is the DOF effect controllable yet?
Just wondering because taking screenshots with manual camera positioning is not that easy now

Sorry I can't answer that question. I would post a new thread.

Gijs van Elderen · May 25, 2017

Sven Hielscher said:
Sorry for capturing this thread. Just thought my question fits in this topic: Is the DOF effect controllable yet?
Just wondering because taking screenshots with manual camera positioning is not that easy now

DOF depends on the focus point. Focus point in rF2 is the car in focus with normal camera's.
So basicly you want to controle the focus point with "free move". I don't think it's possible because it wasn't needed before. I guess it's something to put in the wish list on the Studio 397 forum.

tpw · May 27, 2017

I don't need to take screenshots since my replays are already slideshows if I run with DOF

In all seriousness though rF2's current DOF implementation is very very taxing (ie unusable on a GTX970 that eats DOF for breakfast with other titles), I hope it's something that improves as the beta progresses.

Gijs van Elderen · May 27, 2017

tpw said:
very very taxing (ie unusable on a GTX970

For DOF it's not your GPU,... Check your CPU.

tpw · May 27, 2017

Gijs van Elderen said:
For DOF it's not your GPU,... Check your CPU.

Thanks for the heads up Gijs. I'll amend my statement then

rF2's current DOF implementation is very very taxing (ie unusable on my system that eats DOF for breakfast with other titles).

Marcel Offermans · May 28, 2017

Well, for one you can set different levels of post processing, so if the highest levels are too slow for your system, try taking a step or two back. Without more details about your system and the settings you run it's hard to be more specific. Are you running triple screens with multiview?

tpw · May 28, 2017

Marcel Offermans said:
Well, for one you can set different levels of post processing, so if the highest levels are too slow for your system, try taking a step or two back. Without more details about your system and the settings you run it's hard to be more specific. Are you running triple screens with multiview?

Hi Marcel, thanks for the reply.

My system: i5 3.4GHz, GTX970 4GB, Win7 64, 16GB RAM, SSD, T300GTE, TH8R, T3PA-PRO, single 1080p monitor

This system is not top of the line by any means, but runs all my other driving titles (AMS, AC, pCARS, R3E, DR) at 60 FPS in cockpit and replay view with pretty much maxed settings, including DOF where applicable. In rF2 with everything maxed in game, and AA=2 it will pull a nice stable 60fps in cockpit view, but will struggle in trackside replay mode with PP Medium/High/Ultra, particularly if more than a few cars are in frame. The GPU load which will be sitting at 50-60% in cockpit will constantly spike to >95% in replay. In ultra mode trackside replays run at <20fps. I fully understand that there is additional load on the GPU with textures etc in replay mode.

With PP Off /Low it generally maintains 60fps, will occasionally stutter on the starting grid. To be fair though most of the games do this.

Since anything higher than low PP causes the framerate issues, I assume that DOF is the culprit.

Please don't construe this post as an overentitled whinge. I'm thrilled with the progress S397 have made with rF2 in such a short time and merely hope that PP (esp DOF) can be optimised further because for me at least it's not currently workable.

Gijs van Elderen · May 28, 2017

tpw said:
The GPU load which will be sitting at 50-60% in cockpit will constantly spike to >95% in replay.

Sorry to be nitpicker.

But are we taking about GPU or CPU load?

If it's CPU load: What you discribe is exactly what's happening on my side.

tpw · May 29, 2017

Gijs van Elderen said:
Sorry to be nitpicker.
But are we taking about GPU or CPU load?

If it's CPU load: What you discribe is exactly what's happening on my side.

Not nitpicking mate, it's good if we're all on the same page. On my system it's the GPU load that goes through the roof in replays with depth of field. I'll have a look at the CPU load and report back.

Marcel Offermans · May 29, 2017

tpw said:
Since anything higher than low PP causes the framerate issues, I assume that DOF is the culprit.

Let me explain a few things about these post processing settings.

First of all, and you've already noticed that, some views have more (different) effects enabled than others. In short, when you're looking at the game in "first person view" (in other words, when you're driving your car) we do not enable certain effects that you would only see through a TV camera. Depth of field is such an example, and there are a few more. Here we try to make each view as close to real life as possible, so effects that occur in real life because you are looking through a camera lens are only present for TV cameras.

Secondly, the higher you go with your post processing settings, the higher the quality will be of each rendered effect. So even though the number of effects remains pretty much the same (comparing for example the normal with the ultra settings) the quality at which they are rendered differs. Will you always see that? It depends. For some things you really have to study the image. For your information, we added the "ultra" setting to create the best possible image we can. In some cases that will slow down your system to a halt, so in those cases, look at this as a way to render screenshots and stick with lower settings for driving.

tpw · May 29, 2017

Marcel Offermans said:
Let me explain a few things about these post processing settings.

First of all, and you've already noticed that, some views have more (different) effects enabled than others. In short, when you're looking at the game in "first person view" (in other words, when you're driving your car) we do not enable certain effects that you would only see through a TV camera. Depth of field is such an example, and there are a few more. Here we try to make each view as close to real life as possible, so effects that occur in real life because you are looking through a camera lens are only present for TV cameras.

Secondly, the higher you go with your post processing settings, the higher the quality will be of each rendered effect. So even though the number of effects remains pretty much the same (comparing for example the normal with the ultra settings) the quality at which they are rendered differs. Will you always see that? It depends. For some things you really have to study the image. For your information, we added the "ultra" setting to create the best possible image we can. In some cases that will slow down your system to a halt, so in those cases, look at this as a way to render screenshots and stick with lower settings for driving.

Thank you very much for your reply Marcel, which is appreciated as always.

I have no doubt it was a herculean task to convert an ageing display engine to DX11 and to bolt on post processing too. And all while managing to largely maintain backwards compatibility. So I certainly never expected rF2 with PP to rival the performance of those engines built from the ground up for DX11.

It's great that you offer a range of PP quality/performance tradeoffs as explained. What is not so great is that currently many users without high end computers now have to decide ahead of time whether they're going to want smooth replays without DOF, or beautiful DOF replays fit for screenshots only, and set things up prior to launching the game.

So I will again ask if, as part of the ongoing DX11 optimisation process, there is room in S397's no doubt busy schedule to have a look at optimising DOF and other PP a little further.

hitm4k3r · May 29, 2017

Are you watching the replay in full screen mode, respectively extended? Because in the smaller garage view they have very bad performance and maximized they work like a charm. The reason I am asking is because your system specs are better than mine. You should easily be able to get such pics:

tpw · May 29, 2017

hitm4k3r said:
Are you watching the replay in full screen mode, respectively extended? Because in the smaller garage view they have very bad performance and maximized they work like a charm. The reason I am asking is because your system specs are better than mine. You should easily be able to get such pics:

I can get shots like yours (nice one by the way!) in full screen but the only way to get any kind of fluidity is to turn the textures down to low. To be honest I can deal with that trade off, rF2 still looks great even then.

I have to say though that even without PP the new lighting and tone mapping is just incredible.

Marcel Offermans · May 30, 2017

All I can say is that we're not done optimizing yet, so expect us to keep improving the engine (although it is reasonable to expect smaller steps going forward). Also, if you are on triple screens, an old issue is interfering a bit. With multiview on, because of the bezel compensation and other settings, the FOV is fixed. That has the side effect of certain cameras no longer being able to "zoom in" and that has another side effect on DOF (it is way too strong). That causes the framerate to drop in the monitor. We need more time to properly fix that issue, for now my advice would be to disable multiview if you are looking at shooting a video that involves external cameras.

SKYLINEMANNING · Aug 31, 2017

Hello,

Sorry to bring up an old topic but I am struggling with taking decent screenshots with the depth of field.

When I zoom in on the car in free mode the car becomes blurry and out of focus.